The UU-A-Day Countdown

[Babri]

Cities are NEVER assimilated

Then why do you call Constantinople as Istanbul & why was Istanbul given to Turkey after WW1. According to your logic a Byzantine Empire should have been revived instead of giving those territories to Turkey because Constantinople was never assimilated.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Then why do you call Constantinople as Istanbul & why was Istanbul given to Turkey after WW1. According to your logic a Byzantine Empire should have been revived instead of giving those territories to Turkey because Constantinople was never assimilated.

I'm talking about in Civ V not in Real life.

 

[Me,myself,and,I]

No, because eventually culture becomes 100% that of the conquerer.

 

[Louis XXIV]

I'm talking about in Civ V not in Real life.

Well, think about previous Civ games. I don't see the need for a change the concept of assimilation this time around.

 

[Snoopaloop]

Thanks for the links on the first page ShaqFu!

Do we know the game mechanics on how the great general spawns? If its like Civ4, would the Samurai basically have its own Imperialistic trait, just giving it a certian % extra toward the GG pool?

 

[KrikkitTwo]

No, because eventually culture becomes 100% that of the conquerer.

That's in Civ IV

in Civ 5 the city identity never changes.

The culture produced by London will take unoccupied tiles and give them to the city of London. (which makes the tiles part of whatever empire controls London)

The culture produced by London also goes to spend on Social Policies of whoever controls London.

But unless the English control London, London is a conquered city.. and whoever controls London gets extra unhappiness... this does not change with time. (buildings can change the unhappiness, but they can't change the fact that London belongs to the English.)

 

[DalekDavros]

The amount of deforestation will be a significant factor. If the Civ IV "no more trees on the planet" style is still a good strategy, there should be lots of flatland available.

Polobo: Why would we give all/many of our units a Shock I promotion if we knew it'd be wasteful when Samurai come around? Especially if the majority of combat will be taking place at strategic locations, I'm guessing that upgrades mitigating/enhancing the defense bonuses of hills/forests will be more useful for the earlier units anyway.

 

[ShaqFu]

BTW Shaq, it's not a generic "combat bonus on open terrain", but rather a free Shock 1 promotion, which gives a +20% bonus. What shock 2 does could be a big influence on Samurai power level.

Good point. If the Samurai has a good upgrade path (although I can't think of what, as it's the last Iron infantry) then the upgraded units keeps Shock I. It could be a UU ability that keeps on giving, all the way up to the GDR

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Good point. If the Samurai has a good upgrade path (although I can't think of what, as it's the last Iron infantry) then the upgraded units keeps Shock I. It could be a UU ability that keeps on giving, all the way up to the GDR

Well I'd imagine the Iron Infantry, 'spears' and bows will all upgrade to Riflemen->->Mechanized Infantry

 

[Xoatl_169]

I usually go to these forums when i play a civ game/mods but a few months ago i stopped and preordered civ 5 in order to not make the wait agonizing, but its 20ish days away and i can't help myself but to come back, oh and i favorited this thread i love shaqfu's analysis on the UUs, shouldn't there be one today?!?1

Well I'd imagine the Iron Infantry, 'spears' and bows will all upgrade to Riflemen->->Mechanized Infantry

Yeah this is a good point, especially the units one or two upgrade jumps away from the samurai. Remember the Japanese had people called gun samurai`s, or atleast im pretty sure, the extra buff during the transition could reflect this, however i don`t see your units lasting that long to get to mechanized infantry without dieing. But i don`t think that anything can upgrade to the GDR.

 

[Calouste]

I'm talking about in Civ V not in Real life.

Well, the Scots lost their independence 300 years ago and they still haven't come to terms with that

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Yeah this is a good point, especially the units one or two upgrade jumps away from the samurai. Remember the Japanese had people called gun samurai`s, or atleast im pretty sure, the extra buff during the transition could reflect this, however i don`t see your units lasting that long to get to mechanized infantry without dieing. But i don`t think that anything can upgrade to the GDR.

