the ultimate strategy game?

Daftpanzer

canonically ambiguous
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off topic,

If you were a one-man, programming genius, game creation machine, and you liked strategy games, what kind of game would you make?

I think mine would be some kind of civilizationx/ eu2/hoi/ victoria/ imperialism/alpha centarui/Master of Orion 1+2/ reunion/ castles2 hybrid :) . The game would be real-time, spanning 4000bc to modern times and beyond with a choice of around 30 major and 100 minor historical nations/cultures. Id definitely go for a province system instead of cities, although the world would be made of squares or hexs modelled onto a 3d world map (random generated or accurate earth, with true start positions etc) that you can spin around (no more weird polar effects).

The provinces would be dynamically created and destroyed. Much of the world would start off with no provinces. When you take a
special explorer / settler expedition into unclaimed land you can make a new province (and name it). The productivity, farming, defensibility etc of the province would be determined by the squares it contains. Early expansion would be a lot more through conquering or diplo annexing minor tribes and nations, not through settling vacant land.

Actual land armies would only move province to province. Air units and boats however would use ‘squares’ and have fluid movements, but air units would have to travel to the central 'main town' square of a province to attack it. Luxury goods and resources would be needed for building things, with quantities, stockpiling, consumption rates etc. Trade of actual resource units would be a big part of the game.

If not making a special building (of which there would be few), each province could be set to improving agriculture, transport links, mining, goods / processing manufacture, improve industry, improve forts etc or you could order people to make as many goods or food or science or trade as possible. The provinces would never be idle. You dont need to keep fiddling with build queues etc, just check in now and again.

There would be central unit building like HoI/imperialism, with allowed unit placement in far off places based on the industry there. Provinces would have population, each with varying religion, culture, and jobs.

Research would be a tree like civ, but with different routes, so you dont have to go down european fuedalism and monothesim route to get advanced. Maybe go through hypothetical routes like ancient mediterranean with no dark age, or very advanced native american tech.

Like imperalism and Hoi there would be set classes of units like light infantry, heavy infantry etc, but a large amount of units for them as the tech progresses. There would also be special, unique units, like samurai/panzers etc. Special units would be given by what kind of nation you create as you play, not just what you chose at the start. The unit stats would be set to give combat bonuses etc to different classes, like pike v horse or mg vs other infantry. New classes like fighters would appear when you get the tech, and the options for them would keep getting upgraded. You'd be able to choose 'add ons' like guided missiles or naptha jars that you research and choose different things like plate or mail armour, machine gun or rifle or SMG, sword or pike etc.

Battles would show up in a little window, played out fast, kind of like EU but showing more detail, showing closeness of units and what kind of attack they are doing, and giving you the chance to give limited orders like suicide attack, cautious, skirmish etc (or have generals auto-manage it). Battles would be more destructive on units than EU but much less than Civ's to-the-death battles. Organization and morale would feature, also supply (which stops your ancient galley sailing around the world for a thousand years).

Add in all cool ideas for religion, diplomacy, culture effects, specials like colonists/traders, radically different effects for governments, cool UN stuff, nice map modes.... A scenario editor (full range of accurate historical scenarios) with the ability to script events and designate areas on the map for use with a massive range of possible triggers and effects.... Role playing aspects behind creating your leader and nation profile.... And whatever else is cool. While the early game is expansion and survival, the late game would be world power play with cool things happening within the UN and the ability to have (effective) subtle covert things going on to spread your influence while trying to avoid nuclear war (or seeking it :) ).

Victory would depend on getting most victory conditions and not just the first. So you could win the space race in 2020, but loose because somebody had biggest score, biggest economy and got a UN election in 2050.

Well thats my idea for a cool game... when they invent machines that create computer code based from interpreting your brain waves directly, ill be able to play it. Till then... europa uuniversalis2+spinoffs, and civ i guess....
 
How many boards have you posted this thread on? I see the exact same post on Europa Universalis 2 message board..

