Tectonic Scanner

[ConanTLibrarian]

Hey guys,

In some of the recent "100 turns" videos, I noticed something interesting. We all know that the bonus of the tectonic scanner is that it allows you to see petrol, geothermal, and titanium before actually researching the corresponding tech. I've seen threads talking about the various perks from taking this bonus, such as either rushing or delaying actually researching the corresponding techs, but I'm curious about another perk: In some of the gameplay videos, it seems that you can immediately improve titanium, as it only requires a mine? Not only this, but strategic resources typically give some sort of base bonus on the tile's yield (ex, unimproved iron still gives +1). If I am correct in these things, it seems to further increase the value of the tectonic scanner as a starting bonus (which already seemed pretty strong when compared to some of the others, I'm looking at you fusion reactor). Welp, I'm curious on your opinions, am I correct, or did I see the videos incorrecty?

This means so far, favorite ship bonuses are tectonic scanner & retrograde thrusters.

 

[gunnergoz]

Yet if you watch the latest pre-release video, Pete did exactly that and the seed bonus was wasted because he found none of those resources anywhere near his landing area.

My point is not that it is useless, but merely that it is a gamble and you risk having nothing for your expenditure...or a lot, who knows. "Are you feeling lucky, Punk?"

 

[MadDjinn]

Yet if you watch the latest pre-release video, Pete did exactly that and the seed bonus was wasted because he found none of those resources anywhere near his landing area.

My point is not that it is useless, but merely that it is a gamble and you risk having nothing for your expenditure...or a lot, who knows. "Are you feeling lucky, Punk?"

but, you know where they are and are not, so you can go settle where you need to to get them.

Geothermal being the only 'real' important one in the mix (tech cost and path wise).

 

[ConanTLibrarian]

Yet if you watch the latest pre-release video, Pete did exactly that and the seed bonus was wasted because he found none of those resources anywhere near his landing area.

My point is not that it is useless, but merely that it is a gamble and you risk having nothing for your expenditure...or a lot, who knows. "Are you feeling lucky, Punk?"

You have an excellent point, that luck will certainly be a factor. What I propose, however, is that even if there is no petrol/titanium/geothermal in your starting area:

1. It will help with expansion choices, as you'll know where to get said resources (which are kind of important from what I've read/seen).

2. You can therefore delay researching those techs for more usefull things. Think of the alternative, "I wonder if I have any of this stuff nearby?" Researches three different techs. "Nope, nope, nope", meh, I could've researched a few other things instead which might've helped me more (in the immediate future, that is)...

Oh, and MadDjin, my essential thought is, like "Purity lvl 1 OP", I'm starting to feel that "Tectonic Scanner OP"

 

[gunnergoz]

Well, perhaps that's putting the cart in front of the horse since it seems that many players will opt to gun for an affinity that is readily supported by what they have on hand at their first base or two, especially if the game shows signs it is going to be really competitive. So if I land and see a lot of Floatstone, for instance, I already know that I've got an early leg up on the affinity (Purity IIRC) that can most readily exploit it.

 

[GoodSarmatian]

Don't diss the fusion reactor. Get a couple of resource pods, clear an alien nest or two, and you can buy a soldier/explorer/worker/relic. Early extra yields are a nice bonus, but you can reveal titanium or petroleum with your first tech.

 

[gunnergoz]

Yes, extra energy is never a bad thing. I recall one preview game video where the player was floating in extra energy credits early on and used them to buy a unit at an opportune time. So yeah, it too is a fairly safe bet to go with...money in the bank, you could say.

 

[ConanTLibrarian]

Money in the bank, good phrase. I suppose you have a point that the extra energy can give your colony a jump start (pun intended ) I also see what MadDjin and the others mean that the techs for petrol and titanium are going to be pretty common, and that you're only "saving research" on the geothermal tech potentially. I see that as a nice help, but yeah, perhaps I underestimated the value of 100 energy (which at first glance didn't seem like much to me). I have some weird thing in my mind like "taking the energy is a trap, the other options must be better somehow, right?". Thankfully, the point behind BE is trying a lot of different combinations, so I look forward to trying all sorts of different seeding loadouts (and echo the request of other fans for a "random seeding loadout" button).

 

[Alkyon]

Tectonic Scanner's pretty strong as said, but I don't think it's "overpowered" compared to the rest.

Coastal Surveyor outright reveals all coast tiles. This not only lets the player know where the boundaries of land masses are for more efficient early scouting for more resource pods, but also lets the player immediately know if or where any large clumps of algea or coral are.

