UFO: Enemy Unknown, remake by Firaxis

[Pikkis]

How is Slingshot handled now? Will it always turn up at the same point in the campaign, as before, and like Portent, or is its appearance randomised among available Council missions?

I'm not really sure if it's always this way, but in the current game each part showed up a month later than pre-EW, as Portent was before them. I first assumed that Portent was the first part of Progeny ("mysterious cargo"), but as I'm going in August with both EXALT and alien bases down, I'm not really sure anymore. No base defense yet either.

 

[PhilBowles]

I'm not really sure if it's always this way, but in the current game each part showed up a month later than pre-EW, as Portent was before them. I first assumed that Portent was the first part of Progeny ("mysterious cargo"), but as I'm going in August with both EXALT and alien bases down, I'm not really sure anymore. No base defense yet either.

Got to May now and the way it worked for me is that Portent is an extra, early-April Council mission; Slingshot shows up in late April (was partway through the second Slingshot mission, in May, when the game crashed), with a standard mission as the March council mission (although there doesn't always seem to be a March mission at all).

Not sure when EXALT turns up if you don't defeat Portent, since at least so far that mission hasn't turned up for a second attempt, and I've yet to have any other contact with EXALT. Portent is also oddly-scaled in difficulty for such an early mission since it's much, much harder than the first Slingshot mission (give me a Muton over two Thin Men drops per turn after rescuing the EXALT survivor any day. Plus Portent has a much more complex map - Slingshot's is so open that most drops die from overwatch fire as soon as they appear).

 

[Pikkis]

Not sure when EXALT turns up if you don't defeat Portent, since at least so far that mission hasn't turned up for a second attempt, and I've yet to have any other contact with EXALT. Portent is also oddly-scaled in difficulty for such an early mission since it's much, much harder than the first Slingshot mission (give me a Muton over two Thin Men drops per turn after rescuing the EXALT survivor any day. Plus Portent has a much more complex map - Slingshot's is so open that most drops die from overwatch fire as soon as they appear).

Portent is really hard, and mostly because of the shooting angles to the rooftops etc. like you said. I lost three or four games in that mission before beelining MECs; I'm starting to fear there isn't much early-game strategic variety after all (if MEC beeline is a must-have for reasons including Portent).

Slingshot is an odd trio since the middle one is by far the most difficult. In this game, I managed to do Gangplank with three rookies, a Heavy and a MEC after Confounding Light left others injured or worse.

I guess Portent is just EXALT entrance, and not related to Progeny. Speaking of which, it still hasn't started.

 

[rkade8583]

I didn't find Portent that hard UNTIL I tried it minus a sniper. If you have a half-decent sniper and know where those thinmen drop, it's cake. If your sniper is, say, out on an alien-related injury, you are hosed. It always comes first month too. Odd.

 

[PhilBowles]

Portent is really hard, and mostly because of the shooting angles to the rooftops etc. like you said. I lost three or four games in that mission before beelining MECs; I'm starting to fear there isn't much early-game strategic variety after all (if MEC beeline is a must-have for reasons including Portent).

I was doing quite well on the final attempt, and was running the EXALT operative through the buildings to avoid the aliens ... only for him to be gunned down by an overwatching Sectoid who had decided to hide inside the doorway (it was one of the drops and had survived the previous turn due to terrible shooting on my part).

Slingshot is an odd trio since the middle one is by far the most difficult. In this game, I managed to do Gangplank with three rookies, a Heavy and a MEC after Confounding Light left others injured or worse.

I was mostly doing Confounding Light with rookies - lost by a turn due to timeout, and with only one of my three rookies still alive.

I didn't find Portent that hard UNTIL I tried it minus a sniper. If you have a half-decent sniper and know where those thinmen drop, it's cake. If your sniper is, say, out on an alien-related injury, you are hosed. It always comes first month too. Odd.

