Tupac08 - Simply Sid

[Daeron]

Before I say I've got the save. It's likely that if I play the next turns it will only be after this weekend. So if Tupac can play this weekend, maybe it's a good time to swap turns, so he can get some turns in as well.

 

[tupaclives]

I have my biggest exam this afternoon, so I can probably play tomorrow (as in 24 hours from now). So I will take this next turnset if thats ok with you Daeron (would you prefer a swap?) but I will probably need another skip for the round after that.

 

[Daeron]

Let's make it a swap then, I'll play the rounds after you're done and we go back to CKS and del62

 

[tupaclives]

Pre-Flight

Start by optimising our specialists. We can still only get espionage in 2 but we have a surplus of +82gpt to help our coffers a little.

Not much left to do.

Plan → Continue pillaging, try and slow down the juggernaught that is Portugal…

Not wanting to sound pessimistic but not sure if we have any plans on actually invading Portugal?

IBT – Watch Portugese tanks roaming… planning an invasion?

Turn 1: New Breda: Settler → arty. Continue pillaging, continue RR. Worried VERY much about Marines…

IBT – zzz

Turn 2: Espionage comes in. Research shuts off. Portugese start Hoover Dam. Turn all our scientists into taxmen. Our income jumps to +928gpt.

IBT – Portugese ships roll into view but stop just short of our land. Invasion imminent.

Turn 3: We complete the Intelligence Agency. Amsterdam goes back on Army duty. We successfully plant spies in Babylon, Portugal and Mongolia.

Portugal’s army is…. Scary.

1 Marine – he could completely destroy us… if he lands in a coastal city and then they unload into it they could pretty much wipe out our whole empire in a few turns.
32 Riflemen
1 Cavalry
218 infantry
84 Tanks
7 arty
8 frigates
27 transports
4 Carriers
3 Subs
46 Destroyers
5 Battleships
15 Bombers
11 Guerillas
6 Cruisers
37 TOW
8 Mobile SAMs.

IBT – Portugal unloads tanks and infantry next to Amsterdam.

Turn 4: Bombard the force down to redline. Portugal has a MASSIVE fleet just south of Amsterdam (~8 transports with many battleships, destroyers, cruisers, frigates etc. as escort). Do some leader fishing on their landed stack but no luck. No losses either though (6-0).
Babylon is down to one city. I think, seeing as our rep is already toasty, try and make peace with them and trade techs for GPT. They won’t be around for long.

Portugal will currently give us peace straight up. Just so we know.

IBT – Portugal bombs our knight army and one cav army to death… Portugal lands a truly MASSIVE SoD next to Amsterdam (12 Infantry, 14 tanks, 2 Mobile SAMs).

Turn 5: I’m pausing here. I just don’t know how to proceed guys :-(

Here’s the save…

I'm not throwing in the towel but here's my $0.02
Really, I see 2 possible ways forward. We can probably repel the force currently in our lands, with losses, but I don’t see how we’re going to assemble a force to challenge Portugal. I think our last hope rests with a diplomatic victory if we can steal/trade/buy our way to Fission before Portugal does and have a suitable pre-build to snare the UN. DoW on Portugal and sign everyone living into the fold. 2/3 civs is enough to snag victory (if the Mongols are still alive). The only other option is to hope, somehow, for a space race victory.

 

[del62]

I doubt a diplomatic victory is possible, we have destroyed too many cities, we could go peace and try for space, after our pillagers are destroyed.

EDIT:

I dont think the AI would take a city with a marine AND land a massive stack inside.

 

[Daeron]

Should we worry about a cultural victory?

15 bombers isn't that much. If only we could have finished our own continent a bit sooner and we wouldn't be in this position now. I do feel we were quite close to preventing this scenario.

As it stands now, it depends on how Portugal can beat us. A space race will still gives enough time for a military solution or winning by space race ourselves. But, a cultural victory might be the biggest threat to our chances.

 

[CKS]

We have about 60 turns before Portugal hits 100K, at its present rate. I don't think we can manage a launch in time.

I also agree with del62; I don't think we can win a diplomatic victory.