I don't see why... since units don't automatically die in combat anymore, it is possible your initial Warrior will survive the whole game (with appropriate upgrades.)

They have stated they want you to Identify with the unit's better, so they should survive better.

 

[Xoatl_169]

I don't see why... since units don't automatically die in combat anymore, it is possible your initial Warrior will survive the whole game (with appropriate upgrades.)

They have stated they want you to Identify with the unit's better, so they should survive better.

I guess its just me, id rather see my warriors fight and die for me. I feel good pushing on without healing,having many casualities but being victorious. Saves turns and makes it seem like they died for a good cause, more gold for me

 

[Lyoncet]

The amount of deforestation will be a significant factor. If the Civ IV "no more trees on the planet" style is still a good strategy, there should be lots of flatland available.

A few different devs have commented on how they didn't like the "deforest EVERYTHING" approach that CIV encouraged, so chopping bonuses have been cut down drastically (but still exist IIRC), lumber mills are available earlier (machinery), and you get +2 research from working forest tiles if the city has a University (cause… students study harder if the campus has an arboretum?) So it looks like mass early deforestation isn't going to be the be-all-end-all strategy it was in almost every case in CIV, and a few previewers have confirmed that.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

A few different devs have commented on how they didn't like the "deforest EVERYTHING" approach that CIV encouraged, so chopping bonuses have been cut down drastically (but still exist IIRC), lumber mills are available earlier (machinery), and you get +2 research from working forest tiles if the city has a University (cause… students study harder if the campus has an arboretum?) So it looks like mass early deforestation isn't going to be the be-all-end-all strategy it was in almost every case in CIV, and a few previewers have confirmed that.

The +2 research is just Jungle.

I'd imagine that deforestation is only worthwhile in the first few cities, and in cities that you want to be food/gold focused.

 

[Lyoncet]

The +2 research is just Jungle.

Oh right, my bad on that. Still, I agree in that it looks like the first few cities could benefit from limited chopping, but it really seems to me that the hammers you get from chopping are more of a condolence of "hey, you had to spend 5 precious turns on your worker (since they can't stack now) just getting rid of that forest so you could put a farm there. Here's a few hammers for your troubles" than anything else, but, like always, we'll have to see.

 

[Schalke 04]

Especially if the majority of combat will be taking place at strategic locations, I'm guessing that upgrades mitigating/enhancing the defense bonuses of hills/forests will be more useful for the earlier units anyway.

That's a good point.

Moreover I'm wondering what happens to a japanese Swordsmen when it gets a Gold-Upgrade to a Samurai. What if this Swordsmen Unit already has won a lot of battles and gained a lot experience. Maybe this Unit already got a Shock promotion...?

Would the unique ability of a Samurai be wasted in this case?

 

[KrikkitTwo]

That's a good point.

Moreover I'm wondering what happens to a japanese Swordsmen when it gets a Gold-Upgrade to a Samurai. What if this Swordsmen Unit already has won a lot of battles and gained a lot experience. Maybe this Unit already got a Shock promotion...?

Would the unique ability of a Samurai be wasted in this case?

It'll still get the extra Great General generation, but I would tend to think the "Free Shock" would be wasted".

 

[MisterBarca]

That's a good point.

Moreover I'm wondering what happens to a japanese Swordsmen when it gets a Gold-Upgrade to a Samurai. What if this Swordsmen Unit already has won a lot of battles and gained a lot experience. Maybe this Unit already got a Shock promotion...?

Would the unique ability of a Samurai be wasted in this case?

Then don't give them a Shock promotion?

 

[Schalke 04]

Then don't give them a Shock promotion?

Well, that's obviously true...

However, this somehow is a limitation for a player who chooses Japan at a civ and deserves at least to be mentioned in a discussion about strategic implications of UUs.

However, I hope that the free promotion counts not just for produced units, but for updated as well.