Alex Costa
Warlord
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I would put it actually further back 1929 and the start of the Great Depression.
Tech Tree Discussion
- Thread starter Vokarya
- Start date
I would put it actually further back 1929 and the start of the Great Depression.
Little Abigail
Chieftain
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No, that's still pretty firmly the Industrial era. No part of the Interbellum years really screams modern era to me.
End of WWII is as good a time as any to divide the eras as it basically was the end of an era and the beginning of new ones. The end of truly major wars and the beginning of the Atomic and Electronic eras.
End of WWII is as good a time as any to divide the eras as it basically was the end of an era and the beginning of new ones. The end of truly major wars and the beginning of the Atomic and Electronic eras.
And WWII set up the geopolitical and economic situation we remain in to this day, more so than anything. The only exception I can think of is 9/11, which changed the geopolitical situation greatly but didn't really effect the economic or technological trend.
Little Abigail
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Yeah, 9/11 and the collapse of the Soviet Union are the only really big geopolitical changes I can think of since the end of WWII.
I was working on the remap of the Industrial Era and I think I have Mass Transit in the wrong era. Right now, it's a very late Industrial tech, and I was going to move it to the Modern Era, but I think it might be better in the mid-Industrial Era.
The two options I can see for placing Mass Transit are:
The buildings unlocked at Mass Transit are:
The two options I can see for placing Mass Transit are:
- Mid-Industrial: Requires Civil Engineering + Motorized Transportation. Represents the London Underground, Chicago El, and other public transportation at the turn of the 20th century.
- Early Modern: Requires Communism + Manufacturing. Represents the Tokaido Shinkansen and other high-speed rail.
The buildings unlocked at Mass Transit are:
- Bus Station
- Highway
- Public Transportation
- Moonbean Coffee corporation
CIVPlayer8
Prince
Yes, the former one fits better I think.
Little Abigail
Chieftain
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Yeah, those buildings do point to the early 1900's rather than mid.
Okay then, Mass Transit will be in the mid-Industrial. I'm starting to work on changing the XML code now, but it's going to take a little time to get all the techs in the proper locations and costs, and then we may need to see if anything else needs to get modified. I have a few things already on the list.
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
I would have though the end of apartheid in South Africa and the start of the African Union/Council thing (no coffee yet this morning so brain not working) as well as the EU were all big geopolitical changes since the end of WWII.
Little Abigail
Chieftain
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I really wouldn't consider the African Union on that kinda level and I cannot for the life of me think of anything the EU has actually done.
This is coming from my American centric point of view, so please feel free to correct me.
This is coming from my American centric point of view, so please feel free to correct me.
soltari666
Chieftain
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Uhhhm, like becoming the EU?!?: Schengen agreement, common currency, common labour market, supra-national parliament without charging a 14 dollar entrance fee and fencing up a border, electrify the fence, dig a moat and put some crocos in it...
this is of course a eurocentric point of view with some hyperbole in it
as for africa, you could certainly make a point for decolonizing the entire frigging continent (yeah yeah, ethiopia), ending apartheid and the arab spring, mahgreb version.
Uhhhm, like becoming the EU?!?: Schengen agreement, common currency, common labour market, supra-national parliament without charging a 14 dollar entrance fee and fencing up a border, electrify the fence, dig a moat and put some crocos in it...
this is of course a eurocentric point of view with some hyperbole in it
as for africa, you could certainly make a point for decolonizing the entire frigging continent (yeah yeah, ethiopia), ending apartheid and the arab spring, mahgreb version.
The EU though doesn't have any real power (no executive arm), and little geopolitical clout anymore (debt crises, Euro issues), and really was only an extension of the NATO alliances that the US set up after WWII. I don't see how it qualifies as a major geopolitical event in the 20th century (speaking as an American of course, so this may be slanted).
That said, back on topic, What should the main defining things of the Modern Era be? I'd say it should focus on Modern Culture, Information Technology, and Modern Warfare as the three 'branches', sort of like the Medieval Era had three themes in it. Vokarya, do you have any ideas about that or are you going to be taking your break before doing the Modern era?
I'm going to be here until v28 comes out -- I'd like to do what I can until then, since it seems like an excellent stopping point, and it seems that the official release is a long ways off. I'll have a lot of free time over the holidays and a laptop with me, so I can probably do some work on the Modern -- I'm actually redoing the first quarter of the Modern Era as I figure out which side of the divide certain techs should be at.
Right now, I have the Modern Era starting with 3 technologies:
- Electronics
- Modern Physics
- Pop Art
Pop Art is the "tie up the art techs with a little bow" technology of the Modern Era (currently looking at requiring Animation + Modern Art + Plastics + Surrealism). It only leads to Mass Media, and Television is going to be more important to figuring out where MM gets placed, so the effect is going to be something like a fan of techs coming off of Electronics and Modern Physics; the techs that only require Electronics on one side, the techs that only require Modern Physics on the other, and techs that require both in between.
