The Immortal University III - Who will lead the French?

Last auto-save before the crash was only 1 turn behind, so I continued. Very happy that I did, this game got fun afterall. Louis is certainly revenging all those bloody axe rushes. However he's too sophisticated to perform them himself, he prefers alternative payback.

2nd set, 250 BC -> 1100 AD:
Spoiler :
Decide to postpone researching music a couple of turns and head towards calendar to hook up our dye. I also made an attempt for the MoM and got it. My capital is getting a lot of Artist pollution, but I'll just have to live with that.

125 BC: Spawn a GS
25 BC: Complete music and get the GA
300 AD: Spawn a GS
375 AD: Shaka has enough on his hands, so I decide to go straight for gunpowder after education, better safe than sorry. He declared on Brennus though, so Louis is quite safe still.
540 AD: Spawn our first Artist :( Didn't expect one this soon as I had been running other specialists, it was only ~10-15% chance.

Spawned a lot of GPs the coming years, but lost track of which and when.
Made a couple of trades, I'll be too far ahead of these guys soon so I might as well use them while I can.








Researched Nationalism for the Taj Mahal after gunpowder and on to chemistry. I've also part-researched Liberalism up to 1 turn at this point, but nobody's got education yet, so I'll leave it there.

1100 AD: Nobody's got education yet, but I decide to finish Liberalism anyway as it's be pointless to wait....



Yes, I need to finish monotheism right now, couldn't wait any more turns. :D
Picked physics and burned the GS on biology, currently eta 7.



Here's the current tech screen:



I don't envy those other civs, of all the people to be behind it has to be Louis, mr. arrogant. I can see him pointing his finger towards them laughing :smug::nono:
 

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1000 - 1400AD

Spoiler :


Well the plan was to grow my cities a bit and build an army to take on Shaka. He obviously knew this so decided to declare on me instead. As his best units are macemen and I have got rifles/cav this was not his best idea. :lol:

Zulu/My lands :)

Imm5-Zululands0000.jpg


I don't have many troops but I've got enough to take his last 2 good cities then peace.

Not sure what victory condition to go for. I'm tempted to try a diplo win via UN or space. Current relations are good except Shaka. :)

Imm5-Relations0000.jpg


I would usually take Shaka as a vassal but I don't want the negatives for having a vassal.

Tech situation. Note Just has physics but I'm up RP and Rifles.

Imm5-Techs0000.jpg


Demographics:

Imm5-Demo0000.jpg


Important ones are good. So back to the game.
 

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I've never felt comfortable with industrious leaders, so hopefully I'll learn something in this game.

Louis, Chapter 1
Up to 925bc
Spoiler :

{For some reason all the screenshots I've taken are empty black screens :dunno: I only have the Empire Overview shot in 925bc, sorry.}

The start looks good. Before founding I decided to pop the hut (free scout). Paris would be well located 1NW, but I decide to found in place to allow for a decent second city to grab the stone.

While Fishing is being researched Pottery + Mining are popped from huts. :D

It seems that we have plenty of space on our island? (large peninsula?) so now seems like a good time to pursue a couple of wonders. The GLH is built in ~1200 bc (Paris), and the 'Mids in ~1000bc (Orleans).

Beakers have been coming nicely so we've researched Maths already and are now working on Calendar. Below you can see that Brennus stole a prime city location on our home turf ... we will have to do something about that.

Empire:

Louis_925bc.jpg


Since our wonders are in place it's time to ReX our land before the Celts get too firm a foothold.
 
2000BC-1AD (50 turns)
Spoiler :
Going with a settler first was a :smoke: move. I should have gone worker first.

Shortly after 2000BC, I started having issues with barbarians. With only warriors to defend, I was further delayed spamming junk units that had fairly poor odds of winning fights.

I managed to get the horses online, and pump a few chariots out, finally allowing me to expand some more. But the real damage was done, I think, in going settler first.

I'm debating what to do with the game. I might restart and shadow. I had a feeling I was digging myself into some sort of hole, but it was definatly deeper than I expected.
 
Louis Chapter 2
925bc-1ad
Spoiler :

This was a pure building/ReX turnset.

A GM was settled in Paris (with 'Mids enabled representation this is more lucrative than normal.