I don't see another option besides military, but a temporary peace deal might get us in a little better shape. If we didn't have the bombers, that we can't deal with until we get flight, I'd be fairly optimistic. The boats aren't a big issue because our continents are so close. The tanks die easily when left in the open, and with pillaged land that happens frequently. Infantry just require lots of artillery support. Bombers that we can't even attack are the big problem.

Babylon has no really helpful techs, so I'd not worry about whether we make peace with them.

What about making peace, building military as rapidly as possible (including drafting from cities that aren't growing), and stealing towards refining. If their oil can be pillaged, we do so and try to get to flight ASAP. Drafted units can cover coastal cities against amphibious attack and they can be loaded into armies if we can't build units fast enough to keep up with cash-rushed army builds.

 

[Daeron]

Let's come up with an estimate, how many turns should we reserve for the military campaign and what kind of units do we need?

• We'll need enough bombers to take out their resources in a single turn and to dish out the most of the damage against units on the Portugese continent.
• Possibly a carrier and back up if they're shipping resources from the Babylonian isles, depends on how far our bombers can reach.
• Several infantry armies to be used to cover our advance.
• A lot of flaks to increase the chance of shooting off their bombers

If we go for a pure bombers strategy, we only really need to support them with armies and flaks.

Edit: Also, is it possible the 60 turn estimate is based on Portugal's culture gains during mobilization? I sure hope not...

 

[CKS]

If they are mobilized now, which I suppose they could be, then yes. I just took the culture and culture per turn from Mapstat.

 

[Daeron]

All right, so can we see if they're mobilized by counting shields after investigating one of their towns? If so, we might need to keep the current war going and mobilize ourselves.

 

[tupaclives]

Unfortunately I'm now back in exam feast mode so I'm going to have to pass the game on at this point without any further movements

Babylon should fall any second, I suggest we make peace with Portugal around a turn before we think Babylon will fall and include a MA in the peace deal as well as as many techs as our GPT can afford. Then when Babylon falls we get our money back. Our armies on their continent are toastie so we might as well just pillage as much as we can before they die.

When Babylon falls they will come out of mobilization so our time till Cultural defeat will halve.

Daeron: Cape on, suit up. We need a superman effort...

Good luck!

 

[CKS]

If we want to prolong things, we could give Babylon a well-protected city in the midst of our continent.

 

[Daeron]

If we want to prolong things, we could give Babylon a well-protected city in the midst of our continent.

I'll investigate a city to check their shield count and if they're mobilized I'll give the Babylonians a city.

 

[del62]

Does Babylon have anywhere near half the culture for a cultural victory, as they wont exactly be adding much new culture

 

[CKS]

No, they don't. This just prolongs things by keeping Portugal mobilized.

 

[ray22]

Lurker's Comment:

Hi guys. Had a quick look at your game.

First of all you can find where Portugal's oil is.
As CKS said, oil can be found only in marsh, desert, tundra. So by investigating 3 of their cities, you know where their oil is (won't spoil it).

That said, things look a bit grim.
If you have only 60 turns (unless if Port. mobilizes), before a cultural defeat, your only realistic chance to win this IMHO, is domination.

If I were you, I would use all the cash to rush armies, many Frigates/galleons and start from the big portoguese island and proceed to the south of their continent. Keep their oil disconnected (2 infantry armies) and cav armies should do the rest.

Not easy, but doable IMO.

 

[CKS]

So by investigating 3 of their cities, you know where their oil is (won't spoil it).

Does investigating cities show locations of resources within the city limits, even when you can't ordinarily detect the resource? This is interesting. I would never have suspected this.

 

[Elephantium]

lurker's comment:
I'm guessing you can find it by counting shields ... if it's higher than the 2 for a normal forest tundra (etc...), you know where the oil is!

 

[Raliuven]

Its easier than that, just click on the city icon and it will tell you the terrain and if there are any resources on the terrain. At least that works in PTW.

 

[del62]

Its easier than that, just click on the city icon and it will tell you the terrain and if there are any resources on the terrain. At least that works in PTW.

We are talking about when we dont know refining