Ok I got it. I look forward to putting that cav army to work right away. I presume we can't join in slaves for we are a pure country with no "furriners". If there are any other comments please suggest away.
Tim01: Defiant Diplomats
- Thread starter TimBentley
- Start date
Slaves, no. But our own workers could be joined. We kept them to build railroads, but without coal there is not much for them to do. So unless you will be able to get us coal somehow, do join them to cities to boost our economy. We'll build new workers later when we need them.
Pre-Turn Once again JJ has left me with nothing to do but fight to the end. Thanks JJ. I stare at the screen for about 10 minutes trying to figure things out and am afraid to hit enter. Enter
IBT Vikes bomb away and here comes a stack of 11 berserks, 2 cav and 3 muskets and they kill the poor conscript. Persians bomb Richmond and the walls come down. 3 bows attack Portland and our musket goes elite. We get an addition to the top of the palace. I figure its the best place to hide.
1275 I start with a vet cav on a Persian Cav and lose. Not a good start. I then send a elite to finish and voila we get the great leader MacArthur. Nice start!!
Then take Denver to see if we can coax Ragnar into peace...
Not happenin'....
Fill the other army with rifles to absorb the Berserk onslaught. Try to get healthy.
IBT Vikes attack at Vegas and 1st redlines and the second finishes our rifle. Richmond bombed. Lose vet rifle then con rifle and finish by losing a 2 hp cav and we lose Richmond too. Our army at Denver gets bombed. Note to self keep armies off the coasts. Vikes start Univ Suffer.
1280 DC goes into disorder stop the rest before it continues. Start by taking back Vegas and eliminate redlined cav. Fortify at DC and Miami which will be under siege. Cannons go 2-5 at Gunpowder and knight army goes 10/18 killing both Iroq rifles.
IBT Bombings continue at Cape Cod, Chicago, Baltimore and Denver. Vike stack goes 3 different ways. Aztecs ask to trade WMs and we throw in a 10g tribute after. Persians MA with Aztecs. Unreal. At least we get our cash back. +237. Kill 6 immortals and 2 rifles at DC and 2 others pillage.
1285 Knight army kills vike elite musket 14/18, kills other stack musket 9/18 and finish with a berserk 9/18. I want them unprotected. 14/18 cav army kills Iroq rifle and goes 11/18 at iron, then spear no damage and 2nd spear 9/18. Arty goes 2-5 at gunpowder on Persian rifle and Elite MI goes 2/5. Cav Army at Denver kills pers. Cav at DC 18/18, take 2nd cav 15/18 and 3rd cav 15/18. No cav in sight. There are 11 rifles within 2 of DC though. Another 7 with 3 bows within 3 tiles. At Miami Rifle goes elite in army killing berserk 17/17, kills another and 16/17. DC cav army 11/18 on pers rifle, 10/18 2nd and 7/18 on 3rd.
IBT Bombings and conquistadors show up at gunpowder and kill MI. Oh boy. At Denver vet redlines cav and conscript kills cav. Lose Orlando.
1290 Fortify.
IBT Bombings. Berserk attacks rifle army and loses. Lose Red Sea Port to 2 conquistadors. Lose a rifle at Denver 2nd holds on and promotes after cav and immortal attack. France jump on the pile at Hiawathas request. Many Aztec cavs appear.
1295 Take back Red Sea Port with knight army 13/18 by knocking out both conquistadors. Kill musket covering berserk with cav army 12/18. Kill Iroq rifle that was dropped off at the Cape with cav army but takes it toll 4/18. Kill 2 persian rifles by DC with army 13/18.
IBT Bombings continue. Some how our rifle army holds on after the bombardment and a berserk attack. 3 conquistadors attack knight army at Red Sea and they redline. Denver rifle kills 2 persian cav and we get leader Patton
until a reg Persian rifle takes Denver.
Horsetown assaulted and we lose a rifle but reg rifle redlines 1 but kills 3 cav and goes elite. French and Mongol boats appear.
1300 DC disorder so I cycle through and there are lots of unhappy people. They would really like gems. So I turn up lux to 10%. Kill Persian cav dropped off near Chicago with cav. Knight army at Red Sea is in trouble as there are at least 6 conquistadors and some Spanish knights too.
Summary-
Defiant to the last it seems. We are being infiltrated on all fronts and theres not much we can do about it. Persians galore, Iroquois wrapping around the mountains of the Red Sea, Vikes to our east, Spaniards near our saltpeter towns and all the sudden a ton of Aztec cav. We are at war with everyone but the Celts and they have a trade embargo. This is a dogpile that keeps getting bigger and bigger. I put all cities on cavalry because we may lose our saltpeter in the IBT. I leave it up to Skunk if he wants to change it.