But anyway I'd like to find a decent space strategy game. Civ2, EU2, HOMM2, and Chess are some of the best around. As far as space strategy Anacreon is the best I've come across.
 
Emphasize the humor from Castles 2 and you have a great game. :goodjob:
 
A Properly implemented and completed Emperor of the Faded Suns (ie add religious sects)
 
It would have the Battle System of the Total War Series, The Nation running, politics etc... of EU2 and Victoria and the Map generation and wonders of Civilization.
 
Hehehe, is anyone prepared for the resurrection? My ideas share many with Daftpanzer(probably because we are inspired by the same games). Anyway.....

Since a simple search for Anacreon brought me to this thread it is appropriate to start this game with Anacreon concepts. You would have a mix of cities/provinces, although all the provinces would be represented by the greatest settlement in the province. All of them can collect raw resources. However it doesn't end with ships this time, instead there will be other products that can be made from these resources. Some of these products are kinda abstract, like Intellectuals(represents the spending on educational institutions required to support an intellectual class). These kind of advanced productions occur in 'factories'. When you decide to build buildings, you are only raising the cap of how many the city/town should produce. For example, Temples would require stuff like Wood, Construction Metals, Labor. When you decide to make some temples, all you are telling the city to do is raise its caps of how many temples to have built. This means lots of simultaneous production can occur. These factories have to be maintained with special fuel resources, usually actual materials and specialized labor. Ideally supply lines between towns and cities would be more automated then in Anacreon so its easy to have farm and mine towns supplying your city.

Army creation would share elements with Hearts of Iron II. You would set up what your military composition should be(based a lot on technology). Then your cities and towns with appropriate factories and training centers would start filling those units in the priority you chose. This can also, with appropriate technology, include civilian reserve units.

War would not occur at the same time as strategic turns(yes I think I like the idea of TBS). Instead it would go to a smaller scale, PRTS on a slightly closer scale then HOI. You would still direct combat using combinations of arrows with missions indicated. So entire campaigns will likely be fought and won/lost in the early game during the inter-turn period. Sometimes wars will go longer in the post-gunpowder ages or during large scale invasions. During the turn you simply set up where your units are usually stationed, often based upon need to pacify population as much as defend/attack enemy. On this note strategic redeployment, which is always possible during peace and sometimes possible for non-engaged units in war, is how units move during the normal turn. They can only strategically redeploy where there is the infrastructure and support(including allies). This means exploration is done by specialized units and expeditions. There are other ways to add to your map knowledge that will be discussed later.

Transport between cities of all these goods will have a TC component to it. Firstly the required resources to maintain full desirable trade between two cities/towns would be dependent on these factors: 1) worse infrastructure raises the costs considerably, 2) technology 3) certain kinds of infrastructure in sending and receiving town/city. The costs of this TC are shared between the sender and receiver. In the event that TC cannot be fulfilled, prioritized resources will be sent first. Strategic attacks on infrastructure and TC will have an affect during the normal turn.

So how does this infrastructure outside cities appear? As in Anacreon, you set up constructions. These constructions are defined in the following manners: transporation connection of type x between y targets(x and y can be more than 1 and 2 kinds respectively). Then you can set up which cities/towns will contribute what to the construction. There is a TC efficiency related to distance, impeding cities/towns, and technology so empire wide contributions aren't likely till more modern eras. Military infrastructure such as airfields, supply depots, missile silos, and naval bases would be constructed in a similar manner. Military supplies would be necessary and a resource that can be stockpiled in cities by specialized military infrastructure. Obviously units can do some pillaging based on the era, but not be at 100% efficiency because of it(more useful in ancient era, but also troublesome to home armies). Things like farms, mines, and the other terrain improvements are types of 'factories' set up in cities/towns.

I do like the idea of a technology tree that is extremely varied. What technologies you can research would be determined by the domestic slider choices. These domestic sliders are the same kind seen in Paradox games. However there will usually be more than just sliders, including a couple selection boxes(has a lot to do with caste and class structures) and maybe a dial or two. Like HOI2, some slider choices prevent certain moves or ranges of moves on other sliders. Technology always prompts choices(like events), might allow additional slider range, and usually adds new factories and resources.