We've researched Aesthetics->Literature->Music (free Great Artist :D ) Our tech pace is very strong, trade routes, commerce specials, and scientists all add up.

Alphabet was obtained from Asoka for Calendar.

By 1ad the French have expanded to 6 cities.

The North:

da_nor.jpg


The South:

da_south.jpg


Brennus continues to be a pain, putting pressure on our future city cites (he now has two cities on our island). Paris is slowly but surely adding culture in Camulodunum, a peaceful flip is a possibility:

culture_cam.jpg


The southern marble has been hooked into our fledgling trade network, and the Great Library is a few turns from finishing. I've also started the Mausoleum of Maussollos, but we may miss it. The Parthenon and Sistine are still on the table as well -- building them for cash would be helpful.

The Celtic problem must be dealt with fairly soon, perhaps a short sword/cat war to steal a couple of cities ... :devil:
 
Louis, Chapter 3
1-660ad
Spoiler :

This round we added the Great Library, an Academy, and the National Epic in Paris. Bureaucracy was adopted as well. French settlements are also pushing into some of the islands to the east.

We surprisingly founded a religion (no bulbing involved):

tao_f.jpg


That is a very late date for Tao ...

Despite missing the Mausoleum by 3 turns, the Parthenon is built in time:

parth.jpg


Our pure building is interrupted by an annoying Zulu:

Shaka_dow.jpg


I'd much rather fight either Asoka or Brennus, oh well. :rolleyes: The first turn of the war Shaka suicides six units amphibiously, we loose a sword.

The war should be fine, but I can't bribe anyone to help out, despite a strong tech lead:

tech_sit.jpg


 
4000BC - 840AD


Spoiler :

Early build order: Worker->warrior->SH->GW->warrior->worker->settler
Early techs: mining->masonry->bw->pottery->ah

4000BC - Settle 1NE for floods.

2560BC - SH in Paris.

2280BC - GW in Paris.

1120BC - Oracle in Paris, picked MC as tech.

775BC - Mids in Paris and switch to slavery+rep.

750BC - Priesthood+meditation to Joao for sailing.

525BC - Maths to Joao for IW.

200BC - HG in Paris.

125BC - Parthenon rushed with GE in Orleans.

1AD - Capital.




100AD - Shaka dows me, why do I still have no religion? Since Shaka and Brennus are Buddhist I really could use religion ..

200AD - Aest+Priesthood to Brennus for Alphabet. :rolleyes: Did I mention the tech speed is low in general? Also MC to Brennus for calendar since he's the only one who doesn't have it.

250AD - Chichen Itza in Paris.

352AD - Buddhism finally spread, so I revolt. I hope I can sign peace with Shaka soon.

500AD - Shwedagon Paya in Paris. Col and Aest to Asoka for currency, mono and gold.

520AD - Got to CS and I revolt to Bur and Paci.

560AD - Aesthetics to Shaka for peace.

620AD - TGL in Paris.

640AD - Col to Brennus for monarchy.

840AD - Angkor Wat in Paris. Worldmap+literature to Shaka for worldmap and gold. Stopped playing here.

Northern part:


Southern part:


Capital:


Tech overview:


Diplo:




I'll probably try to pick const or democracy from lib, depending how fast Asoka techs himself. Didn't meet the other AI's but I don't think they'd be more advanced then Asoka.

EP is set to Shaka atm, I'll probably take him out with riffles.
 
Louis, Chapter 4
660-1200ad
Spoiler :

Last chapter Shaka had just declared war on us. A few land skirmishes follow, and after a standoff at sea Shaka is willing to accept Literature for peace. Ok by me.

A Great Scientist partially bulbs Education, and Liberalism is obtained in 900ad.

liberalism.jpg


Nationalism is taken now (rather than waiting for a better tech later) so that the Taj Mahal can be built in Paris.

Our small troop build up for the Zulu war means that our units are soon in position to take the cities Brennus managed to place on the Isle of France:

dow_brennus.jpg


Asoka had already declared on Celtia, and Shaka was brought in as a further distraction:

bring_shaka.jpg


The last Celtic city is removed from our land:

my_isl.jpg


And we do manage to build the Taj:

Taj.jpg


Louis continued the war against Brennus, taking three island cities before peace is signed. Shaka captured Vienne before signing peace himself. By 1200ad the French have spread out into the sea:

my_world.jpg


Our technology is still superior to those we've met (Persia will be contacted shortly ...):

tech_pos.jpg


And our demographics place us nicely into the middle of the pack:

demos_2.jpg


Current research is set to Economics as the Great Merchant is still available. Either Democracy or Rifling will follow. More land would be great, but early emancipation would help to ensure the French economy stays strong.