The problem is numbers, and Thin Men accuracy. Even moving cautiously, you're getting two Thin Men dropping on turn 1 after reaching the operative, and two Thin Men and a Sectoid on the next. The complex map makes it hard if not impossible to line up shots on all of a turn's drops simultaneously with one sniper, and you're only going to have one shot a turn (no Colonels by early April...). Snipers are also rather powerless against the initial corridor of death, before you rescue the operative, because the starting Thin Men are mostly badly-placed to draw a line to them from the roof, and buildings in the way prevent long firing corridors. And at that stage in the game, pretty much every Thin Man you miss is a dead XCOM operative.

Plus I'm using Damage Roulette, possibly a bad move but it's part of my standard play options, and that does make snipers (and heavies) less reliable at killing enemies outright.

Now had my first EXALT mission - lost it due to the sheer numbers involved, but I liked it a lot. Shame about the AI - snipers never use pistols even when close, I haven't yet seen a heavy use a rocket, and I've had EXALT operatives stand still and overwatch when flanked.

Since I've encountered EXALT and haven't won Portent, I'm still not sure what benefits you get from doing so.

 

[Pikkis]

I was mostly doing Confounding Light with rookies - lost by a turn due to timeout, and with only one of my three rookies still alive.

Interesting. I've always found Confounding Light hard since 10 turns is quite short time on that map and Mutons aren't one-shot kills at that point. In the past I usually postponed it one month to the moment where it's now situated by default.

Now had my first EXALT mission - lost it due to the sheer numbers involved, but I liked it a lot. Shame about the AI - snipers never use pistols even when close, I haven't yet seen a heavy use a rocket, and I've had EXALT operatives stand still and overwatch when flanked.

The EXALT AI isn't as good as the alien AI; odd double moves etc. Given that and their terrible aim, they're usually quite harmless. Nevertheless, I did lose two soldiers when their Heavy blew a car up.

Since I've encountered EXALT and haven't won Portent, I'm still not sure what benefits you get from doing so.

Portent does have a decent payoff from the council.

 

[GoodSarmatian]

The hardest thing about Portent is that it's new and we are unfamiliar with the map, which is made worse by all the Thin men on rooftops. I found the mission challenging the first time but quite easy the second time.

Speaking of roof tops, there's finally a way to make Snap Shot snipers not only wothwile but awesome. They are already viable because Snap Shot was buffed and Squad Sight nerfed, but Snap Shot + Damn Good Ground + Depth Perception + Boosted Muscle Fiber = Death Machine.

 

[Pikkis]

Speaking of roof tops, there's finally a way to make Snap Shot snipers not only wothwile but awesome. They are already viable because Snap Shot was buffed and Squad Sight nerfed, but Snap Shot + Damn Good Ground + Depth Perception + Boosted Muscle Fiber = Death Machine.

With certain Second Wave options and some luck in the die rolls, that's not even necessary. Back in Enemy Unknown I got one Sniper to 128 (base) aim that way. He perfected the combination of Snap Shot and In The Zone.

 

[PhilBowles]

Interesting. I've always found Confounding Light hard since 10 turns is quite short time on that map and Mutons aren't one-shot kills at that point. In the past I usually postponed it one month to the moment where it's now situated by default.

I don't mean I routinely do it with rookies, I just did on this attempt (well, 3 rookies from a squad of 5 or 6). Mutons usually go down to two hits from laser weapons, and there aren't many in the mission on Classic - the trouble is the time limit, since pacing your advance so you can deal with the Thin Men before dealing with the Mutons means you're behind in terms of activating the transponders.

It seems that in Enemy Within a failed story mission is a failure, and it doesn't turn up again - after losing that one the next mission was the first Progeny one (I presume - a terror ship mission in Newfoundland, complete with its own map and voiceovers. It was fun, but a bit of a walkover for a squad with two sniper Captains. At that point Chryssalids are usually one-shot kills).

