It seems to me that this was the original intention of the Civics system, and if two options seem mutually exclusive (like the afformentioned Police State and Free Speech), it is rather a result of said options being placed in poorly considered categories than of a need for one to exclude the other.
The 'Ultimate' Civics Expander and Balancer Mod
- Thread starter Aussie_Lurker
- Start date
Aussie_Lurker
Deity
Well, whatever the intention, there are still these major problems with "exclusivity". For me it will mostly be ideology that excludes certain civics-like a society with a Libertarian Philosophy would never support a Police State or Dictatorship as a government style. By the same token a Plutocratic society would probably frown on a Planned Economy. Just some thoughts.
Aussie_Lurker.
Aussie_Lurker.
farfareralba
Chieftain
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2006
- Messages
- 5
Hi ,
i`ve been playing civ for some time now ever since the amiga days and civ 1. I like the look of these mods and things however can someone tell me what i have to do to get them to work. I downloaded the civics balancer phase 3d zip file and swapped all the original files for the ones in assets folder. Then i started the game. The civic's in the game looked exactly the same as usual. What did i forget to do or do wrong. I didnt copy the civic balancer phase 3wd config settigns in to the games directory, i think that might be it. Will you ever make it multiplayer, i lan with my friend alot and would be great to use this in one of those contests.
i`ve been playing civ for some time now ever since the amiga days and civ 1. I like the look of these mods and things however can someone tell me what i have to do to get them to work. I downloaded the civics balancer phase 3d zip file and swapped all the original files for the ones in assets folder. Then i started the game. The civic's in the game looked exactly the same as usual. What did i forget to do or do wrong. I didnt copy the civic balancer phase 3wd config settigns in to the games directory, i think that might be it. Will you ever make it multiplayer, i lan with my friend alot and would be great to use this in one of those contests.
Aussie_Lurker
Deity
What you need to do is unzip the file into the Mods folder. Then, start the game as normal but-when you get to the start screen-select Advanced, then Load Mod. Then click on the mod you want to load (in this case my phase 3d) and then it should load up like a regular game, but with all the new features in play.
Aussie_Lurker.
Aussie_Lurker.
farfareralba
Chieftain
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2006
- Messages
- 5
ok thats easier than i expacted muchas gratiosa
GoodSarmatian
Jokerfied Western Male
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2006
- Messages
- 9,408
Hmm...I don't like restrictions in civic choices...
Official values and Realpolitik often contradict each other. For centuries many European states had a state religion which was originaly pacifistic in nature, but they were constantly waging war against each other.
Or look at China: Communism and Free Market.
Of course I don't mean to presume to hijack your mod, but taking that in connection with my earlier post, surely the logical solution is to not have an ideology category?
Aussie_Lurker
Deity
Well, like religion I just don't think we can overlook the importance of ideology/political philosophy in the development of civilization. That is why I have included it as a seperate civics category in the Phase3 stage of development. Remember, though, that this is an 'evolutionary process', and I have already begun work on Phase 4 of my mod. This next phase introduces Ideology-not as a civics category-but as something akin to Religion. In phase 4, ideologies will start to appear around the end of the middle-ages in an identical fashion to religion. Also like religion, Ideology will impact on diplomatic relations, can earn cash for the founder and can be spread to cities far and wide. Unlike vanilla religions, however, each ideology will have an impact on your civ if you adopt it as the State Ideology-with effects very similar to those that they currently have in Phase3. They will also limit your choices of civics in each category. All I can say is that it is progressing, and will keep you updated as I go. For what its worth, stage 1 is now complete-with a new CvIdeologyInfo function added. Now I need to scan the remainder of CvInfos.cpp to see where else Ideologies need to be taken into account (DiplomacyInfos being just one of them 
).
Aussie_Lurker.
).Aussie_Lurker.
Ah, ok. That makes a lot of sense.Well, like religion I just don't think we can overlook the importance of ideology/political philosophy in the development of civilization. That is why I have included it as a seperate civics category in the Phase3 stage of development. Remember, though, that this is an 'evolutionary process', and I have already begun work on Phase 4 of my mod. This next phase introduces Ideology-not as a civics category-but as something akin to Religion. In phase 4, ideologies will start to appear around the end of the middle-ages in an identical fashion to religion. Also like religion, Ideology will impact on diplomatic relations, can earn cash for the founder and can be spread to cities far and wide. Unlike vanilla religions, however, each ideology will have an impact on your civ if you adopt it as the State Ideology-with effects very similar to those that they currently have in Phase3. They will also limit your choices of civics in each category. All I can say is that it is progressing, and will keep you updated as I go. For what its worth, stage 1 is now complete-with a new CvIdeologyInfo function added. Now I need to scan the remainder of CvInfos.cpp to see where else Ideologies need to be taken into account (DiplomacyInfos being just one of them
Aussie_Lurker.
spoooq
Warlord
- Joined
- Sep 14, 2006
- Messages
- 221
This has always been the one piece of strange decision-making that has stood out about Civ4 to me. Somehow, the Civics just seem to be jumbled up into the wrong categories. Maybe it was a last minute attempt at game-balancing. I think I once tried to decide where I would put each Civic, and it did seem as though they once had a proper place to go to.
