The European Project: the future of the EU.

The NDP has *always* been more progressive than the Liberals, @warpus. They didn't "change" to be that way in the past five to ten years. Paining them as a purely pro-worker party that lost its way by embracing minority rights or environmental protection is a wild mischaracterization.

Not to say the drifting apart didn't happen, but it had precious little to do with the NDP suddenly becoming progressive, and more with (as you note) (some) workers increasingly prioritizing socially conservative policies over pro-labor ones.

My point is moreso that being pro-worker used to be the main meat of what they were all about, that's why the unions usually support them. Being progressive is naturally an extension of that, at least IMO. I don't necessarily think they became more progressive, maybe I misworded some of that - but currently the meat of what they are all about is not a pro-worker party. That's what I miss and I believe that's what a lot of other voters miss about them as well. When their leaders go up and give a speech, their speeches no longer have a pro-worker focus. It's like they are trying to out-Liberal the Liberals at being Liberal instead. We already have a Liberal party, we don't need another one. Yes, there were many other variables at play in this election, and I do hope they bounce back as a pro-worker party at some point in the future, as the city I live in elects a high % of NDP candidates, at least provincially, and that's who I usually vote for in those elections.

I'm not as familiar with European politics, but it seems a couple other previously pro-worker parties have gone down the same road. A lot of workers and those looking for work out there feel abandoned and I believe this is a part of the reason why. They need a party that puts pro-worker ideals above everything else, something those voters could rally behind.
 
Considering the headway made by pro-private services in the last few decades, I think that we're today with less public services than in the 80s, being slowly replaced with pay-for-service companies.
I know that here at least, healthcare accessibility has gone down and people tend to have to drive to larger towns/cities because the smaller, local countryside hospital/maternities have been closed, and there is more overwork for health workers.
Same for railways, the amount of local train stations has been significantly reduced.
This would naturally vary country by country... and I would hazard a guess that due to advances in medical science, accessibility has gone down while overall quality has improved - each small town probably can not afford expensive tech.
Still, I think my overarching point remains valid.

Few generations ago, Bob could feel like a relative success, because he was alive - unlike that loser Bill, who starved to death last winter. These days Bob and Bill are on the dole (and morbidly obese), but both of them are angry and resentful, because both feel like losers.

Few generations ago, parents would appreciate doctors who helped 3 of their 6 kids survive childhood.
These days, parents believe doctors are in on a global conspiracy, because one of their 3 kids developed a fever after their polio shot.

Etc.
 
Considering the headway made by pro-private services in the last few decades, I think that we're today with less public services than in the 80s, being slowly replaced with pay-for-service companies.
I know that here at least, healthcare accessibility has gone down and people tend to have to drive to larger towns/cities because the smaller, local countryside hospital/maternities have been closed, and there is more overwork for health workers.
Same for railways, the amount of local train stations has been significantly reduced.

Where is the "here at least".
 
Now we plainly see by this picture that the BE leadership priorities are clearly not the poor workers or other struggling compatriots, like poor elderly, children, young adults that can't get a house and so on. Good riddance.
...
People are joking she has been elected by the Gaza circle.

That is a lie and you know it. BE talked a lot, and made many specific proposals, to adress those problems. As a small party they got nowwhere. The liberal majority wants asset prices, which partyu members hold, to keep appreciating in valye. The past (and future) government by PSD legislated with a view to keep inflating housing prices, and to keep increasing rent extraction againts the population in health care, etc. So did the other liberal party, PS.

The party you obviously support, Chega (the so-called "far right") are financed by the local oligarchs and serve the purpose of capturing the "protest votes" against the liberals and neutralize them politically. Prevent them going to the leftists who would actually be dangerous to the interests of thsoe eg«ngaging in state-sponsored rent extraction againts the population. Can't say that the oligarchs here don't learn from their european colleagues. And american. They do.

BE can be charged with being politically inept. That's the worst change against them. Same as Corbyn, Melenchon, etc. They can't ride populism, and can't face, actually discussm, and resolve the stupid contradictions within their political programmes. Immigration, here and everywhere in the "west", has been used as a weapon by the oligarchs. The left keeps failing to deal with the issue.
 
That is a lie and you know it. BE talked a lot, and made many specific proposals, to adress those problems. As a small party they got nowwhere. The liberal majority wants asset prices, which partyu members hold, to keep appreciating in valye. The past (and future) government by PSD legislated with a view to keep inflating housing prices, and to keep increasing rent extraction againts the population in health care, etc. So did the other liberal party, PS.