Not so nice. I have no solutions to our dilemma. Maybe its tune to pull back to the core. Any other thoughts?
And the save....
Save
IBT Vikes bomb away and here comes a stack of 11 berserks, 2 cav and 3 muskets and they kill the poor conscript. Persians bomb Richmond and the walls come down. 3 bows attack Portland and our musket goes elite. We get an addition to the top of the palace. I figure its the best place to hide.
1275 I start with a vet cav on a Persian Cav and lose. Not a good start. I then send a elite to finish and voila we get the great leader MacArthur. Nice start!!
Then take Denver to see if we can coax Ragnar into peace...
Not happenin'....
Fill the other army with rifles to absorb the Berserk onslaught. Try to get healthy.
IBT Vikes attack at Vegas and 1st redlines and the second finishes our rifle. Richmond bombed. Lose vet rifle then con rifle and finish by losing a 2 hp cav and we lose Richmond too. Our army at Denver gets bombed. Note to self keep armies off the coasts. Vikes start Univ Suffer.
1280 DC goes into disorder stop the rest before it continues. Start by taking back Vegas and eliminate redlined cav. Fortify at DC and Miami which will be under siege. Cannons go 2-5 at Gunpowder and knight army goes 10/18 killing both Iroq rifles.
IBT Bombings continue at Cape Cod, Chicago, Baltimore and Denver. Vike stack goes 3 different ways. Aztecs ask to trade WMs and we throw in a 10g tribute after. Persians MA with Aztecs. Unreal. At least we get our cash back. +237. Kill 6 immortals and 2 rifles at DC and 2 others pillage.
1285 Knight army kills vike elite musket 14/18, kills other stack musket 9/18 and finish with a berserk 9/18. I want them unprotected. 14/18 cav army kills Iroq rifle and goes 11/18 at iron, then spear no damage and 2nd spear 9/18. Arty goes 2-5 at gunpowder on Persian rifle and Elite MI goes 2/5. Cav Army at Denver kills pers. Cav at DC 18/18, take 2nd cav 15/18 and 3rd cav 15/18. No cav in sight. There are 11 rifles within 2 of DC though. Another 7 with 3 bows within 3 tiles. At Miami Rifle goes elite in army killing berserk 17/17, kills another and 16/17. DC cav army 11/18 on pers rifle, 10/18 2nd and 7/18 on 3rd.
IBT Bombings and conquistadors show up at gunpowder and kill MI. Oh boy. At Denver vet redlines cav and conscript kills cav. Lose Orlando.
1290 Fortify.
IBT Bombings. Berserk attacks rifle army and loses. Lose Red Sea Port to 2 conquistadors. Lose a rifle at Denver 2nd holds on and promotes after cav and immortal attack. France jump on the pile at Hiawathas request. Many Aztec cavs appear.
1295 Take back Red Sea Port with knight army 13/18 by knocking out both conquistadors. Kill musket covering berserk with cav army 12/18. Kill Iroq rifle that was dropped off at the Cape with cav army but takes it toll 4/18. Kill 2 persian rifles by DC with army 13/18.
IBT Bombings continue. Some how our rifle army holds on after the bombardment and a berserk attack. 3 conquistadors attack knight army at Red Sea and they redline. Denver rifle kills 2 persian cav and we get leader Patton
until a reg Persian rifle takes Denver.
Horsetown assaulted and we lose a rifle but reg rifle redlines 1 but kills 3 cav and goes elite. French and Mongol boats appear.
1300 DC disorder so I cycle through and there are lots of unhappy people. They would really like gems. So I turn up lux to 10%. Kill Persian cav dropped off near Chicago with cav. Knight army at Red Sea is in trouble as there are at least 6 conquistadors and some Spanish knights too.
Summary-
Defiant to the last it seems. We are being infiltrated on all fronts and theres not much we can do about it. Persians galore, Iroquois wrapping around the mountains of the Red Sea, Vikes to our east, Spaniards near our saltpeter towns and all the sudden a ton of Aztec cav. We are at war with everyone but the Celts and they have a trade embargo. This is a dogpile that keeps getting bigger and bigger. I put all cities on cavalry because we may lose our saltpeter in the IBT. I leave it up to Skunk if he wants to change it.
Not so nice. I have no solutions to our dilemma. Maybe its tune to pull back to the core. Any other thoughts?
And the save....
Save
Preturn check - Well, we're doomed. 
Lots and lots of enemy units far within our borders.
East coast: 6 vikings, including cavs.
west front: 31 persians, nothing with more than 4 attack points though.