Zululand and Celtia will both be assimilated into French territory at some point, I hope :mischief:

This is turning out to be an interesting map :goodjob:

 
1400 - 1650AD

Spoiler :


A round with not much happening. Finished off by taking Shaka's 2 cities I was aiming for. Forbidden Palace was built in Ulundi to help keep the maintenance down. Tech aim was to go for the media wonders. 4 turns to go on Eiffel/RocknRoll and 6 on Cristo. I'm suffering from emancipation so once Cristo is built I can change. Idea is still to try a UN victory but I'm going to tech Assembly Line before MM.

Techs.

Imm6-Techs0001.jpg


Still ok. Asoka and Brennus are in WFYBTA and Sal is Cyrus vassal.

Relations.

Imm6-Relations0000.jpg


OK apart from Brennus/Shaka could be a visit to Brennus some time in the future. :mischief:

Demographics.

Imm6-demographics0000.jpg


French Lands

Imm6-Zululands0000.jpg


Note the annoying city Shake built then culture bombed. :mad:

Imm6-FrenchSouth0000.jpg


Imm6-FrenchCentre0000.jpg


Imm6-FrenchNorth0000.jpg


Not under any pressure from someone going for a cultural victory so I still might try for space win.
 

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@Rusten

Spoiler :
Damn you have a big tech lead in your game :lol:
 
1650 - 1903AD

Spoiler :


Well the plan was to try for a diplo victory but I had to resort to the tried and trusted space win instead. For a while I was running HR/Vas/OR without a religion to try and get some favourite civic positives. If I could have got Asoka to vote for me I would have won but I had to many negatives so everyone was voting for me for UN Sec but not enough for the victory.

Final Relations.

Imm7-Relations0000.jpg


Finally Louis get some love. :lol:

Final Techs.

Imm7-Techs0000.jpg


I did build the Internet but didn't really need it as I was the clear Tech leader anyway.

Victory Screen.

Imm7-VicScreen0000.jpg


A bit late for a final score of 41000 ish. Apart from Paris (NE and Oxford) I was lacking a good Ironworks site so that slowed me slightly.

I was quite happy with the way the game went. Researched Lib earlier than normal. I probably should have built some more of the early wonders. Especially Parth and MoM but I didn't explore the island properly and missed the marble for a long while.

Also a lack of early exploration which I think a lot of us are guilty of. ;) I was tech trading with Asoka and he was probably gaining the benefit from trading with the others I hadn't met.

Still I ended up with a victory again which is always good. :D

Thanks for hosting this silverbullet. :goodjob:
 

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Sleepless and Rusten-

Spoiler :
Do you have any saves from your games? Rusten's second or Sleepless's somewhere between 1AD-500AD?
 
875BC - 150AD (41 turns)

Spoiler :
825BC - Sailing in, set research to iron working. I thought about hunting > archery for some cheap defenders, but Shaka's got the all-melee to cover event in my game so axes will be more use. Shaka's also founded a city on the island directly to the west, which means I'll need defenders sooner rather than later.

675BC - Lyons founded 1S of the rice in the east.

civ4screenshot0002ms0.jpg


625BC - IW in > Aesthetics.

425BC - GS born in Paris > Academy.

400BC - Aesthetics > Polytheism.

375BC - Reims founded, one tile north of my preferred site to grab the iron resource. Looks like Brennus was headed there too.

civ4screenshot0003wf1.jpg


325BC - Polytheism > Literature.

225BC - Tours founded next to copper on the island to the N. Literature > Priesthood.

200BC - Priesthood > Drama.

25BC - Cyrus (a Buddhist, but not the founder) turns up and he's leading in score at the moment.

1AD - Drama > Maths (traded for with Brennus for Aesthetics) > Music

150AD - Meet Joao and trade him Lit+Drama for Monarchy+Meditation. I'm 9 turns from the GLib in Orleans so that should be in the bag at this point.