The party you obviously support, Chega (the so-called "far right") are financed by the local oligarchs and serve the purpose of capturing the "protest votes" against the liberals and neutralize them politically. Prevent them going to the leftists who would actually be dangerous to the interests of thsoe eg«ngaging in state-sponsored rent extraction againts the population. Can't say that the oligarchs here don't learn from their european colleagues. And american. They do.

BE can be charged with being politically inept. That's the worst change against them. Same as Corbyn, Melenchon, etc. They can't ride populism, and can't face, actually discussm, and resolve the stupid contradictions within their political programmes. Immigration, here and everywhere in the "west", has been used as a weapon by the oligarchs. The left keeps failing to deal with the issue.
You know nothing about Portuguese politics Jon Snow!
As a caviar left party, their rhetoric for solving blue coloured workers problems was always unhinged from reality and inefficient, but they came as a fresh party after our own Communist Party (PCP) so they were in trend for some time.
Then BE realised these struggling workers also deemed their proposals as unhinged from reality and inefficient, so they went for the new fashionable SJW and rainbow stuff and Palestine VS Israel and so forth and so on. So they lost their base while PCP still keeps theirs because however unfeasible their proposals are these are still focused on struggling workers.
 

Muslim Brotherhood-linked groups tried to influence EU: Report​

French authorities allege the Islamist group has gone to great lengths to push its fundamentalist agenda in France and throughout Europe.

Former Egyptian President Mohamed Morsi death aftermath

The report alleged that the Muslim Brotherhood waged parts of its influence campaign under the guise of combatting Islamophobia. | Andre Pain/EPA

PARIS — A bombshell report from the French authorities alleges that organizations with links to the Muslim Brotherhood have been attempting to influence European Union institutions through “significant lobbying activities.”

A version of the document seen by POLITICO before its official publication says the Islamist group’s supposed ideological allies sought to push Brussels to criminalize blasphemy and promote a “singular” vision of religious freedom that clashes with France’s strict model of a secular state that protects both freedom of religion and freedom from religion. The European Parliament and MEPs were “particularly targeted,” the report said.

The French Ministry of the Interior had been expected to release a sanitized version of the document, which would not include the names of sources that could be endangered by its release and mentions of ongoing legal cases, on Wednesday after it was discussed during a national security council meeting chaired by French President Emmanuel Macron.
Following the meeting, Macron’s office said the report would be released by the end of the week.

The version of the report seen by POLITICO alleges that the Muslim Brotherhood, which was founded more than 100 years ago in Egypt with the aim of creating a state ruled by Islamic law, is pushing its agenda via several pan-European organizations that share the group’s ideology and have received money from Qatar and Kuwait, states known to fund both Muslim and Islamist causes overseas.

Among the organizations listed were the Council of European Muslims (CEM) and the Forum of European Muslim Youth and Student Organisations (FEMYSO). The report claimed that members of the Brotherhood’s inner circle were members of CEM and that FEMYSO was used as a “training structure” for Muslim Brotherhood officials.

FEMYSO in a statement strongly denied the allegations while CEM did not immediately respond to POLITICO’s request for comment.

The reports’ findings, which are based on dozens of interviews with academics, Muslim leaders and intelligence officers, are similar to those of a government review published in the United Kingdom a decade ago.

The report alleged that the Muslim Brotherhood waged parts of its influence campaign under the guise of combatting Islamophobia, but at times struggled to tie specific pieces of purported evidence, like an anti-discrimination campaign featuring the slogan “freedom is in hijab,” directly to the group.
France has in recent days gone to great lengths to protect its secular nature. Earlier this week, France’s Europe Minister Benjamin Haddad called for tighter checks on the way the EU allocates grants following allegations that Brussels funded campaigns that did not respect the country’s secular values, and purportedly entities linked to Islamist movements.

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France’s Europe Minister Benjamin Haddad called for tighter checks on the way the EU allocates grants. | Pool Photo by Neil Hall via EPA
Macron has tasked his government with proposing measures to fight the Muslim Brotherhood’s influence, which are expected to be discussed next month, the president’s office said Tuesday.

Early version leaked​

An early version of the report was leaked to the conservative daily Le Figaro and right-wing magazine Valeurs Actuelles, an act that one high-ranking member of government, who was granted anonymity to speak freely, attributed to Interior Minister Bruno Retailleau.

Retailleau, who had access to the full report due to his role, told reporters earlier this week that the document would demonstrate how “Islamist infiltration is a threat.”

Presidential hopefuls jumped on the leak to put forward their own talking points even before the findings were officially made public. The president of the far-right National Rally, Jordan Bardella, told France Inter on Wednesday morning that the Muslim Brotherhood poses “one of the most existential challenges facing our country.”