South front: 43 iroquis, dito there. But also 6 aztec cavs with more to come.
We could abandon a few cities, retreat to our core and fortify there. But then our enemies would use our roads and move even faster to our remaining cities. And to our retreating units. Besides, we do not have many units to retreat anyway.
I draft units in San Francisco, Boston, Chicago, Cape Cod, Phoenix and Cleveland.
IBT
Vikings attack Cape Cod. They bombard the city forever, just how many frigates do they have? Barracks destroyed, citizens killed, defenders down to a single hp. They lose 1 berserk, we lose 1 rifleman, 1 cav army and Cape cod falls.
Spain attack Red Sea Port. They lose 3 knights, we lose 1 knight army and the city falls. Lose a cannon too.
Mongols land 3 horsemen near Las Vegas.
Persians bombard and pillage a lot. They attack Baltimore and lose 2 cavs, we lose nothing.
Aztecs attack Red Sea Whales. They lose 1 cav, we lose 1 rifleman, the city falls.
Lots of Aztec cavs arrive.
French ships bombard a little.
Iroquis move around a lot and finally pillage our saltpeter.
Gunpowder Source riots.
Buffalo: cav->rifleman
At least we can still build riflemen, as they need no resources at all.
And. We discover coal in Portland!
(1) 1305 AD - No peace.
France, Aztecs and Spain won't even talk to us.
We bombard a few units.
Draft units in Ironman, New York, Washington, San Francisco.
Rush the barracks in Portland.
We abandon horsetown in an attempt to hold the southern front a little longer.
We kill 2 aztec cavs.
IBT
Vikings bombard Las Vegas and Chicago back to the stone age.
They attack Miami, lose 2 berserks, we lose nothing.
They attack Las Vegas from the sea, we lose 1 rifleman, 1 cavalry and the city falls.
The Spanish attack Gunpowder Source, we lose 1 rifleman, the city falls. We also lose 2 cannons and a bunch of workers.
Mongols attack New York, they lose 1 horseman, but the defenses hold.
Persians bombard a little and move around a lot. Persian cavs arrive.
Aztecs attack Los Angeles, we lose 2 cavs, the city falls.
Iroquis attack Cleveland, they lose 10 longbows and archers, we lose 2 riflemen, the city falls.
Washington, New York, Miami, Ironman: cav->rifleman
Portland: barracks->rifleman
Phoenix riots
(2) 1310 AD - Still no peace.
We increase the luxury slider a notch to keep our people from rioting.
Shuffle around units waiting for the next attack wave.
IBT
Endless bombardment from the vikings but no attack.
A Spanish conquistador reach deep into our core and attacks San francisco but our defenses hold.
Celts and Mongols sign an embargo against us.
Persia attack Buffalo, they lose 1 cav, we lose nothing.
Aztecs attack Ironman City, they lose 4 cavs, we lose 1 musketman, 1 rifleman and the city falls. Lots and lots of workers are captured.
Iroquis attack Portland, they lose 1 rifleman.
Boston riots.
(3) 1315 AD - Still no peace
The Aztecs advanced even faster than I thought, but now our cav army is eager to get back in the game.
We take back Ironman City, killing 2 Aztec cavs. We also get all our workers back.
Kill 1 viking cav, 1 persian musket, 2 aztec cav.
Draft units in Chicago, Washington, New York.
IBT
The vikings strikes again. They lose the first cav, but the second kills our rifleman and razes Baltimore.
The vikings also attack New York and San Francisco, but our defenses hold.
The mongols attack New York, they lose 1 horseman, our defenses hold.
Scandinavia and India sign an MPP.
Persia attack Buffalo, they lose 1 rifleman, 2 cavs, we lose 2 riflemen and the city falls. Some workers are captured too.
Aztecs attack New York, we lose 3 riflemen, they capture the city.
They attack Dallas, lose 2 cavs.
They also attack San Francisco, but retreat again.
Iroquis attack Portland, they lose 1 rifleman, we lose 2 riflemen, they capture the city.
Chicago: cav->rifleman
(4) 1320 AD - Still no peace.
Kill 2 viking cavs.
Draft more units in Boston, Washington, Phoenix, Ironman city.
Increase lux rate another notch.
IBT - And here they come...
Vikings land a stack of death near Miami, at least 15 units.
Mongols land some cavs and horseman also near Miami.
Persia send in lots and lots of units. They attack San Franciso and capture Boston.
Spanish conquistadors reach far into our core.
Aztecs attack San Francisco and lose several cavs but the city stands.
