Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by evrett37, Oct 10, 2010.
Beta testers get ignored.
Well, no, it wouldn't... but the only ones who can do any denying are the mods anyway.
And I only mention age because the alternatives are ignorance or naivete, and age seems like the nicer explanation. I don't mean that as an insult, those just seem to be the only explanations for trying to lynch the CFC members who were involved in beta testing. As most everyone else mentioned, that accomplishes nothing due to the nature of a beta tester's role.
I can totally understand being frustrated or upset. (Not THAT upset, but whatever.) No problem there.
But do you have kids of your own? Sometimes when they're young, they get mad about something, but obviously they don't really know who to be mad at for sure. And they just want take their anger out on someone, and whomever is nearby will do - whether they have anything to do with the problem or not.
No it wasn't. If you read Soren Johnsons design philosophy, it was not that at all. His philosophy was to take out what was not fun in Civ III, and add fun elements.
I mean, look at all the civ series to 4, and you see the gradual changes. It's evolutionary.
Now look at the differences between 4 and 5. It's a whole different species.
Too bad evertt wasn't a beta tester, huh? He would have told them what's what!
Yep. Can be summed up quite simply: SJ>>>>>>>>>>>>>JS
Implementing gameplay ideas from beta testers isn't done for an obvious reason: the testers probably haven't got experience in the actual industry, and it is their opinion. If I was a beta tester, and asked for a new feature that 99%. I should stop coming to this Civ5 board, it always people ranting. I like Civ5, but it is a bit unstable right now, so I don't play for too long at a time cuz Iget bored without RFC.
1) Don't tell us what to do unless you have a decent amount of power here.
2) Firaxis decided to sell us this game, so it is there fault.
3) I won't be passing my Firaxis my "Bucks" until Civ V mac is out.
Evrett37, your ultimate wish is for a better CiV to have been released, right?
In this case we need betatesters to provide the developers with feedback. If you wish to have the betatesters provide the public with information, you will need the consent of the publisher.
You then propose to boycott the game to press the publisher into dropping the nda, since it is impossible to demand that the betatesters violate their nda, due to the potential economic damage they might incur.
If everyone collectively publicly boycotted the game before it was released, then it might actually work. However you are to late to do anything about CiV now, and I wish you luck getting us all to boycott CiVI due to lack of information from the betatesters...
I also have to say that putting a list of the betatesters from CiV is pointless, as they all had an nda.
So you might make a case that the publisher of CiVI would be pushed to accept dropping the nda, if you could start a regular movement in the community.
Therefore you could theoretically get information from betatesters, that you should wait to buy the game, because the betaversion they play is flawed, despite they having mentioned it.
It is very unlikely that this will happen, but I give you the benefit of doubt. If you should make a petition, to get rid of the nda, I will sign it out of solidarity.
Beta testers can only provide feedback. It was up to Firaxis to actually fix the stuff. Maybe the beta testers could have warned people not to buy the game early, but maybe they truly believe Firaxis will release good patches.
There's a difference between a flawed game and one that has minor issues. I'm fine with games being released with minor issues. However, Civ5 does not have minor issues... it is flawed, IMO.
Even though I mod myself, it's not our job to fix the games that are damn near broken after they're released. Also, see my above post. And why would the series have to end? Just delay the release a bit and fix the major problems.
Through lua changes and the upcoming release of the dll, it does mean that powerful changes can take place. To give an example, for Civ4, modders improved the AI dramatically (Firaxis ended up borrowing elements of it).
None of this changes my confusion on why it's better to not have the game. Why punish people who enjoy the game?
Firaxis doesn't really have any other viable franchises at the moment. A delay means they have to pay people for a longer time with no income. Look at the original post you responded to. The context was bankruptcy. If the option is to release a game that many enjoy, but doesn't live up to Civ4's standards or to risk Firaxis going under and either having no Civ games again or selling the franchise to someone else, what would you do? It's not like someone like Activision would handle the Civ franchise any better.
This is offtopic but picture an alternative world where Firaxis is owned by Blizzard. I bet there would be orcs and witch doctors running around in our civ.
I have no doubts that 2K games knew of the games shortcomings and since they needed the revenue they wouldnt let Firaxis push back the release date.
Not that i expect a actual result but i did file a report with the BBB. I feel like i have been lied to and mislead and i will not remain silent.
An attractive woman sits with her friends in a club. A suave looking fellow approaches...
"Hey! How'zit goin'?" he says.
"Fine" she replies.
"So I noticed you from across the room. Wow, you've got wonderful eyes."
"And, uh, you're dressed up real nice, too. You look really good in that dress."
"Let's just cut to the chase, shall we? You'll basically say anything that you think I want to hear in order to get my clothes off, right?"
"Uh... well... yeah..."
"Ok, I thought so. You work for 2K Games, don't you?"
The man scuttles away.
See? It's the very same thing as what has happened to us with Civ5. The marketing types will say anything to get you to buy, whether it's truthful or not. I've been in those clubs, I've dealt with these guys, and I saw this coming. 2K Elizabeth might be a nice lady in real life, and she might even be pretty, but there is no way she was getting under my skirt. Not a chance. I wasn't going to buy until the good folks here at CFC reviewed it honestly. Now the real reviews are starting to pour in, and what a mess this game is.
Wow, the game turned out to be a gift and I still feel burned.
No matter how hard you beta test a wolverine, it will never turn into a good pair of underwear.
Just be thankful that for the past couple of iterations of Civ it's been so moddable that you can have a perfectly good Civilization game, AND one in which orcs are running round...
...check out the Civ4 mods.
Mmmm, yes. There's nothing nicer than good, comfortable underwear.
Unless it's a new pair of shoes.
And a bag to match.
Good job Civ5 is already pants.
If you're English you'll get that.
Very good analogy...Only wish id thought about it that way 3 weeks ago id have a extra 50$ in my pocket.
But on the other hand i do expect a little bit more honesty and integrity. From now on im leading with my fist instead of my heart.
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