And Gabriel Attal — who briefly served as prime minister last year and now leads the centrist pro-Macron Renaissance party — responded by floating a ban on Muslim headscarves for those under 15.

On the left, the far-left leader Jean-Luc Mélenchon accused the government of stoking Islamophobia and “giving credence” to far-right talking points.

“That’s enough! You’re going to destroy the country,” he wrote on X.
 
You know nothing about Portuguese politics Jon Snow!
As a caviar left party, their rhetoric for solving blue coloured workers problems was always unhinged from reality and inefficient, but they came as a fresh party after our own Communist Party (PCP) so they were in trend for some time.
Then BE realised these struggling workers also deemed their proposals as unhinged from reality and inefficient, so they went for the new fashionable SJW and rainbow stuff and Palestine VS Israel and so forth and so on. So they lost their base while PCP still keeps theirs because however unfeasible their proposals are these are still focused on struggling workers.

I was dipping into politics in Portugal while you were probably still in diapers. I know very well what passes for "left" here.

In this recent election the genocide-loving left (Tavares acts so sycophantic that he must be taking money from the israelis) ate the caviar left. Nothing surprising about that: their voters are the same group. The young and no-so-young but thinking of thelselves as forever young (another not so recent modern pathology, see Death in Venice) who want to act cool, burgoius and upper-class over the probles because they went to college or somesuch, but nevertheless are bkopre because they're really part of the exploited mass.

There's still the communists and they many just inherit if not the earth then at least this rectangle out of staying power. Something those in the boot won't do, not those in the hexagon, because they sold out entirely. But if that happens it won't happen due to anything here. This county is one of followers. A people too convinced of their own smallness, so much that they cheer for whatever the latest propaganda tells them are "winners". Which means that, ironically, @Ordael in a few yeoays you'll probbaly be a lover of all things russian and chinese.

It's been part of the history of this whole peninsula anyway. From the late roman empire to the end of the reconquista polity after polity collapsed as the population just ceased supporting a rapacious and useless ruling caste and welcomed some invader. It is not always so, NApoleon had more than a few regrets for thinking it would be. But wer'e at that state for the whole of "europe" at the present. Even you who profess to love it would't take arms to defend it. Nor would anyone on this forum.
 
First of all nice reply:thumbsup:
Love the diapers jab:lol:

In this recent election the genocide-loving left (Tavares acts so sycophantic that he must be taking money from the israelis) ate the caviar left.
Tavares came from the original caviar left (BE) he still presents himself and handles discourse like the original caviar left and it's mentor Louçã, that's why he is so much more palatable than any of the Mosrtágua sisters.

Which means that, ironically, @Ordael in a few yeoays you'll probbaly be a lover of all things russian and chinese.
I went the other way around, I started loving them and now I hate them. I actually had both language and cultural courses on both Chinese and Russian while on the academy and after.
The Chinese are a little more palatable though...maybe the fact that are not hell bent on conquering (besides lip service, if they really wanted Taiwan by force they would have have it by now) helps my tolerance on them. Also they're technological and scientific progress is seeming more and more like the real thing and they are researching stuff that can really help us all.

From the late roman empire to the end of the reconquista polity after polity collapsed as the population just ceased supporting a rapacious and useless ruling caste and welcomed some invader. It is not always so, NApoleon had more than a few regrets for thinking it would be
That's a contradiction.
We do not welcome invaders, ever. Even now we are shifting towards conservative right Chega exactly because of that!
Napoleon got the pitchforks.
English almost got them as well as they were overstaying after helping us with the crazy French.
Spanish got the pitchforks many times...but yes an Iberian Union is welcomed if EU collapses. We are just too small to go alone in this rotten world.

But wer'e at that state for the whole of "europe" at the present. Even you who profess to love it would't take arms to defend it. Nor would anyone on this forum.
No I wouldn't but I will happily keep paying my taxes to help the defence efforts needed to keep the EU alive and healthy!
 
Keeping this under-wraps just gives conservative right more ammunition...silly Macron!

Furious Macron dressed down ministers after botched leak of Muslim Brotherhood report​

PARIS — A visibly angry Emmanuel Macron blasted his ministers during a defense cabinet meeting Wednesday after a botched release of a report into the influence of the Muslim Brotherhood in France, according to a high-ranking government official.

A second official, who, like others quoted here, was granted anonymity to speak candidly, said the French president accused his ministers generally for not coming up with adequate solutions to counter the threat posed by the Islamist group.