Washington: rifleman->rifleman
San Francisco: cav->rifleman
Houston: cav->rifleman
(5) 1325 AD - Still no peace. France, Aztecs and Spain still won't talk at all.
This is all that is left of our kingdom. From 20 to 8 cities in 5 turns...
I haven't moved much this turn since I feel that we need to discuss how we shall survive this.
Save
Lots and lots of enemy units far within our borders.
East coast: 6 vikings, including cavs.
west front: 31 persians, nothing with more than 4 attack points though.
South front: 43 iroquis, dito there. But also 6 aztec cavs with more to come.
We could abandon a few cities, retreat to our core and fortify there. But then our enemies would use our roads and move even faster to our remaining cities. And to our retreating units. Besides, we do not have many units to retreat anyway.
I draft units in San Francisco, Boston, Chicago, Cape Cod, Phoenix and Cleveland.
IBT
Vikings attack Cape Cod. They bombard the city forever, just how many frigates do they have? Barracks destroyed, citizens killed, defenders down to a single hp. They lose 1 berserk, we lose 1 rifleman, 1 cav army and Cape cod falls.
Spain attack Red Sea Port. They lose 3 knights, we lose 1 knight army and the city falls. Lose a cannon too.
Mongols land 3 horsemen near Las Vegas.
Persians bombard and pillage a lot. They attack Baltimore and lose 2 cavs, we lose nothing.
Aztecs attack Red Sea Whales. They lose 1 cav, we lose 1 rifleman, the city falls.
Lots of Aztec cavs arrive.
French ships bombard a little.
Iroquis move around a lot and finally pillage our saltpeter.
Gunpowder Source riots.
Buffalo: cav->rifleman
At least we can still build riflemen, as they need no resources at all.
And. We discover coal in Portland!
(1) 1305 AD - No peace.
France, Aztecs and Spain won't even talk to us.
We bombard a few units.
Draft units in Ironman, New York, Washington, San Francisco.
Rush the barracks in Portland.
We abandon horsetown in an attempt to hold the southern front a little longer.
We kill 2 aztec cavs.
IBT
Vikings bombard Las Vegas and Chicago back to the stone age.
They attack Miami, lose 2 berserks, we lose nothing.
They attack Las Vegas from the sea, we lose 1 rifleman, 1 cavalry and the city falls.
The Spanish attack Gunpowder Source, we lose 1 rifleman, the city falls. We also lose 2 cannons and a bunch of workers.
Mongols attack New York, they lose 1 horseman, but the defenses hold.
Persians bombard a little and move around a lot. Persian cavs arrive.
Aztecs attack Los Angeles, we lose 2 cavs, the city falls.
Iroquis attack Cleveland, they lose 10 longbows and archers, we lose 2 riflemen, the city falls.
Washington, New York, Miami, Ironman: cav->rifleman
Portland: barracks->rifleman
Phoenix riots
(2) 1310 AD - Still no peace.
We increase the luxury slider a notch to keep our people from rioting.
Shuffle around units waiting for the next attack wave.
IBT
Endless bombardment from the vikings but no attack.
A Spanish conquistador reach deep into our core and attacks San francisco but our defenses hold.
Celts and Mongols sign an embargo against us.
Persia attack Buffalo, they lose 1 cav, we lose nothing.
Aztecs attack Ironman City, they lose 4 cavs, we lose 1 musketman, 1 rifleman and the city falls. Lots and lots of workers are captured.
Iroquis attack Portland, they lose 1 rifleman.
Boston riots.
(3) 1315 AD - Still no peace
The Aztecs advanced even faster than I thought, but now our cav army is eager to get back in the game.
We take back Ironman City, killing 2 Aztec cavs. We also get all our workers back.
Kill 1 viking cav, 1 persian musket, 2 aztec cav.
Draft units in Chicago, Washington, New York.
IBT
The vikings strikes again. They lose the first cav, but the second kills our rifleman and razes Baltimore.
The vikings also attack New York and San Francisco, but our defenses hold.
The mongols attack New York, they lose 1 horseman, our defenses hold.
Scandinavia and India sign an MPP.
Persia attack Buffalo, they lose 1 rifleman, 2 cavs, we lose 2 riflemen and the city falls. Some workers are captured too.
Aztecs attack New York, we lose 3 riflemen, they capture the city.
They attack Dallas, lose 2 cavs.
They also attack San Francisco, but retreat again.
Iroquis attack Portland, they lose 1 rifleman, we lose 2 riflemen, they capture the city.
Chicago: cav->rifleman
(4) 1320 AD - Still no peace.
Kill 2 viking cavs.
Draft more units in Boston, Washington, Phoenix, Ironman city.