The EXALT AI isn't as good as the alien AI; odd double moves etc. Given that and their terrible aim, they're usually quite harmless.

Plus their tendency to walk out into the open, reload from turn 1 instead of firing, and generally do very little. I had a difficult map on the first attempt - funnelled into a building with the encoder in one room. I hadn't worked out what hitting the comms did (still haven't, but I think it makes the AI move troops towards the sabotaged comm rather than congregating on the encoder).

The Exalt missions seem to get much too easy too quickly sadly, as they don't seem to tech up or introduce new units the way aliens do, and numbers can only compensate for so long. With carapace armour and a single kinetic fist mech I've been able to clear Exalt units as fast as they arrive. Which is a little incongrous when, in alien missions, I'm facing Cyberdiscs, Mutons and Chryssalids en masse.

Speaking of roof tops, there's finally a way to make Snap Shot snipers not only wothwile but awesome. They are already viable because Snap Shot was buffed and Squad Sight nerfed, but Snap Shot + Damn Good Ground + Depth Perception + Boosted Muscle Fiber = Death Machine.

Snap Shot always was viable in the sense that you could hit things with it reliably. The problem is, as it was then, exactly that you need a combination of so many things to make it effective. With Squadsight you need one Corporal-level upgrade, plus at least one other squad member. XCOM's challenge is entirely in the early game - an ability that requires late-game abilities to be effective is fundamentally suboptimal, because it doesn't help you when you need it most. By the point in the game when you've assembled your killer Snap Shot sniper, you can get by with pretty much any combination of Majors and Colonels of any class.

 

[Pikkis]

It seems that in Enemy Within a failed story mission is a failure, and it doesn't turn up again - after losing that one the next mission was the first Progeny one (I presume - a terror ship mission in Newfoundland, complete with its own map and voiceovers. It was fun, but a bit of a walkover for a squad with two sniper Captains. At that point Chryssalids are usually one-shot kills).

The Newfoundland mission is just a one-off; no relation to Progeny. I consider it to be among the best missions (all things considered) in the game though.

Potential spoilers considering Progeny:

Spoiler :

Portent is the first Progeny mission, this is confirmed in the introduction to Deluge, the second Progeny mission. In my current game, however, Deluge only appeared approximately six months after Portent. The third mission, Furies, still hasn't appeared, and I'm at this very moment pondering whether wait for it or activate the Gollop Chamber, which I have access to.

Deluge coming so late is especially disturbing since there are numerous references to EXALT, which had been defeated months earlier.

The Exalt missions seem to get much too easy too quickly sadly, as they don't seem to tech up or introduce new units the way aliens do, and numbers can only compensate for so long. With carapace armour and a single kinetic fist mech I've been able to clear Exalt units as fast as they arrive. Which is a little incongrous when, in alien missions, I'm facing Cyberdiscs, Mutons and Chryssalids en masse.

The EXALT campaign, although welcome, is a bit weak. I would've liked scripted missions considering the origins of EXALT, for example. They do tech up though, but only once.

Snap Shot always was viable in the sense that you could hit things with it reliably. The problem is, as it was then, exactly that you need a combination of so many things to make it effective. With Squadsight you need one Corporal-level upgrade, plus at least one other squad member. XCOM's challenge is entirely in the early game - an ability that requires late-game abilities to be effective is fundamentally suboptimal, because it doesn't help you when you need it most. By the point in the game when you've assembled your killer Snap Shot sniper, you can get by with pretty much any combination of Majors and Colonels of any class.

I guess you're right. I've always liked it nevertheless.

 

[GoodSarmatian]

The Newfoundland mission is just a one-off; no relation to Progeny. I consider it to be among the best missions (all things considered) in the game though.

That's the one that I almost certainly would have failed if not for my MEC.

Spoiler :

He took out two Chrysalids in all by himself. First I used the grenade launcher, then he twook a melee attack from each one and survived and then he killed them with a flame thrower. I made it out of there exactly one turn before the air-strike

The best mission so far, but I don't look forward to playing it again.