France:

civ4screenshot0004fq8.jpg


Paris is spamming axes to try and get my power up a bit; neither Shaka or Brennus are WHEOOH at the moment, but that won't last forever so it's best to be prepared. Reims is a decent production city so I'll probably build Sistine there once Music's discovered. My main cultural focus will probably then be on Paris and Orleans, with Reims being bombed to give me a 3rd legendary.

Assuming I don't get killed first of course...
 

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I don't have anything strategic to add here, but as a lurker I have thoroughly enjoyed this series, and once I have mastered (or more firmly appreciated) such things as Specialist economies etc I may even join in.

So basically, it's another prop to the Immortal University thread - keep it up!
 
Sleepless and Rusten-

Spoiler :
Do you have any saves from your games? Rusten's second or Sleepless's somewhere between 1AD-500AD?

Only have these two other than the ones already uploaded.
 

Attachments

Louis, Chapter 4.5

A short set; I'm looking for some advice as to the best way to proceed.
1200-1340
Spoiler :

The set started out with a trade with the weakish Portugal:

Joao_trade.jpg


Our Unique Building is now enabled, I suppose I should just swallow the artist pollution and build them - before universities :dunno:

The Economics GM is used for a trade mission in Constantinople:

trade_mission.jpg


1700 gold is very nice at this point, enabling Democracy to be researched in 5 turns instead of 8. With Democracy in the bag the tech screen looks quite clean:

tech_position1340.jpg


And the Statue of Liberty can be built in Paris in 21 turns (we have copper):

Democracy_now.jpg


So here are the questions:

1) I have two GPs ready to start my third GA, allowing anarchy free civic changes. I'll switch to Emancipation but is Universal Suffrage better than Representation at this point? What about Free Speech over Bureaucracy?

2) Should I bother building the SoL? We have only eight cities eligible for the free specialist - is this too small a benefit for an expensive wonder?

3) All of Shaka's and Brennus' land would be better managed by the French, but what is the best way of convincing them? I could wait for Communism and then mass a large force, taking down both in rapid succession. Alternatively we could finish Celtia off a little sooner. Would rifling or cannons/grens make more sense?
 
phew. I ended up playing this in one go as I had some spare time today. It was... a rather straining game.

Spoiler :

I settled in place because I wanted to work the fish early and I also wanted to try the Glighthouse. I ended up wonder spamming heavily in the BC years as I had my first two cities (Paris and Orleans) building lots of wonders. Paris got the GL, GLH, Sistine, Pentagon, and UoS. Orleans got the Mids, Parthenon, Ankor, Taj, GW, and MoM. The GLH was very powerful on this map - it easily propelled me to the tech lead until the AI's started to adopt mercantilism.

Unfortunately, because of all the wonder spamming Shaka came after me more than once. The first time, I luckily had metal casting so I built triremes to bust up his galleys before he could land troops on my land. The second time he attacked me, I was setting up for a steel slingshot from liberalism. This time he managed to land a few troops but I began my double MoM enhanced GA spree (2 GP + Taj). I built up a modest stack of musketeers :lol: and cannons. I then shipped them over in galleys to Shaka's lands and started to take one city after another. Since he didn't have curaissers until the very end of the war, he couldn't kill my cannons (no flank attack!). I was quite impressed with the steel sling - I may do this more in my future games as it appears to be more powerful than the rifling sling if you have the production to abuse it.

I took about half of Shaka's lands before I decided to take peace. I was worried that he would vassalize to somebody else and drag me into a protracted war - something I did not want to do at this point as I had other fish to fry. Notably, Asoka had settled very close to me and even managed to get a city on the eastern edge (I was lazy settling). Since Asoka was in the lead, I decided to whittle him down next. Unfortuately it took a VERY long time to get my boats over so I only had enough time to take a few cities (rifles/cannons at this point) before he got up to rifles. I took peace after that and regrouped for a while.