Increase lux rate another notch.
IBT - And here they come...
Vikings land a stack of death near Miami, at least 15 units.
Mongols land some cavs and horseman also near Miami.
Persia send in lots and lots of units. They attack San Franciso and capture Boston.
Spanish conquistadors reach far into our core.
Aztecs attack San Francisco and lose several cavs but the city stands.
Washington: rifleman->rifleman
San Francisco: cav->rifleman
Houston: cav->rifleman
(5) 1325 AD - Still no peace. France, Aztecs and Spain still won't talk at all.
This is all that is left of our kingdom. From 20 to 8 cities in 5 turns...
I haven't moved much this turn since I feel that we need to discuss how we shall survive this.
Save
That is U-G-L-Y!
It's not even their quality but quantity with pillagers and naval bombardment.
I'm not sure with the variant there is any chance of recovery but do we defy to the end and suicide to Portland? It's the only hope the way I see it.
It's not even their quality but quantity with pillagers and naval bombardment.
I'm not sure with the variant there is any chance of recovery but do we defy to the end and suicide to Portland? It's the only hope the way I see it.
TimBentley
Deity
Ouch. The Vikings are on the kill-list now too, as if it mattered. And it looks like three cities could fall next turn, too. I'm not sure if survival is possible.
Pied Piper
Warlord
I believe the phrase you are looking for is "Death with Dignity". The question I have is do we want to try again, maybe with 7 instead of 11 civs.
Death with defiance and dignity. 
The only possibility for this game I could see is if we concentrated in Iron Man and took back Portland. Even then the odds are astronomical.
Count me in on a 2nd try. I think as long we don't get razed we'd be fine. Better to abandon in the worst case.
The only possibility for this game I could see is if we concentrated in Iron Man and took back Portland. Even then the odds are astronomical.Count me in on a 2nd try. I think as long we don't get razed we'd be fine. Better to abandon in the worst case.
This is lost. Too bad, since it was a fun game.
I will be in for another try, but I think we will have to look over the rules. Especially the part about all conquered cities have to be razed.
Razing = insanely furious AIs.
Furious - no hopes for diplomatic win, or even peace without concessions.
jj
I will be in for another try, but I think we will have to look over the rules. Especially the part about all conquered cities have to be razed.
Razing = insanely furious AIs.
Furious - no hopes for diplomatic win, or even peace without concessions.
jj
If we play on I say, abandon Dallas first.
Also, maybe move troops out of coastal towns IBT (if they cant be taken by enemy troops on land, that is.) Then into the towns IT. All this bombardment stinks.
Will look at the save when I get home, and post more comments.
I dont like giving in before its all dawn.
Also, maybe move troops out of coastal towns IBT (if they cant be taken by enemy troops on land, that is.) Then into the towns IT. All this bombardment stinks.
Will look at the save when I get home, and post more comments.
I dont like giving in before its all dawn.
Pied Piper
Warlord
I think if we stick by the same rules that we cannot allow a single city to be taken no matter what, even if it has to be abandoned or given away.
TimBentley
Deity
I decided to play it out. Surprisingly, between the strength of the rifle army and the stupidity of the AI, Ironman City lived up to its name and managed to survive alone from 1345 to 1365. The Celts and Indians signed MAs against us, so we appropriately ended at war with everybody.
The razings certainly were the cause of our trouble. I wonder how things might have been different if we didn't pop that settler. I've learned it's wise to prepare a defiant game like it could be AW. I'll be gone until a week from Monday, so I think I'll start up another try then. Probably the same settings, but standard instead of large. I originally was thinking more civs would be better in case we made a few of them irredeemably angry, but less potential enemies would be nice.
The razings certainly were the cause of our trouble. I wonder how things might have been different if we didn't pop that settler. I've learned it's wise to prepare a defiant game like it could be AW. I'll be gone until a week from Monday, so I think I'll start up another try then. Probably the same settings, but standard instead of large. I originally was thinking more civs would be better in case we made a few of them irredeemably angry, but less potential enemies would be nice.
I am in.
Also, the next time, we have to be more aware of our rep. That means trading maps and resources/lux/tech whenever we can do it in a more or less profitable manner. If we are going to win by diplo we will have to make more friends than this time.
But, as already stated above, the razings really made everything go belly-up.
jj
Also, the next time, we have to be more aware of our rep. That means trading maps and resources/lux/tech whenever we can do it in a more or less profitable manner. If we are going to win by diplo we will have to make more friends than this time.
But, as already stated above, the razings really made everything go belly-up.
jj
TimBentley
Deity
Tim02: Revenge of the Defiant Diplomats is up. Please check in.
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