But the dressing down — first reported by French daily Le Parisien — appears to be a shot across the bow to Interior Minister Bruno Retailleau.
The report into the influence of the Muslim Brotherhood was expected to be published on Wednesday, but its release was delayed by Macron’s office after the document was leaked to conservative media. An early version of the report seen by POLITICO said that the Muslim Brotherhood had gone to great lengths to push its fundamentalist agenda across France and Europe.

Many in the French government have attributed the leak to Retailleau, a hard-line conservative whose popularity has skyrocketed since joining Macron’s minority government in September. Retailleau on Sunday scored a landslide win to become the next leader of the Les Républicains, the historically dominant French center-right party relegated to political purgatory after Macron’s 2017 election upended French politics. Early polling indicates he could be a serious contender in the 2027 presidential election were he to run.

Retailleau had in recent days discussed the report in multiple interviews with French media, accusing the Muslim Brotherhood of “trying to tip French society into Sharia law.”

One presidential aide sought to downplay the interior ministry’s role on this issue on Tuesday, insisting that all official decisions would be made at a defense cabinet meetings presided over by Macron.

The government official who recounted the scene to POLITICO said Macron appeared to have a “mood swing” at that meeting.

“I’m not sure that he has understood … that it’s the government that governs” rather than the president, said the official.
The bickering is another sign that the attention of those in power has moved away from Macron toward the wide-open presidential election set to take place in fewer than two years, especially with Marine Le Pen of the far-right National Rally’s prospects in turmoil after her embezzlement conviction. She has repeatedly professed her innocence and could be allowed to run if an appeals court rules in her favor next year.

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Her likely successor, party president Jordan Bardella, said he is ready to step in in case she can’t run, but he is relatively green.

Political circles are already swirling with speculation over when Retailleau will leave the government to formally break with Macron and build his own platform ahead of the presidential election.

Losing Retailleau could be devastating for the precarious government of Prime Minister François Bayrou. The longtime centrist and Macron ally has been able to keep his government together despite lacking a majority and constant infighting — though the government is under increasing strain.
 
Ask Brigitte if she's available for some slapping.
 
The report literally states that the Muslim Brotherhood has very few supports in France (but that those very few are trying to gain some momentum). That has been the situation for the past 20 or 30 years, so not particularly of note. Retailleau is trying to create a false emergency out of this to gain momentum out of fear of something non existent. The fact that the spin this is getting is "Muslim Brotherhood trying to gain power in France" is depressing honestly
 
I don't know man. This Muslim Brotherhood types are banned in most Arab countries...I think we should take possible interference from radical Muslims in Europe very seriously...then again I am the kind of guy that always believes that where's smoke must be because something is burning!
 
Yeah but saying things like "they want to install sharia law in France" when 8 to 10 percent of the population is muslim, and not many of those having hardline views of some kind, is laughable.
 
Not sure where this should be posted, but Eu is mildly fitting.
Following PSG's champions league win, conflict with riot police in Paris (home of the team) broke out. There were also two dead (at least from BBC's video this seems to not be tied to the clash with police) and over 100 injured (this is tied to police, and among them are 22 policemen).


Why was there a riot? (I have to assume there was one, for riot police to be sent). Fans starting fires is obviously vile, but one of the deaths happened by knifing (the other was hit by a car) and there were large-scale violent clashes. Is there an angle of organized other people (not fans of PSG) getting into the marches covertly so as to cause destruction and even death?
 
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This seems to happen a lot in hot weather particularly with those not used to the heat.

I have a theory that cautionary algorithms in their over heated brains stop working.

There is certainly an increase in phombies walking in front of my moving car.
 
There are several factors that explain it. First, it's become a tradition of sorts for people who are celebrating something big, particularly when it comes to football, to become unhinged and to do things that are either unsafe or potentially damaging to private or public property. For example climbing on top of bus stops, or buses, or cars. This can lead to various issues, like the owner of the car getting angry and in turn doing unsafe things to protect their car.
Secondly, many of the young parisian fans in the streets yesterday (particularly those who stayed late), are from the suburbs and have a very tense relationship to the police. Therefore the unhinged state they were in may have gotten them to go pick a fight with the policemen. Also, the policemen tend to have racist tendencies in France, so seeing young dudes with north african origins (or young black men) might have made them more aggressive than they should have. I've seen both situations happen, as well as situations where both sides were guilty of escalating things, so I'm not going to offer a guess as to who started it.
TBH no one is particularly surprised that it didn't go smoothly yesterday, the only question there was was the scale of it. It ended up slightly more conflictual than I thought.

It's very unlikely that outside organisations were involved. Unless the far right is stronger than we think, which is already quite strong.
 
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