The EXALT campaign, although welcome, is a bit weak. I would've liked scripted missions considering the origins of EXALT, for example. They do tech up though, but only once.

Do the hints get better again after a couple of missions ? MY first was 'EXALT is not based in an island nation'. OK, Japan, Australia and the UK are out. That's three to cross off. The next hint was that it's not in Asia. Australia and Japan were already excluded, so that's two less nations to consider. I played three more missions after that and it was 'it's not Germany', 'it's not Nigeria' it's not France'. If it keeps going like that I'll need seven more missions to be certain.

 

[Pikkis]

Do the hints get better again after a couple of missions ? MY first was 'EXALT is not based in an island nation'. OK, Japan, Australia and the UK are out. That's three to cross off. The next hint was that it's not in Asia. Australia and Japan were already excluded, so that's two less nations to consider. I played three more missions after that and it was 'it's not Germany', 'it's not Nigeria' it's not France'. If it keeps going like that I'll need seven more missions to be certain

I needed six clues for 100% confirmation, but the ones you've had are worse than the ones I got on average. The quality of the clues is not monotonic.

--

Sectopods only taking halved damage is a horrible new feature. Add that after early middle-game I had not taken (forgot to take) any Medikits on missions (everything was going so strong), and you've got two killed Colonels on the Overseer mission.

 

[PhroX]

Yeah, the Exalt clues are rather varied....I even got one that was wrong - "They're in a nation you can play in Civ 5" and yet the UK was still a valid location (well, I suppose they might be playable in some scenario?)....

Loved the base defence mission BTW. Absolutely manic is a good way - still not sure how I got out with only two casualties given that, at one point, I was fighting 5 mechtoids with 4 guys...

 

[Sonereal]

Yeah, the Exalt clues are rather varied....I even got one that was wrong - "They're in a nation you can play in Civ 5" and yet the UK was still a valid location (well, I suppose they might be playable in some scenario?)

England in CivV is pretty much the UK.

 

[PhilBowles]

The Newfoundland mission is just a one-off; no relation to Progeny. I consider it to be among the best missions (all things considered) in the game though.

Hmm, it's good that they went to the effort to map and script standalone Council missions, then. I like the map and the atmosphere, and I wasn't expecting the timed retreat (only just got my top sniper out in time).

The EXALT campaign, although welcome, is a bit weak. I would've liked scripted missions considering the origins of EXALT, for example. They do tech up though, but only once.

As I just found out - and they can actually hit with those laser weapons. That was a punishing mission, which I ended up losing. There seems to be at least one bug, though: my sniper was hit by an EXALT sniper with Disabling Shot (or at least the same graphic), but could still use his weapon normally in his turn. I like the covert operative mechanic and the hold objective mission type.

I think EXALT should be a bit more human, though - they're as immune to panic as the aliens, and for an organisation that nominally avoids open conflict with XCOM they're remarkably happy to fight to the death and send in waves of reinforcements, even when they've lost their data. Not sure about their origins: I did find it odd when the promo material suggested they were an organisation planning to take over once the aliens left. XCOM has to work out the aliens' plans as they go - how does EXALT know from the start that the aliens aren't planning to stay?

That's the one that I almost certainly would have failed if not for my MEC.

I had no MECs in mine, but one of my heavies was fortunate and survived two attacks from a Chryssalid. I didn't track who killed what (my snipers did the most), but I came out of the mission with no casualties and about 24 kills - and, indeed, one turn before the airstrike (my top sniper was within one tile of not making it in time).

My MECs have so far underperformed, but I haven't yet got the Foundry upgrades and, when they do survive missions, seem not to get promotions so I'm still stuck with Collateral Damage as the only promotion.