At this point, I basically hunkered down to get factories up and running in my cities to begin my late game push. Unfortuantely Joao (who had been swapping in and out of vassalage to Asoka) declared on me for no reason. I had more power than him so I wasn't quite sure what he was up to - particularly since he didn't even have an invasion stack coming after me. I had managed to get up to combustion/industrialism around this point so I sent out the marines to take Joao's island holdings. Unfortunately he vassaled back to Asoka and dragged me into another war :(

I didn't war with Asoka very long the second time as Shaka bizarrely (or in character) attacked me again. This time I beat him back badly (tanks own rifles) and reduced him to one island city. Unfortunately the city was on the other side of the map so I just capitulated him. I then regrouped my troops to build up a modern navy and set forth on Asoka again.

Asoka didn't have much of a military so he only put up token resistance. I lost most of my units attacking the 1 tile island cities - his continental holdings fell very quickly to tanks (and later mech infantry/modern armor). Around this time, I also got the internet and turned off research. I basically just built air force + mech infantry for the rest of the game. I commenced my chain of vassalizing with Asoka, Joao, followed by Cyrus.

Justinian and Brennus were at war and Brennus was losing horribly so I used the UN to broker peace. I then sent my stack to Justinian's capital as his sod was stuck near Brennus's lands without transports. I commenced my landing campaign from the east and was cruising along. But I got tired and just took the diplo win via vassals :blush:

A very late win:
Civ4ScreenShot0148.jpg


good for about 60k.

Here's the power graph - you can see where I declared war on Justinian :lol:
Civ4ScreenShot0149.jpg


The GNP (although my research was internet fueled for the last 50 turns of the game or so):
Civ4ScreenShot0150.jpg


The big spike around 1760 is where I bit the bullet and took a 2 turn anarchy to shift into police state. I stayed in police state for the rest of the game since I figured I'd be warring the rest of the way out.

And the backbone of my victory, production:
Civ4ScreenShot0151.jpg


I was able to get 4 really good production cities. 3 on my starting island and 1 from Shaka. All 4 had around 50 base hammers + factory, forge, power, military academy for a total of 100%? These 4 cities were cranking out mech. infantry every 2 turns so I had around 70 at the end of the game. Too bad the AI doesn't know how to kill mech infantry...

This game proved to be quite an annoying map with all the islands. Many of the AI were able to tech fairly well in the late game because they were all getting inter-continental trade routes from all the minor colonies on the islands. As a result, Asoka and Justinian (and later Cyrus) were all able to tech pretty well. I had a tech lead for about 2/3 of the game at which point Justinian and Asoka started to pull away a bit. I took down Asoka easily but I only caught up to Justinian after I got the internet.

 
@olodune

Spoiler :

I wouldn't bother with the SoL with 8 cities. Unless you want the cash from it, it's not really worth completing as it just takes too long and the return is... minimal. Of course if you stay in representation, it's pretty powerful (24 beakers without multipliers).

However, considering how backwards your Brennus and Shaka are (surprising for an immortal AI in 1300 AD), I would skip the SoL and just go cannon/grennies. Those two are more than enough to take out knights/LB. Assuming you have the Mom, why not revolt to representation at the start of the GA until you get steel, then switch to US? You should have enough turns during the GA to swap between them. As for colony costs, I'd just bite the bullet. You can go chem --> steel --> military science --> SM --> communism. It shouldn't be that long before you can get state property.

 
@ Olodune

Spoiler :


Emancipation? If I was planning a war I usually stay in slavery at this stage. No-one else has it so you won't be getting any :mad: faces from other civs running emancipation. Plus slavery is also good for getting the courthouses up quickly ;). The extra trade routes from the GLh (by far the best wonder on this map) more than make up for the quicker growing cottages. Just be prepared to give economics away cheaply and bribe people into Free Market.

Unless your planning on buying your army I would stay in Rep rather than US but then again I tend to keep Rep through the game as my economies end up more hybrid than CE/SE.

If you are going to build the SoL in Paris I would stay in beau but as I moved Paris inland for a long while beau was a no brainer for me. I think the SoL only took me 12 turns ish but the other point is you don't want anyone else building it especially Justinian.

As for war I would attack Shaka first and try Cannon/Gren/Muskets. It depends what sort of victory you are going for. If dom I would look to vassalise people as quickly as possible. Taking all the islands would make for a long game I think. :) I would also be building plenty of trebs and upgrade them to cannons rather than wait for steel and build cannons.

I think thats enough waffle from me for now. :lol: Your looking good whatever way you go though. :goodjob:
 
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