Unique Units elimination thread

[mintcandy]

Crap...there are no more Unique Units that I can (fairly) downvote.

 

[eisforeccentric]

African Forest Elephant 4
Atlatlist 17
Ballista 18
Battering Ram 20
Berserker 17
Camel Archer 18 (-3)
Carolean 27
Cataphract 12
Chu-Ko-Nu 35
Companion Cavalry 23
Conquistador 17
Dromon 15
Foreign Legion 22
Horse Archer 25
Hussar 19
Hwach'a 15
Immortal 18
Jaguar 24
Janissary 31
Keshik 30
Landsknecht 22
Legion 22
Longbowman 36
Minutemen 32
Mohawk Warrior 22
Musketeer 15
Naresuan's Elephant 17
Pictish Warrior 14
Samurai 12
Sea Beggar 33 (+1)
Ship of the Line 27
Tercio 18
War Elephant 22

I know I'm being a rebel by taking away from Sea Beggar, but the thing is feels cheap and borderline OP, ESPECIALLY when you upgrade to Destroyers. Takes a lot of the fun out of it.

But that's half the fun as the Dutch: lay low for a while and concentrate on building up your infrastructure, as well as your diplomacy via trading, and then when Navigation comes around you become a naval power, as now you have a ship that can both take enemies as prize ships, but also is great at taking enemy cities. If you're playing Archipelago, it's great for getting a foothold when you're invading. And then when you upgrade to destroyer, you've still got the promos, which is better than losing them or crossing over and having useless promos, unlike some units still on this list.

That's the case with the Camel Archer. A great unit, but it switches from ranged to melee when it upgrades to cavalry, rendering its promotions useless. I don't like that.

 

[Shimicakan]

African Forest Elephant 4
Atlatlist 17
Ballista 18
Battering Ram 20
Berserker 17
Camel Archer 18
Carolean 27
Cataphract 12
Chu-Ko-Nu 35
Companion Cavalry 23
Conquistador 17
Dromon 15
Foreign Legion 22
Horse Archer 25
Hussar 19
Hwach'a 15
Immortal 18
Jaguar 24
Janissary 31
Keshik 30
Landsknecht 23 (+1)
Legion 22
Longbowman 36
Minutemen 32
Mohawk Warrior 22
Musketeer 15
Naresuan's Elephant 17
Pictish Warrior 11 (-3)
Samurai 12
Sea Beggar 33
Ship of the Line 27
Tercio 18
War Elephant 22


Oh, you lovely Landsknecht. At half cost it is, maybe together with the Chu-Ko-Nu the only UU that is exactly TWICE as good as the one it replaces. I feel a landsknecht rush as Bismarck has very few flaws.

Pictish warrior... meh. Id never ever spend my hammers on spearman or spearman replacements when i could get archers, simply.

 

[woodshadows]

But that's half the fun as the Dutch: lay low for a while and concentrate on building up your infrastructure, as well as your diplomacy via trading, and then when Navigation comes around you become a naval power, as now you have a ship that can both take enemies as prize ships, but also is great at taking enemy cities. If you're playing Archipelago, it's great for getting a foothold when you're invading. And then when you upgrade to destroyer, you've still got the promos, which is better than losing them or crossing over and having useless promos, unlike some units still on this list.

That's the case with the Camel Archer. A great unit, but it switches from ranged to melee when it upgrades to cavalry, rendering its promotions useless. I don't like that.

I tried sea beggars against a non-capital city and it didn't do much damage to the city but sure took a lot of damage to itself.. plus it couldn't retreat and being right beside the city meant it was exposed to multiple counter attacks. I'd rather use frigates for city attacks, unless you mean using the sea beggar just as the final attack on a weakened city.

I don't like the camel archer upgrade path much either, but it's not as bad as some people make out, some of those promos do stick, esp the most useful ones, ie march and the double-attack one (forget the name), possibly some others I can't recall right now, but those are the two promos I generally take on this unit.

 

[Cromagnus]

African Forest Elephant 4
Atlatlist 17
Ballista 18
Battering Ram 20
Berserker 17
Camel Archer 18
Carolean 27
Cataphract 12
Chu-Ko-Nu 35
Companion Cavalry 23
Conquistador 17
Dromon 15
Foreign Legion 22
Horse Archer 25
Hussar 19
Hwach'a 15
Immortal 18
Jaguar 24
Janissary 31
Keshik 30
Landsknecht 23
Legion 22
Longbowman 36
Minutemen 32
Mohawk Warrior 22
Musketeer 15
Naresuan's Elephant 14 (-3)
Pictish Warrior 12 (+1)
Samurai 12
Sea Beggar 33
Ship of the Line 27
Tercio 18
War Elephant 22

+ to Pictish Warrior because combined with the UA, it almost guarantees you will be the first to found and enhance a religion, even on Diety, even if you go pure Honor, which you pretty much need to if you're rushing to Bronze-working fast enough to take advantage of the PW while they're still strong. And maybe it's my imagination, but I swear they keep the +faith after upgrade. Maybe it's a bug. If you only use them to get kill shots after your archers do most of the damage, you can generate a lot of faith by killing more powerful units. They're not OP, but they're awesome.

Edit: Also, come on, it's just fun watching the +XP, +Culture, +Faith, +Gold spam. :-D

- to Naresuan's Elephant, because the AI build a lot less mounted units, maybe because Pikemen are more useful nowadays. Not that I don't *hate* fighting against them, but every time I try to build these the AI spams Pikemen. Sure, they can take down a Pikeman, but not any easier than other cheaper units can.

