The Hinge of Fate - Development Thread

[techumseh]

Dicke Autos?

 

[JPetroski]

Fat cars - slang for enemy heavy bombers in WW2

 

[Civinator]

I considered fliegerkorps, and don't have an issue changing it, really, but a fliegerkorps, in my understanding, was a fairly permanent structure? For example, Fliegerkorps X. is specifically featured in the scenario?

This is not really what this is meant to be. You aren't raising a new Geschwader or series of them - you're hypothetically just scraping together whatever planes you can come up with in the general area and throwing them together, much like many kampfgruppe (especially the paper tiger ones later in the war) would have been.

It takes its inspiration from this group that was hastily assembled to help Finland:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detachment_Kuhlmey

Yes, Fliegerkorps was a longer lasting structure in the organization of the Luftwaffe and I thought that the boost in aircraft, achieved by spending "fuel" stays on the map until it is defended and not that it will be automatically deleted after a very short time in the game.

The detachment Kuhlmey indeed is translated to Gefechtsverband Kuhlmey, but this seems to be an exception in the Luftwaffe, as in this case the name of the existing temporary organization was tied to the existing name of the leader (the same situation as the not existing "Gefechtsverband Rudel"). Normally the provisional headquarters for flying units as part of the Second World War's Luftwaffe Organization were called "Fliegerführer" in combination with the name of the location: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luftwaffe_Fliegerführer

The Fliegerführer (if there is no letter "ü" available on the keyboard "ue" would be a fitting substitute) was responsible for the tactical management of different organizations and/or parts of organizations of the Luftwaffe in a special region - but Fliegerführer without the local annex in my ears would also sound somewhat silly (per example it could be missunderstood as the clumsy description for the pilot of a plane).

 

[JPetroski]

achieved by spending "fuel" stays on the map until it is defended and not that it will be automatically deleted after a very short time in the game

Well it's not that it gets disbanded though if you're forming one most of it likely gets mauled!

The detachment Kuhlmey indeed is translated to Gefechtsverband Kuhlmey, but this seems to be an exception in the Luftwaffe,

True it is an exception - I wrote the code for Kampfgruppe and decided a player might have a need to boost their air wing too. I mean you're the German so if you think that Fliegerkorps is really the way to go, who the heck am I to argue. I have studied the Luftwaffe a bit (that whole OTR game lol) so that's why I didn't go with Fliegerkorps, but if Gefechtsverband just sounds alien to your ears, so to speak, let me know! Fliegerkorps is definitely easier to say!

 

[Civinator]

As the units stay on the map (and therefore can be lasting longer) Fliegerkorps for me sounds better indeed. May be Fliegerführer Stavanger, Fliegerführer Trondheim and so on would be more appropriate, but to set the combination of the prefix Fliegerführer and the different locations in TOTPP seems much more difficult in my eyes.

 

[tootall_2012]

Turn 49...
6 Tiger I tanks are making their way to that front to break the deadlock.

I'm just curious. This statement kind of makes it sound like the Tiger's are some kind of miracle weapon. Is that the case or was it simply meant that they were going to be welcome strong reinforcements?

In either case, are they expensive to produce and maintain? As we know, Germany produced less than 1,400 Tiger I's during the entire war, whereas the Americans and Russians were producing roughly 2,000 armoured vehicles a month each.

 

[JPetroski]

I'm just curious. This statement kind of makes it sound like the Tiger's are some kind of miracle weapon. Is that the case or was it simply meant that they were going to be welcome strong reinforcements?

In either case, are they expensive to produce and maintain? As we know, Germany produced less than 1,400 Tiger I's during the entire war, whereas the Americans and Russians were producing roughly 2,000 armoured vehicles a month each.

They're arguably the best bang for the buck tank that the Germans have in this scenario because they have fair movement (4 MP) and have a ranged attack option, but they're expensive to build, only buildable in cities with a heavy weapons manufactory, which is only in 4 cities at the start of the scenario, and are hardly impervious. For example, I've only managed to produce 11 of them and have lost 4 in 14 turns since they became available (.79 produced/turn). Even with "raw materials" (disbandable units) that come regularly from Sweden, you can't acquire enough shields to build one per turn after disbanding a one raw material, so you really need to use two.

So, they're not likely to imbalance things and should be much more rare than the Panzer IV, which can be built anywhere (in Greater Germany) that has a mere factory. For example, I currently have 32 of those (I started with 3), and have lost 43 for a total of 72 units produced over the course of 58 turns (1.24/turn).

Another option is the Panther, but it doesn't get the ranged attack. Instead, it can attack up to 4x per turn rather than 2x that the Tiger (and all other tanks) are limited to. I haven't researched them yet but have a feeling they would come in handy in field battles especially.

Anyway, you have to balance all of this with also understanding that you only have so many cities that can build any type of good, German unit, and that you have the competing interests not only of tanks/infantry/artillery but also a need to keep the Luftwaffe in the air, and U-Boats prowling the seas. So while I suppose one could say, "I will build nothing but Tigers" I wouldn't advise the strategy.