I'd like to see a mod that explored the possibility of ruling your civ by decree, similar to how the U.N. works now. Decrees could be in effect another tech-tree, with earlier decrees unlocking some later ones and blocking others.
Police State was in the government category back in SMAC, though. To me, it seemed that the government and economy categories were obvious choices populated by the SMAC options and some extras to encompass terrestrial history, and the other three were just revolving around the final options (Free Speech, Emancipation, and Free Religion). That's why the government and economy categories don't really follow any set pattern (and sometimes overlap other categories) and the other three categories seem inconsistant in what they represent (like Pacifism and Organised Religion. How are they mutually exclusive?)
knigh+
.
That alone is worth being a seperate MODCOMP.
I mean, who ever heard of a Police State w/ Free Speech? Or a Theocracy (if you put it under Government Civic) w/ Free Religion?
Ottoman Empire was Theocracy with Free Religion
Actually, quoting myself from another thread in which we were discussing religion civics that are not in the game:
1- Theocratic Freedom: Ottoman Empire before 1850s. State religion matters only in foreign relations and missionaries. Citizens have freedom of religion, but they have to obey the laws of their own religions in the society. Citizens can't be secular in this. A Theocracy trying to get thebonus of Free Religion, or Free Religion trying to base itself on religious teachings?
2- State Sanctioned Atheism: USSR and other communists. No state religion, no freedom of religion, no religious building counstruction etc.
3- Ideological or Personal Cult: WW2 Germany, Turkmenistan. No state religion, but people can have religion. May be a subset of #4.
4- Strong Secularism: Turkey, France. Religion is free, but it is not allowed to affect citizens in neither personal nor societal scale.
5- Freedom of Faith: Many developed countries. Religion is free, people can do whatever they want with their life. Religion is only prohibited from affecting foreign relations.
6- Unbalanced Freedom: USA. Religion is free, but with unbalanced demographics of religion. The country's policies are often influenced by religion and the state almost has a state religion. This is a more secular and modern version of #1. This has the happy of the Free Religion civic without all the science bonus (look at all the fuss about stem cell research).
Keep in mind that even if you disagree with my assessment of one of the countries I gave as example, don't waste your breath on argueing against it, as individual countries aren't our topic. Just replace the name of the country with Exampleland and re-think about it.
Well, OK... besides them.
Hey Aussie,
Ever think about adding a Flavors tag for the Civics? So a Military Flavored Leader would be more inclined to choose Police State (if it was Flavored for Military) over Universal Suffrage... another example: Free Market (Flavored w/ Gold, Growth), State Property (Production, Growth) etc?
Just a thought...
Powerslave
Prince
I like the ideas in the mod and the new civics, but some of the civics seem just a little bit overpowered. Have you considered scaling down the bonuses? For example, +25% -> +10%, +1 food to farms -> +1 food to irrigated farms, etc.
Also, getting additional food, especially when you're able to rush through slavery, often unbalances the game. You might want to make civics which give additional food come very late in the game or have a very high opportunity cost (though this is mitigated by being spiritual).
Overall, an excellent mod, however. Thanks for the hard work.
Also, getting additional food, especially when you're able to rush through slavery, often unbalances the game. You might want to make civics which give additional food come very late in the game or have a very high opportunity cost (though this is mitigated by being spiritual).
Overall, an excellent mod, however. Thanks for the hard work.
GenMarshall
High Elven ISB Capt & Ghost Agent
Quick Question, Is this Mod usable for Beyond the Sword?
Aussie_Lurker
Deity
Not yet it isn't-sorry.
Aussie_Lurker.
Aussie_Lurker.
Leif
Prince
Are you still going to work on it?
Ekmek
on steam: ekmek_e
Aussie are you working it?
Aussie_Lurker
Deity
Greetings guys. Sorry for the long hiatus, but real life has kind of had my back to the wall.
The good news, though, is that I have successfully completed Stage 1 of updating this Mod for BtS v 3.13.
Assuming everything goes to plan, I should have a working version of phase 3d done by the end of the week. After that, I hope to add a 'Values' Category to the Civics list. I expect this to be done by the end of October.
After that, you probably won't hear much from me because I will be well & truly starting my rather epic 'Politics Mod', which will seek to add another layer to the game to compliment both Religion & Corporations-as I hinted at before.
Anyway, keep your eyes peeled.
Aussie_Lurker.
The good news, though, is that I have successfully completed Stage 1 of updating this Mod for BtS v 3.13.
Assuming everything goes to plan, I should have a working version of phase 3d done by the end of the week. After that, I hope to add a 'Values' Category to the Civics list. I expect this to be done by the end of October.
After that, you probably won't hear much from me because I will be well & truly starting my rather epic 'Politics Mod', which will seek to add another layer to the game to compliment both Religion & Corporations-as I hinted at before.
Anyway, keep your eyes peeled
.Aussie_Lurker.
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