And important note on technology level is that later factories generally require a base of less technological infrastructure. This means that cities that mostly shipped raw or slightly processed goods and does not have the more advanced buildings will be less technologically developed. Considering that creating all this takes time always, you could say some cities/towns are at a lower tech level(based on what is required to make what they have) then your capital or tech centers.

Culture would be generated by your cities/towns much like other resources. It then spreads along transportation infrastructure. Once certain types of culture build up in a city that culture wasn't generated in, then you would get action options. These include improving conditions for trades, espionage, leeching resources, sabotage, or preparing insurrections. If it is intra civilization culture then it can be used to increase nationalism(of various degrees, based on technology) or regionalism, or reducing insurrection. Counter-espionage is also always indicated.


If all this was streamlined correctly, with powerful automation options relating to trade, this would be an awesome strategy game.
 
I'd NES.....................
 
@sir_schwick, thats a cool idea!!!

As a result of all this, I've found and downloaded Anacreon for windows :)

Abaddon said:
I'd NES.....................

@Abaddon.... Two years later I did, and another three years on I still I am :D

At first, I thought you were digging up old noobish posts of mine when I saw in my subscribed thread list that you had replied to this :)
 
What did you think of Anacreon so far? My opinion is in spoiler, but I would recommend playing a little before reading it.

Spoiler Anacreon Opinions :
Would play constantly but certain aspects of the UI are frustrating, particularly how non-streamlined it is. Also transport-supply system needs some form of automation b/c of constant production changes on planet. Really like the fact that you can be producing thousands of Trillium, tens of thousands of Supplies, and hundreds of Starships a turn yet without good logistics and strategy planning you are completely sunk against enemies with fighter hordes who are prepared.


Rereading your initial post I realize that its basically the best parts of Civilization and Europa Universalis combined, with the necessary bridges. Yep, best strategy game ever!
 
I'd like to make a combination of Civilization, SimCity, and Transport Tycoon Deluxe. At least. And include Simcopter-like minigames.

My idea is you have civilization, and you zoom into them, and you can develop the citie and the countryside around it. And then if you want, you can pilot helicopters and drive cars around, like in SimCopter and Streets of Simcity. And maybe before cars and planes you can ride horses around delivering messages.

Also, you can control companies, and have different businesses. I'm thinking lite versions of SimPark, Mall Tycoon, Zoo Tycoon, Roller Coaster Tycoon, andother ones. There's a freeware game where you can develop a university, that too. And record companies, TV tycoons. And Transport Tycoon Deluxe too. And then the companies pay taxes to the city and civilization. And depending on what the business is, the company produces an amount of happiness, education, or production. And the more you have, the higher your rating, and the more taxes you get.

If you want, you can even control a family, like in the Sims. Another lite version of course.

It's entirely peaceful, no war! And also a sandbox mode, and cheat codes 'cos I like cheat codes. And you can start any year. As you get more education, the faster you develop different technologies.

Needless to say, I am bored. And this would be a pretty massive undertaking...
 
It would be interesting if there was a TTD/Simcity/Settlers hybrid where you built your tribe up through connections of materials. This includes some of abstract materials that relate to research. Military campaigns and exploration would occur because relevant support structures were in the area.
 
Ooh, I'd love an empires game based on TTD engine :D You'd have transport, industries, cities, manpower, resources, territory, money, diplomacy, research, vehicle/unit production etc, all with detailed isometric sprite graphics, where today's PC's can support *huge* maps and thousands of objects moving at once in real time :)

Has anyone tried Open TTD? I found that a while back and had a renaissance of interest in the game for a month or two.

sir_schwick said:
What did you think of Anacreon so far? My opinion is in spoiler, but I would recommend playing a little before reading it.

I like space strategy games in principle, especially free and easily downloaded ones, however I'm still learning to play this thing. I tried one of the easy scenarios, found out how to invade the independent, near-defenceless planets, and did some of that. I haven't got very far into it yet. The supply issue seems quite scary!
 