 

[CurtSibling]

You can't have a WW2 military scenario without the Tiger.

 

[Civinator]

You can't have a WW2 military scenario without the Tiger.

... and therefore about 10 years ago I made an animated sprite of the Tiger I for Civ 2 ToT:

 

[CurtSibling]

Very nice, sir!

Although, I prefer Fairline's amazing Tigers.

 

[CurtSibling]

@JPetroski
What is next for this excellent scenario?
I have no doubts this one will be one of the finest CIV2 creations, and a showcase for the current Lua capabilities.

 

[JPetroski]

In the playtest, the Allies smacked me out of Afrika after I ran out of fuel/supplies to send there and couldn't (well, didn't bother whatsoever) to neutralize Malta. Malta can definitely be neutralized - it's just a count of how many fighters are there. Once it's neutralized, your shipping doesn't have the trireme flag and can keep up with the Afrika Korps. Air reinforcements can also be brought from Greece and reach Cyrenaica. I didn't do any of this, and got my butt handed to me when the offensive stalled.

This caused the Allies to land in Sicily which they took and then Italy. Their landings produced some errors/bugs/and situations I wanted to change, so the playtest stalled until I can fix those and go back. I hope to make the changes this weekend and carry on!

 

[CurtSibling]

Good luck with the next phase...It's coming together.

 

[techumseh]

Sounds really good John. Looking forward to playing it.

 

[JPetroski]

The Allied landings in Italy come much earlier than historically because I lose so badly in Africa... It is only Early December, 1942, and I now have a third European front to defend. Unfortunately, I have very few units available and I need to scrounge together defenses. I've withdrawn Rommel from Africa, abandoning it to its fate, and he will be tasked with putting together a defense.

Of note, I've completed the "goto" commands for the Allies in Italy, France, and the Soviets this turn. This is definitely a war Germany wants to win quickly, as was the case in real life. I'm not looking forward to 1943 and beyond.

 

[JPetroski]

Early February, 1943.

The situation is growing absolutely critical. I did not have enough units near Italy to stop the Allies from quickly advancing up the peninsula. Both Rome and Ancona have fallen. I have a large panzer division in Bologna and am moving to make a defensive line running approximately east-west with Bologna at the center. The Luftwaffe has diverted all available fighters from the defense of the Reich to Italy, and they're starting to arrive (by the way, WHY won't the 8th AF attack the industrial units that have literally the same stats as the urban centers the RAF loves to decimate? I keep playing with the stats to try and draw a strike. Does anyone know a "guaranteed" trick to make attacking a unit oh so juicy for the AI?)

The situation in Ukraine has taken a dramatic turn for the worse. Given that I own Leningrad and Moscow, I am only two (distant) cities away from knocking the Soviet Union out of the war... My only chance to win this scenario is to beat them, and beat them quickly before the Allies can become more established in Europe. Unfortunately, Army Group South has suffered a catastrophic defeat east of Denepropetrovsk. Everything that was marching towards Stalingrad from that direction is gone... I won't be able to invest the city until Army Group Center's Tiger tanks can approach Stalngrad from the north, if we survive that long.

I really do think I have a chance at beating the Soviets, but it's not a guarantee at all. They start to become much more powerful at the halfway point of the game (mid Summer, 1943) and that's only 10 turns away...

Also, the Brits landed in Crete, since i didn't have enough defenders there, and now it's possible they'll land in Greece... Yeah, this is not going to be an easy scenario. I absolutely screwed myself early on by fighting (and losing) the Battle of Britain. Winning Sea Lion shuts off almost all the good British events so I do think it's a viable strategy but, man, if you don't invade and you waste away resources you're in trouble later. What I wouldn't give for a few Kampfgruppe or Fliegerkorps now...

 

[JPetroski]

I just checked and I've lost 93 units the past 3 turns.

 

[Civinator]

These are very interesting reports.

 

[Prof. Garfield]

(by the way, WHY won't the 8th AF attack the industrial units that have literally the same stats as the urban centers the RAF loves to decimate? I keep playing with the stats to try and draw a strike. Does anyone know a "guaranteed" trick to make attacking a unit oh so juicy for the AI?)

From rules1945w.txt

00000100, 00000011,-1, 0000000000000000,0000000000000000,0000000000000000, 10000000  ;Lancaster
00001000, 00000110,-1, 0000000000000000,0000000000000000,0000000000000000, 10000000  ;B-17

It looks like B-17s are not allowed on map 1. This might account for why they aren't trying to attack anything on that map. Incidentally, I noticed that clicking on a target causes an 'out of supply' message. So, you might want to fix that if you haven't already.

 

[JPetroski]

It looks like B-17s are not allowed on map 1. This might account for why they aren't trying to attack anything on that map. Incidentally, I noticed that clicking on a target causes an 'out of supply' message. So, you might want to fix that if you haven't already.

I ended up making their cost 50 rows and now apparently the AI wants to destroy them... Guess they weren't juicy enough!