Turn Discussion

[HUSch]

Could somebody please RE-pause the game? I don't know why you set the timer going again, HUSch -- whatever the heck is going on with Kazakhstan, we Cavaleiros are up and would prefer not to have the timer run out on our turn without our knowledge, you know?

I would do it myself but can't get to my CIV computer right now.

Sry
But I didn't know that anybody can pause the timer, when he want this. That can't be correct.
For me was allways clear that cav would get a whole day for their turn. Because there is no turn discussion during the time out.

 

[Renata]

If Ginger Ale had ruled against Kazakhstan with the timer still running (and us unaware that you had re-started it), we might have been caught with less time on the timer than we thought there was, which could have led to trouble. That was my concern, along with the fact that Dave Shack paused the timer with clear justification: there's no other way to handle a possible reload situation. For you to just arbitrarily restart it rubbed me the wrong way.

I don't believe that we are allowed to just pause the timer whenever we want to; procedures for delay requests are spelled out in the rules. This was an unusual situation and I very much hope it won't ever happen again.

 

[HUSch]

Renata
I'm astonished, that we player can do it, that it's technical possible. Not that we don't have to do it.

 

[Lord Parkin]

Renata
I'm astonished, that we player can do it, that it's technical possible. Not that we don't have to do it.

Yes, it should not be permitted to touch the "pause" button anytime outside of an admin ruling. It's fairly easy to notice when it's been done (the timer doesn't advance if you refresh Civstats, and the game is paused when someone else logs in), and checking Civstats for the last login prior to the paused game would reveal the culprit. So given that it's so easy to detect (and consequently punish), hopefully we won't have any issues with people pausing the game outside of admin issues.

 

[Provolution]

I think we need a sort of penalty for touching the pause button outside declaring Admin rulings worked into the ruleset.

 

[DaveShack]

I think we need to be clear on something here.

At any point that someone could reasonably say to hold the save in a PBEM, they can pause the game in a pitboss. Pausing the game is the mechanism for holding the save. It has to be paused in order to request the admin's ruling.

Since we had not previously explained the pause button mechanics, it is unreasonable to read anything into this particular event. And on some keyboards it is quite possible to hit that button completely by mistake and not even know it.

We're here to have fun folks. Let's just have fun, and try not to get into a vigilante mood. If a problem develops it will be dealt with.

 

[Niklas]

Sounds obvious to me to allow the reload requested by Saturn. No need to go via admins for that.

 

[cav scout]

Yes I agree. It's good that we are learning more about pitboss mechanics.

 

[oyzar]

Well even if we learn there can still be mistakes like this, I've turned on automated promotions in my pitboss games before, sucks when it happens tho. I fully agree that a reload in this case should be allowed.

 

[Lord Parkin]

Yes I agree. It's good that we are learning more about pitboss mechanics.

Actually, the problems I mentioned affect PBEM games too. But I'm glad everyone is content to reload.

Well even if we learn there can still be mistakes like this, I've turned on automated promotions in my pitboss games before, sucks when it happens tho.

Really? How would you do that by accident? I can see no reason why you'd ever want auto-promote on in the first place. Personally, promotions are one of the most fun (not to mention powerful) things in Civ4, so I want to control them myself.

 

[Kaleb]

We should use cav scouts last login save but before he ends turn someone from saturn should login to switch automation off.

 

[Lord Parkin]

We should use cav scouts last login save but before he ends turn someone from saturn should login to switch automation off.

That's the idea. Just waiting on an announcement from DaveShack...

 

[HUSch]

Saturn requests a reload. One of our players logged in with the "Automated Workers" option checked in their game without realizing, and thus automatically set our Workers onto the wrong jobs. This is quite serious for us this early in the game, as the incorrect Worker movements will cost us considerably. Clearly this was a technical malfunction, so I hope nobody will have any issues with the reload.

For future reference: ALL players need to turn OFF options where workers start automated, units start promoted, etc. If you log into the game with these options checked, they will IMMEDIATELY apply to the game, and potentially screw up your whole team's situation! You have been warned!

EDIT: I'm not sure if a reload from the start of this turn will fix things, it may need to be the latest available save from the last turn. The automated moves were carried out when our first player logged in during this turn, so it may be necessary to go back to the end of last turn so we can cancel the automated moves before they take place. All players, please use a different name (eg Lord Parkin1) if you are logging in, so that the saves from your logins last turn will not be overwritten. This way, if the reload takes place we won't have to go back too far.

In my opinion: That is no technical malfunction.
I don't know how often I checked, my option in this game, but there is allways the risk of a wrong click, we play pitboss not Pbem.
You self has made a wrong click, that is the play.

But the community made decide.

btw
What 'li we do in combat, if there is the possibility of wrong click.

 

[Lord Parkin]

This is no "wrong click" issue. The mistake was an auto-movement option checked on an unknowing team member's computer. There is no "auto-movement" option for military units, and thus such a thing would never be a problem in wartime.

Please, don't try to pretend like this issue is somehow a fault of ours. It could have happened to any team who has new members checking into their games. Thank you.

 

[Niklas]

I think everyone realizes fully well already that misclicks in combat will stay.

 

[Kaleb]

Well I'm ready to do our turn as soon as it's reloaded and saturn have been able to undo any automation.

Just so we are clear, if there is a reload straight after the reload Saturn need to login, fix what needs fixing, and then post in turn tracker that they are done. Kaz can then login and press end turn.

So can we keep the turn discussion in here and not in the tracker thread

This brings up another point, am I correct in that all teams have the password for the game visible in their forum? This fact, combined with anyone being able to join a team, and login with any name, means there is no way to stop some random guy coming in and messing things up.

So do we perhaps want to restrict who can see the team passwords??

 

[Tinkerbell]

Technical or human, we have some examples now where people wanted to reload. Guess it's time to instruct the team members of the most common risk's and have a backup plan to do the turn if plan A fails.

For the rest, learn to live with it. Guess the teams are aware enough now.

 

[Krill]

As much as I agree that we don't want anyone to mess with the game except for the turnplayers, the downsides are pretty large unless we add clauses about different things; only getting screenshots of the game when the turnplayer logs in, not being able to have anyone esle play the save incase the turnplayer forgets/goes awol, and that we would effectively create two tiers of particpants in the game...

I'm not against it per se, I'm more of the opinion that we should allow each team to decide who can and can not join the game, and any misclicks stand, no reloads except for CTDs/bugs. The flow of the game is now starting to become quite disrupted...

 

[oyzar]

Well I'm ready to do our turn as soon as it's reloaded and saturn have been able to undo any automation.

Just so we are clear, if there is a reload straight after the reload Saturn need to login, fix what needs fixing, and then post in turn tracker that they are done. Kaz can then login and press end turn.

So can we keep the turn discussion in here and not in the tracker thread

This brings up another point, am I correct in that all teams have the password for the game visible in their forum? This fact, combined with anyone being able to join a team, and login with any name, means there is no way to stop some random guy coming in and messing things up.

So do we perhaps want to restrict who can see the team passwords??

There really isn't any way to stop people from messsing things up as such games like this are always trust based... With a helpful mod and understanding players it shouldn't be a problem though(even if it does cause a slight delay).

 

[Krill]

If we are going to reload for every single mistake a team makes this game will slow down to a crawl.