Daftpanzer said:
Has anyone tried Open TTD? I found that a while back and had a renaissance of interest in the game for a month or two.


I am in that same renaissance right now. Whenever George releases the beta 5 for ECS I'll start playing hardcore. Also run roest's patch pack on r13019. If you are willing to accept a couple hours learning curve on patching, it is well worth the possibilities.

Daftpanzer said:
I like space strategy games in principle, especially free and easily downloaded ones, however I'm still learning to play this thing. I tried one of the easy scenarios, found out how to invade the independent, near-defenceless planets, and did some of that. I haven't got very far into it yet. The supply issue seems quite scary!

Spoiler My thoughts on Anacreon from a beginner's standpoint, good read IMHO :
At first when I played I also liked to grab all the small planets. However I now suspect that below pre-warp planets will cost you much more in support than you will get out of them. Unlike Civ, there are no free benefits to owning a city. This took me a long time to understand, but its very elegant in solving the ICS or grab everything problems in these kind of strategy games.

My advice on supply lines is two parts: 1) build up the supply dependency gradually. Maybe set up a route which requires 100 transports at first. Adjust the receiving planets ISSP down enough so its a portion of the expected material per turn(M/T).
2) don't make your supply lines very long. 3 spaces really is the maximum for transports. The reason I say this is that the (M/T) efficiency for each transport(lets call this M/TT) lowers significantly with each square. What is M/T, it is how many effective materials per turn are being delivered to a planet. If a convoy brought 200 supplies to a planet every two turns, then the effect is usefully equivalent to a convoy coming every turn with 100 supplies. It has a M/T of 100 for supplies. So if a freighter fleet with 100 transports with supplies(200 supplies) goes to a planet 1 square away, it can deliver every two turns. That means 100 transports provide 100 M/T. This translates to 1 M/TT. If the planet is 2 squares away, it can deliver every four turns. That is a M/T of 50 and a .5 M/TT.
Considering how limited a resource transports are in the early game, it is likely you won't even be able to fulfill your logistics loads. Jump transports are usually a poor solution due to a .2 M/TT.

I've also discovered that you don't have to designation a lot of specialty planets to support your base and shipbuilding planets. The ISSP designators of over 100% can do pretty well on supplying neighboring planets with various resources, even for base and shipbuilding worlds.

Some major exceptions include Desert and Underground worlds, which I strip of trillium as soon as I acquire them. Trillium is something you will always have want of, and you would rather have a strategic reserve rather than have to defend a Desert planet. Also it means that even at the usual efficient production rates of 5000+ trillium a turn your transport network won't be strained. Here is where jump transports can shine. Never hesitate to take desert worlds stuck in the middle of an enemy empire and then ship out all its wealth on jumptransports.

Anyway, those are some things that took me a while to figure out and may prove useful.
 
In short: Spore + Civ4 + GalCiv2 + Empire Earth/Age of Empires + The Guild 2 + Sims2 =

a 4X game with RTS and TBS modes, where you have total control over everything, including the ruling family / party / national heroes, and what furniture and clothing they use. And zoom in view for the RTS battles.

Only to be enjoyed with the ultimate alcohol beverage in small doses. Director's cut edition includes a free coupon for obsessive-compulsive disorder counseling.


To be followed by a MMO edition which adds in guild-coop play, VOIP, and where real currency buys booster effects, including limited edition lingerie for your characters.
 
Another simple, yet brilliant feature would be detail. Resources would not only be based upon iron, wood, food etc. but actual products like bolts, swords, plates, dang even wedding rings and dog collars. Of course much of this would be automatized, but you can then choose where in your nation you'd work - as a general or a simple factory dude. :lol:
 
Sounds like Dwarf Fortress: Swords of obsidian engraved with an jade image of a dog collar, menacing with spikes of whale bone.
 
Dwarf fortress is just including dwarves, not people. I would kill for allowing myself to play through an alternate historical timeline on a random map - with greeks.
 
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