Retrograde Thrusters lets the player make sure they have the best starting spot. Of course Murphy's Law dictates that such a prime capital location being outside of the normal landing range will only be found when you took something else instead.

Fusion Reactor leads to an early purchase, which can save 10 or more turns of your capital's vital production queue.

Finally Lifeform Sensor sounds like it would be primarily good for checking if your start will be Harmony or not until you realize how absolutely deadly the flora, fauna and mega-fauna on Planet are. Knowing where all the alien nests are lets the player know where the most dangerous areas on the planet are and therefore are far, far less likely to run your early explorers and soldiers into a bad situation. Also you get to snigger in delight when the AI drops down practically on an alien nest.

 

[bhavv]

The 100 energy will put you close to an early rush buy, so its like having an extra unit or building for free early on.

 

[motku]

Yet if you watch the latest pre-release video, Pete did exactly that and the seed bonus was wasted because he found none of those resources anywhere near his landing area.

My point is not that it is useless, but merely that it is a gamble and you risk having nothing for your expenditure...or a lot, who knows. "Are you feeling lucky, Punk?"

I think in one way, yes, it was indeed wasted. But consider that since he still hadn't seen much of these resources around him he was able to work on other techs instead of those that reveal the resources. So, even his knowledge of nothing helped him make other choices.

 

[gunnergoz]

I think in one way, yes, it was indeed wasted. But consider that since he still hadn't seen much of these resources around him he was able to work on other techs instead of those that reveal the resources. So, even his knowledge of nothing helped him make other choices.

I'd call that making lemonade when you're given lemons.

 

[Manannan]

As per most things Civ it's probably largely going to come down to circumstance. If I intend to go wide on a non-archipelago (whatever it's called in BE anyway) map I'd think tectonic scanner would be a must have, but if I'm trying to play a tall, capital city intensive game you can't convince me not to take retrograde thrusters instead. While I'd argue that fusion reactor and lifeform scanner seem underwhelming I feel the other 3 bonuses look well balanced and generally useful for most games.

 

[Rexfelis69]

As was noted on another thread about REXing, knowing where to plant your 2nd and third city is helped quite a bit by knowing where these resources are. I am already a fan of Tectonic scanners and I have yet to play the game.

 

[Cyon]

Maybe 100 energy is a bit to little, maybe 150 would be more appropriate since most early stuff are more expensive to buy than CiV, a scout costs 140 gold, but a explorer 200 energy, a warrior costs 200 gold - a soldier 240 energy. 150 is enough to boy a explorer after finding one 60 energy pod.

I also hope that the life form scanner will reveal all new nests that pop up because if it doesn't it also seems weak compared to the tectonic scanner. The retrograde should have one sight radius more as well.

 

[OldEarthRelic]

There's a "best cargo" thread, with a poll.

 

[GAGA Extrem]

Regarding the Fusion Reactor: I wonder if BE will scale the buyout cost of an item with the already invested hammers (CIV4 style).
If that was the case the 100 energy bonus could be a lot more useful to save a few turns on crucial stuff.

 

[gunnergoz]

Yeah, as it is 100 Energy credits is about half the cost of buying a low level unit IIRC. It is a pretty small bonus, compared to a completed building, soldier or worker upon landing. I suspect it will be subject to change.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Yeah, as it is 100 Energy credits is about half the cost of buying a low level unit IIRC. It is a pretty small bonus, compared to a completed building, soldier or worker upon landing. I suspect it will be subject to change.

Well, just remember you don't compare it to a completed worker, soldier, building, or pop, or tech.

You compare it to knowledge of coastlines, early resource visibility, more flexible first city placement, or knowledge of alien life.

Based on that it might be worthwhile

(Just like you don't compare it to 3 gold per turn per city..because you can have both)


I do think it may need to be balanced, but it is the Easiest ability to balance
UP: make it 110, 115, 150, 1500, etc.
OP: make it 95, 80, 50, 2, etc.

 

[gunnergoz]

Well, just remember you don't compare it to a completed worker, soldier, building, or pop, or tech.

You compare it to knowledge of coastlines, early resource visibility, more flexible first city placement, or knowledge of alien life.

Based on that it might be worthwhile

(Just like you don't compare it to 3 gold per turn per city..because you can have both)


I do think it may need to be balanced, but it is the Easiest ability to balance
UP: make it 110, 115, 150, 1500, etc.
OP: make it 95, 80, 50, 2, etc.

You are correct of course, I was looking at the wrong seed boost and accidentally mixed Cargo and Spacecraft elements.