Unique Unit Elimination Thread

-Ballista 10
-Companion cavalry 2
-Camel archer 20
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 23
-Immortal 22 +1
-Legion 28
-Foreign Legion 21
-Jaguar warrior 13
-Longbowman 27
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 31
-Samurai 36
-Janissary 44
 
Wow, surprising that a Unit that would have stood a good chance of winning before the first patch is now almost eliminated before we even get to the midway point.
 
Understand that what you're saying amounts to many people voting out of ignorance.

No, it amounts to using a different metric – value instead of power. If I'd said "people haven't used the late-game units, so they're not voting for them since they don't know if they're good or not," that would be voting out of ignorance. But that's a quantum leap from what I said I believe is the case: people are going to vote for the unit that they get the most use out of, which is inherently going to be earlier units. That's not ignorant.
 
-Ballista 10
-Companion cavalry 2
-Camel archer 20
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 23
-Immortal 22 +1
-Legion 28
-Foreign Legion 22 (+1)
-Jaguar warrior 13
-Longbowman 27
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 31
-Samurai 34 (-2)
-Janissary 44

edit : reason : I don't see samurai at #2 and foreign legion in the top tier.
 
No, it amounts to using a different metric – value instead of power. If I'd said "people haven't used the late-game units, so they're not voting for them since they don't know if they're good or not," that would be voting out of ignorance. But that's a quantum leap from what I said I believe is the case: people are going to vote for the unit that they get the most use out of, which is inherently going to be earlier units. That's not ignorant.

There's an element of ignorance in it (and "ignorance" not in the derogatory "yer stoopit" sense, but in the "lack of information" sense.)

If you don't get to the unit (and just as importantly, its upgrade) until your games are essentially won or actually over, like I said - you're not going to get the visceral "feel" for the unit's power. A unit doesn't operate in a vacuum - if you bump into Zeros at the very end of your game while Japan is going down the tubes, they won't make much of an emotional impact on you. You'll likely have Jet Fighters, you'll (as you said) easily be able to resource-starve them, and they won't have a support infrastructure to protect (which is their whole reason for being).

You might intellectually appreciate their benefit, but you won't experience all the implications. (I'm having a hell of a time dealing with the Japanese Navy right now, because I can't strip their DD screen with planes off my Aircraft Carriers or even my land-base air force, meaning I can't use my submarines effectively, meaning I can't use the subs to deal with these new heavy Battleships I just rolled up.)

Substitute "lack of experience with the unit in a meaningful situation" with "ignorance", again, I do think we're saying the same thing.

The question is whether/how much we should weight play style in evaluating these units, and that wasn't clearly defined before the poll started. It's okay.

And it's only natural that after 50 turns of routinely destroying Jaguar-upgraded Mech Infantry with late-game air units, I'm going to have a different view of how good they are.
 
Wow, surprising that a Unit that would have stood a good chance of winning before the first patch is now almost eliminated before we even get to the midway point.

Yeah, if this was done at release, I think Companion Cav would have won hands down. It was too easy - build 3-4 of them, and the game was over. They could stand for a bit of a de-nerf.
 
-Ballista 10
-Companion cavalry 0
-Camel archer 20
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 23
-Immortal 22
-Legion 28
-Foreign Legion 22
-Jaguar warrior 13
-Longbowman 27
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 31
-Samurai 34
-Janissary 45
 
And the Companion Cavalry comes in 17th. :sniper:

Spoiler :
#17- The Greek Companion Cavalry

Unit_Greek_Companion_Cavalry_copy.png


Forgot about the 'Companion' part of their name, and got themsleves ambushed by Janissaies.
 
-Ballista 10
-Companion cavalry 0
-Camel archer 20
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 23
-Immortal 22
-Legion 28
-Foreign Legion 22
-Jaguar warrior 11
-Longbowman 27
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 32
-Samurai 34
-Janissary 45
 
-Ballista 10
-Companion cavalry 0
-Camel archer 20
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 23
-Immortal 22
-Legion 29
-Foreign Legion 22
-Jaguar warrior 9
-Longbowman 27
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 32
-Samurai 34
-Janissary 45
 
-Ballista 10
-Camel archer 21
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 23
-Immortal 22
-Legion 29
-Foreign Legion 22
-Jaguar warrior 10 (+1)
-Longbowman 25 (-2)
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 32
-Samurai 34
-Janissary 43

Jaguar warrior is useful through the whole game. Longbowman is not
 
-Ballista 10
-Camel archer 19
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 23
-Immortal 22
-Legion 29
-Foreign Legion 22
-Jaguar warrior 10
-Longbowman 25
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 32
-Samurai 35
-Janissary 43

same vote than yesterday
 
-Ballista 8
-Camel archer 19
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 23
-Immortal 22
-Legion 29
-Foreign Legion 22
-Jaguar warrior 10
-Longbowman 25
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 32
-Samurai 35
-Janissary 44
 
-Ballista 6
-Camel archer 19
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 23
-Immortal 22
-Legion 29
-Foreign Legion 22
-Jaguar warrior 10
-Longbowman 26
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 32
-Samurai 35
-Janissary 44

Dinging the Ballista, early iron is precious and usually has to go towards swordsmen. I rarely build siege until the middle ages.

Buffing the longbowmen. Sure the rest of their empire may be weak, but they themselves are nasty. There's a reason why artillery is such a huge jump (other then indirect fire).
 
-Ballista 6
-Camel archer 19
-War elephant 21
-Mandekalu Cavalry 27
-Cossack 21
-Immortal 22
-Legion 29
-Foreign Legion 22
-Jaguar warrior 8
-Longbowman 26
-Naresuan elephant 25
-Chu-Ko-Nu 33
-Samurai 36
-Janissary 44
 
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