TGOMTG Conquest Class Challenge (C3C)

Somewhere along in there we betrayed the Persians but for the life of me I can't remember when.

Last deal we had with them was an MA against Germany and as far as I can remember it ended in its own time.

Near as I can reconstruct something happened between 1050 and 1150AD that made X-man feel betrayed....after some painful log reading and save loading identified the source of the problem.

When we declared on the Persian in 1060 there was still an RoP in place that had five or so turns to run. OOPS!

Now we can practice extortion as well as theft....because even with a trashed trading rep you can still do cash for resource deals or gpt for technology as long as you do it by threatening war. Means you have a twenty turn stretch where the trading window is closed but with three nations on the map that's one every seven or so if you can time them right. About the same pace as thievery with our current income.

SW suggested a good exercise, so I would like everyone to pick up the save and do a thorough overhaul of the citizen assignments and submit the save. Then we can pick the one to go on with based on three criteria:

1) Cash flow
2) Productivity
3) Waste reduction - ie shield over-runs on builds.

I still remember the game where I discovered the value of the cop and the CE. There was something immensely satisfying about taking 60 cities and getting at least half of them perfectly trimmed with almost zero losses to waste or over run. Communism was the government, Romans the nation.

Look up Bede01 in its latter stages if you want to see the pictures.

How about submitting something tomorrow, Monday July 4th, and then the mailguy can take it from there.
 
Bede said:
Near as I can reconstruct something happened between 1050 and 1150AD that made X-man feel betrayed....after some painful log reading and save loading identified the source of the problem.

When we declared on the Persian in 1060 there was still an RoP in place that had five or so turns to run. OOPS!
Hmz, that was my turnset... I trashed yet another games rep... Sorry... Seems to be a bad habbit I cannot shake or something. Atleast this time I did not do it Intentionaly...

Dont know if I can get the MM in by tonight...Will try...
 
Like I said, having a bad rep will give us a chance to hone our extortion skills, another technique worth having.
 
Okay I managed to finish as much as I can handle. Sorry SW, I only made it to +777 gpt. Sumer and Agade suck, especially Agade! To be honest I messed with Sumer for about 15 minutes the first day I tried this (it was my first attempt at MM this game, as in first city) and I couldn't get it so I just shut the game down. Today I just skipped over Sumer and Agade.

Oh well, here it is. Hopefully namliaM managed to do a much better job than me. :)
 
I just got home from work and its 10pm (started 7am) and gota be back there at 7 again :( No civ-ing today

I have started, yesterday on mm-ing.... and would like to finish... but I can understand if you give me a skip and push onward...

I will probably not be able to play till Friday, maybe a little Wednesday and a little Thursday but dont count on it...

RL is a b*tch :cry:
 
Okay. I'll take it forward tonight from Methos's save.

Couple of comments:

We were about two techs early on the revolt as Espionage and Industrialzation would have been huge if we could have cash rushed factories.

But, since it is all about cash and Communism is a real cash generator, no harm done, just going to make it tougher to get those factories up.

Will steal Electricity but I think I would rather have factories than electric lights. 'Cause Communists follow the "Mushroom Theory of Management": keep 'em in the dark and feed 'em manure".
 
Bede said:
Will steal Electricity but I think I would rather have factories than electric lights. 'Cause Communists follow the "Mushroom Theory of Management": keep 'em in the dark and feed 'em manure".
words of wisdom from the cleric in black :lol:
 
A bright, county fair day on the beach at Cape Cod. Watching the war on the Asian landmass and watching my friend Osman take it on the chin. Have to do something about that. But as the sun went down I couldn't read and I remembered something about electricity bringing light. So off into the shadows I slipped and picked the bearded one's pocket for the keys to the powerplant.

Then I sold it around for all the money and started irrigating the thirsty grasslands in the old Greco-Saxon lands.

That was the easy part. Korea learned Industrialization and the cloak slipped, Gweeto got caught with his hands in Wang's robes and so began World War I. Captured the Korean coal town on our continent which triggered the Babylonian Protection Pact, so I hired X-man to do some fighting for us against Hammirabi, then made an alliance with Osman against the Koreans.

Sold Osman a bunch of luxuries for cash (somehow he didn't know about our perfidious treatment of Xerxes) then sold him Electricity for the rest of his stash. Then renegotiated the Peace Treaty with Persia so I could get his cash and some per turn money for some dyes.

The strategy in the Korean War is pillage our way southward with some cavalry, a knight army, some cannon and rifles. Not really interested in trying to capture and hold ground over there, and if I did I would give it to Osman if I tought he could defend it. I think I boobed the landing in Korea as I should have waited for the army to cvoer the landing force. We are going to lose a couple of rifles

The strategy for Babylon is much different. He lacks railroads so his counters will be without force. I leave the towns behind the lines, not reachable by cavalry in one from within the Bab borders, undefended and heavily defend the border towns, then run a knight army with cannon and cavalry and some rifles in a sweep across the western flank, Objective Nineveh. The Babylonian generals take the bait and send their troops over the mountain walls into the plains behind Ellipi and Portland while the knights march down the mountains behind them to Nineveh.

TGOMTG_1600.jpg


There have been harassing attacks on the German island. There are galleons being set up to shift troops over there from Nuremberg. Keep one in Nuremberg for a shuttle to Richmond, one in Dortmund and another in Salzburg. The Shuttle Route is Nurmemburg-Richmond, oveland to Salzburg then Salzburg to New Berlin.

I was able to buy factories from Osman for 88gpt and some cash by extorting the Peace Treaty. (Does everyone know how to haggle the peace deal?) I could have bought it for all cash but preferred to give him some gold in the deal, maybe enough to keep his research machine running.