the european union is a unique project in human history. nations that fight against each other for tousands of years with its horible peak at world war 2, unite together in peace and left there hate against each other behind them. i mean just 60 years ago germany and france were arch-enemies, now they lead the union in peace together. every member is a democratic state with guaranteed human rights. two generations of europeans grow up in peace, and nobody has to fear hunger anymore. you can travell, work and life in every european country without visa. just 20 years ago we have the iron curtain that divides europe, now the inner european borders are open for free trade. strong regions substain weak ones to help them grow, best example is rieland that was the almhouse of europe and now they prosper. yes the EU has problems not just the euro crisis ore the massive depts (which are way smaler than the american ones even with a functional social system), we have to work for a even more united europe but keep in mind that it is a really slow procedure to transform independent states into something like the united states of europe ore what you will call it. but it is right, as long as we dont do this steps, europe wont have the big pover it could have.
soltari666
Chieftain
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Geopolitical power is military, economic, and political (as in, what the nation is willing to do, as opposed to it's capabilites). In that regard I will freely admit to being jaded about world events and history.
I finished the revamp of the Industrial Era. Here is how it will look:
View attachment 338707
Here's how it looks in chart form. I didn't include every "Leads to" tech, but there is at least one for every tech except Baha'i/Mormon (the religious techs) and Steampunk/Dieselpunk (the punk techs).
Paleontology went back to the Renaissance Era. The following techs were moved to the Modern Era:
A handful of techs moved backwards from the Modern Era to the Industrial:
I did make some very large changes to certain techs' locations. Medicine and all of its successor techs (including Psychology and everything derived from it) and Electricity and all of its successor techs got moved up quite a bit. Machine Tools moved from the end of the era almost to the beginning; historical machine tools are very early in the Industrial Era.
List of techs that got moved up by 3 columns or more:
List of techs that got moved down by 3 columns or more:
This is not yet on the SVN, as I'd like to ask about two major changes that I think should be made alongside this to avoid throwing off the game too much:
Two other minor unit prerequisite changes that I think should be made are:
There's probably more changes that will need to be made, but I think this will cover it for now. Let me know if there's anything else that needs adjusting.
View attachment 338707
Here's how it looks in chart form. I didn't include every "Leads to" tech, but there is at least one for every tech except Baha'i/Mormon (the religious techs) and Steampunk/Dieselpunk (the punk techs).
Spoiler :
Paleontology went back to the Renaissance Era. The following techs were moved to the Modern Era:
- Modern Physics (requirements unchanged)
- Electronics (requirements unchanged)
- Atompunk (requirements unchanged)
- Long-Range Forecasting (now also requires Computers)
- Deep Sea Exploration (now also requires Manufacturing)
- Pop Art (now also requires Consumerism and Surrealism)
- Solar Power (requirements unchanged)
A handful of techs moved backwards from the Modern Era to the Industrial:
- Applied Economics (prerequisites reduced to just Consumerism)
- Naval Aviation (now requires Aviation + Mechanized Warfare)
- Radar (now requires just Sonar)
I did make some very large changes to certain techs' locations. Medicine and all of its successor techs (including Psychology and everything derived from it) and Electricity and all of its successor techs got moved up quite a bit. Machine Tools moved from the end of the era almost to the beginning; historical machine tools are very early in the Industrial Era.
List of techs that got moved up by 3 columns or more:
Spoiler :
List of techs that got moved down by 3 columns or more:
Spoiler :
This is not yet on the SVN, as I'd like to ask about two major changes that I think should be made alongside this to avoid throwing off the game too much:
- Parts Plant: As was noted before, this is important to several Industrial buildings, and Advanced Metallurgy is moved up so it's no longer a chokepoint for the late Industrial Era (AM is still required for Aviation and Electronics, so it's still pretty important but doesn't have a stranglehold). I suggest moving it to Machine Tools and adding Iron to the list of potential metal prerequisites, as it now predates the Steel tech. The cost will have to be adjusted and I think the yields should be dialed down somewhat as well.
- Railroad improvement: This also predates the Steel tech. I suggest changing the metal requirement from Steel to Iron.
Two other minor unit prerequisite changes that I think should be made are:
- Jeep: This should be available before the end of the Industrial Era. I suggest moving this to Mechanized Warfare (Machine Tools is too early in the era, Electronics is now Modern Era, and Automatic Weapons is required for Mechanized Warfare)
- A-Bomb: Again, I think this should be available before the end of the Industrial as the first Doomsday unit. I suggest moving this unit from Aerodynamics (which is Modern Era) to Aviation + Fission (which are on the same column, so not redundant).
There's probably more changes that will need to be made, but I think this will cover it for now. Let me know if there's anything else that needs adjusting.
strategyonly
C2C Supreme Commander
Now this is very ver y very impressive work, very professional looking.
Is it just me or when looking at the actual Tech Tree, looking at Flight/Aviation stuff near the bottom, look weird, BUT i like it, jut sayin' when its used to being on the top, i like very much
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
@Vokarya
Is there a way so Modern and Industrial techs are not in the same column?
Is there a way so Modern and Industrial techs are not in the same column?
OK, I think I see what happened. Applied Economics was supposed to be ERA_INDUSTRIAL, not ERA_MODERN. I must have forgotten to switch it over.
Is there another place where there's a Modern tech? Electronics, Modern Physics, and Pop Art are the gateway techs to the Modern Era. Column X68 is now the first column of the Modern Era, instead of the last column of the Industrial Era.
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