Do the hints get better again after a couple of missions ? MY first was 'EXALT is not based in an island nation'. OK, Japan, Australia and the UK are out. That's three to cross off. The next hint was that it's not in Asia. Australia and Japan were already excluded, so that's two less nations to consider. I played three more missions after that and it was 'it's not Germany', 'it's not Nigeria' it's not France'. If it keeps going like that I'll need seven more missions to be certain.

I've so far got three. Two of them were "Not in Egypt" and "Not in Africa", making the first wholly redundant. So all I know is that it's not in Africa and "not in a country that has territory in the Arctic Circle" (US, Canada, Russia). I rather like the way the clues are structured, more varied than I was expecting.

I was fighting 5 mechtoids with 4 guys...

I have yet to see a Mectoid in action - the one I encountered withdrew after I hit it with Disabling Shot, and the next time it showed up it double-moved, being destroyed the next turn.

 

[PhroX]

England in CivV is pretty much the UK.

It's still wrong...ah well, I suppose I should expect it given that Firaxis seem to think that Scotland isn't part of the UK....

 

[Sonereal]

It's still wrong...ah well, I suppose I should expect it given that Firaxis seem to think that Scotland isn't part of the UK....

There's a vote in Scotland on whether or not to stay in the UK in 2014. The game is set in 2015.

 

[PhroX]

I have yet to see a Mectoid in action - the one I encountered withdrew after I hit it with Disabling Shot, and the next time it showed up it double-moved, being destroyed the next turn.

They're fine as long as you keep in cover and focus fire them. When they get to shoot, they have two shots a turn doing 8-9 damage (classic). It can really hurt, especially if they only have one target to shoot at as normally they tend to split their fire.

 

[Pikkis]

The Furies mission is really buggy, I'll have to warn. Froze on me twice (forcing me to kill the XCOM process from taskmgr) before eventually the third time I could go through.

The Temple Ship Assault is considerably harder now since the Sectopods only take halved damage. In the end, XCOM triumphed, but defeat was only a few bad die rolls away.

I like how there's so much more going on now in the game; I ended up completing 48 missions which is as much as in my last EU playthrough, but that one was with the Marathon option. I wish I would have been able to do one more, the Battleship crash mission, but the ship showed up on the sole continent I didn't yet have a Fusion Lance Firestorm stationed on.

Which month have you had base assault taking place?

Spoiler :

UFOpaedia.org claims it should be in May, but I only got it in September.

There's a vote in Scotland on whether or not to stay in the UK in 2014. The game is set in 2015.

Kinda brave from Firaxis to comment on that.

 

[sherbz]

Personally im thinking its best not to accept Progeny on the first opportunity. That many thin man is a pain in ass. Also, when you are almost home, you get one spawn in behind, then 2 spawn in front. that really ruined my day and meant my captive and soldiers were eventually killed. I also bugged out on that mission when a thin man went and suppressed me (did they ever do that before?).

You do get to replay the special missions if you deny them the first time right? Im thinking that slingshot is doable, but progeny is more difficult. As others have said, slingshot has open maps, which coupled with knowing where the aliens spawn makes it a cake walk. Progeny is not an open map and incorporates high and low elements. My findings are that unless you hit on your overwatch shots, then usually things go bad for you because you only have 4 soldiers.

On that note, i always found that the best strategy on EU was to build 2 workshops as fast as you can, 1 satellite in month one, and 6 in month 2. Then build 2 uplinks in month 2. that way you can manage panic, take whatever you need from abductions, and set yourself up for a month 3 base raid. Im not sure whether mecs or anything else are worth deviating for and it would be interesting to hear views on this. Personally, even though i have failed on my first two attempts (classic ironman, although admittedly i switched off after progeny because i want to see what happens), i think sattellites is always better because the game becomes so much easier in month 3 (you can afford all laser rifles, carapace armour, foundry upgrades - and by extension mechs/gene mods, even laboratories, plus you are essentially ahead 1 month of where the devs probably thought you should be.