Factories are all being built in the key towns making more than 15 unwasted shields. Our targets are 27, 30, 45 for cavalry and Infantry in two to three turns when we get Replaceable Parts.

@Methos, your town set up was okay, but some adjustment was needed for best production numbers. Your targets werre 20 and 27 and were easily achieved. I think there are 5 cities now at 27 and another handful at 20. It did take some policemen and the services of the native worker force to get there. SO I pulled all the natives back from jungle whacking and sent them city to city mining and railroading and irrigating where needed.

Policemen are your friends. Use them instead of tax collectors as they have an effect on both shields and gold. Use the cops to get the maximum shields and then assign tax collectors after that. We may want to buy Sanitation for the maximum impact of specialists but be careful where you put the hospitals. You really need to be long food with at least one food bonus to make them really effective.

Don't forget that Communism is an MP effective government, so use them, but use the entertainment budget also. We still have a few growthy towns and all the military is at the front lines. I lost control of Zohak because I pulled the garrison to the front. It still needs one more MP.

When clearing jungle you have a choice of tactics and here is mine. Since I consider it a low priority task I use slaves instead of natives. I road the field to be cleared first (takes 18 slaves) then pile another 30 in when the road is done. While the 18 are roading the thirty are railing and mining/irrigating other fields. Once we learn Replaceable Parts these numbers will be cut in half.

I tried to segregate the natives and slaves, keeping the natives for the core trimming and some high priority roads in the the battle zones, using the slaves elsewhere.

The northern towns are good sources for both workers and combat settlers. I have not been keeping any Babylonian towns and the capture of Nineveh is going to take some special handling because of the flipping thing.

Make it a killing ground. Capture, then retreat to the SoD. Let the Babyonians retake it, then hit them again. The lack a complete rail net so can't reinforce effectively. While oscillating back and forth like that fill in the cultural borders on the flanks. Once Eulbar and Ashur are gone and we have towns in that area we should be able to hold it. Pack the towns in down there. The key is to have as many of the home fields to the north, west and east of Nineveh in our cultural control.

This tactic will not work in a Republic government!!

Take a look at how I assigned policeman and tax collectors.

There are settlers looking for homes on the German island, one west of Portland, and another above the Babylonian plain.

You've got some elites out there so look for them after wounding any attackers with cannon,
 
soul_warrior said:
that means i've got it. again.
do br it :D

Huh? I thought it was my turn? I'm so confused. :confused:

Didn't Bede take namliaM's place? Either way, just let me know when I'm up again.

Bede said:
(Does everyone know how to haggle the peace deal?)

No.

Do you mean rehaggle the deal after the 20 turns is up? Or during the 20 turns of the peace deal? If you are talking about to end the war than yes, I do that all the time. The old pointy-stick method.

Bede said:
We may want to buy Sanitation for the maximum impact of specialists

How does Sanitation affect specialists?
 
Sanitation means you can build Hospitals. Building hospitals means your citys can grow past 12, more people means more everything (including specialists)

Tho for the life of me I cannot see Why we would have a lot of specialists while in Communism, Corruption thus production is same everywhere. Just build them city's up....???
 
ok, i might have been wrong about my placing.
any one wants it, you can take it.
or Bede could post a current roster.

specialist mean more CE's, which adds 2 uncorrupted shields to non military builds.
think about a shield poor, fully irrigated city. it can hire 3,5 CE's and get that dral done that much faster, leaving room later for quicker military builds.
or more taxmen. which explains itself.
or beakerheads - which we arent using :D
 
namliaM said:
Tho for the life of me I cannot see Why we would have a lot of specialists while in Communism, Corruption thus production is same everywhere. Just build them city's up....???

Cops and engineers are useful in all governments. There is an article in the War Academy that explains it in detail "The Role of the Specialist Citizens" authored by the TGOMTG.

Briefly, you use engineers in food rich, shield poor locations to build commerce multipliers. They are really useful in Communism because cash rushing is not an option. Policemen are useful to fine tune productivity. You can pick up several shields for each cop in a city with a factory/power plant. I use them to fine tune production, getting to those magic numbers that minimize overruns.

Specialists are also a productive way to manage contentment. Specialists do not join in riots, so a cop or CE is a useful way to avoid raising the entertainment budget and getting productivity rather than yuks.

Specialists are the key to maximizing the return on production, commerce and science multiplier buildings in governments that do not get a commercial bonus. To use them effectively you need to consider the marginal benefit. Policeman cost one gold but can generate as many as three shields or three gold or three beakers if the multiplier buildings are in place. Scientists should only be used in towns that generate less than seven net gold and do not have libraries. Each engineer adds two shields to all building projects, not military.

Edit for roster:

namliaM - up
Methos - on deck
sw - hold your horses, the war will still be there when you get it
Bede - started WWI
 
Sorry did not notice the new roster till today. Will try to play ASAP.

As for the specialists. I understand their need in eg. Republic... You have 90% corrupt towns, Irrigate and rail everything there is, then create whatever specialist to get the needed things (shields/gold/beakers).

However in Commi all towns are equal (more or less) and certainly none are 90% corrupt. So why have fully irrigated lands? Why not mine some of them lands? Sure it costs food, but it gains base shields? Good examples are them previous persian city's...

And if Irrigating is still the best sting in Commi, then why the mining around WDC? and our other previous core city's? After all, our entire civ now is one big core?!
 
Mine away if you can get net plus shields. That is usually most effective when the field produces +1 shield without a mine: BG's. hills, mountains, coal and oil fields.
 
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