 

[Gucumatz]

A 1 post voter... we seem to be seeing more of these in the vote threads...

The Cho-Ko-Nuh is by far not the only unit better than it. And it is with decent planning not hard to deal with a Landsknecht rusher - in NQ people have at least complained a Landsknecht rush is actually LESS effective in GK now than ever. Originally on paper it looked like it would become better but in fact it hasn't. Simply focusing on terrain and dealing with a player who only spams Landscknechts is easy to deal with - I know I do so often.

Charging with melee units unless they have some significant advantage is rarely advantageous (ie Jaguar upgrades/Janissary/Carolean) even with a Zerg unit.

Some units all better than the Landsknecht. Camel Archer, Cho-ko-nuh, Longbowmen, Keshik, Janissary, Jaguar, Carolean, Minuteman, War Elephant (Great UU, poor Civ), War Chariot, Horse Archer, Battering Ram, Ship of the Line, Sea Beggar, B-17, the Turtleship, and quite arguably many more here.

The Landsknecht is not what it used to be (even with the str raise) and at least now thanks to random 1 voters coming out of the *woodworks* cough* cough*... I will continue to vote them down - simply because they don't belong anywhere near the top

 

[woodshadows]

A 1 post voter... we seem to be seeing more of these in the vote threads...

The Cho-Ko-Nuh is by far not the only unit better than it. And it is with decent planning not hard to deal with a Landsknecht rusher - in NQ people have at least complained a Landsknecht rush is actually LESS effective in GK now than ever. Originally on paper it looked like it would become better but in fact it hasn't. Simply focusing on terrain and dealing with a player who only spams Landscknechts is easy to deal with - I know I do so often.

Charging with melee units unless they have some significant advantage is rarely advantageous (ie Jaguar upgrades/Janissary/Carolean) even with a Zerg unit.

Some units all better than the Landsknecht. Camel Archer, Cho-ko-nuh, Longbowmen, Keshik, Janissary, Jaguar, Carolean, Minuteman, War Elephant (Great UU, poor Civ), War Chariot, Horse Archer, Battering Ram, Ship of the Line, Sea Beggar, B-17, the Turtleship, and quite arguably many more here.

The Landsknecht is not what it used to be (even with the str raise) and at least now thanks to random 1 voters coming out of the *woodworks* cough* cough*... I will continue to vote them down - simply because they don't belong anywhere near the top

why would someone 'focus only on landsknechts', the people you are playing against must not be very good if all they do is build a pure landsknecht army. also obviously landsknechts are going to be more powerful, now that pikemen are more powerful, try to qualify how this isn't so if you are going to make the claim that they are 'now worse than before'. infantry are the front line units preferred by most players, pikemen are versatile and in many ways better than longswords. having two for the price of one means a larger more versatile army. an army that isnt composed ONLY of landsknechts, but composed of all the various units that make up a well-balanced army. landsknechts are in many ways better than chokonus because two landsknechts means two health bars, the abiity to be on two separate tiles, while the chokonu has one health bar and is only on one tile (of course).

the implication that i am 'making accounts' to prop the landsknecht isn't ludicrous since it does look suspicious, though i'd ask any moderator to come and reveal via ips that this is not the case simply to show that you are a bit quick to the trigger in falsely accusing people, even if done in a sort of passive sneaky way.

clearly you have never played with germany and played against people who don't know how to use germany. unfortunate for you, being closed minded is to limit oneself, as they say.

i guess i'll withdraw from this poll thread, it started out as a friendly exchange of info/opinions and now it's turned into some weird personal agenda against me by this person, who plans to vote against a unit only because i have said i happen to think it a good unit. some people are so bizarre. i have no interest however in getting into some dick-measuring match over some silly voting poll that only 5 people seem to be taking part in anyhow.

 

[Gucumatz]

I didnt say only Landsknechts did I?

Range is still key to winning any realistic frontline battle in multi. In singplayer with dumb AI you can survive with mostly melee units - something you never could do in a good multi match. (And yes sorry for accusing you ) Pikeman are versatile - but shaving 45 hammers isn't much compared to other bonuses. And on quick (which most multi games are held on) that advantage is scaled even less. I have played with Germany before (and am half German myself, but I admit I don't enjoy playing the civ - but in NQ we normally only play with random civs meaning we all get used to strategies for each civ) - but the fact is with melee units being far less effective against cities - they are meant to be frontlines units. If someone wants to spam them to make the most use of them - simply lure them into defendable territory. Then the opposing player can either suicide units for your experience or - has to focus more on a range/mobile focused army. If he does so the amount of hammers saved isn't much and is certainly not enough to turn the edge of a tactical battle.

I have seen plenty of good players mind you, Sultan, Carls, Universal Soldier etc (And some NQ players play league too - like Universal and are very good there too). Now adays there is just little impressive about Landsknechts. If you get hit retreat a little but don't bend and just range range range. It doesn't give anywhere near the advantage other units give - and comparatively it must be put down.

 

[Seabastian Civ]

Yeah I'm a real person. I just didn't ever post on this forum before. And I didn't vote for Landsknechts.

 

[Gucumatz]

Seabastian - talking about Shimi

 

[Koiranputki]

African Forest Elephant 4
Atlatlist 17
Ballista 18
Battering Ram 20
Berserker 17
Camel Archer 18
Carolean 27
Cataphract 12
Chu-Ko-Nu 35
Companion Cavalry 23
Conquistador 17
Dromon 15
Foreign Legion 22
Horse Archer 22 -3
Hussar 19
Hwach'a 15
Immortal 18
Jaguar 24
Janissary 31
Keshik 30
Landsknecht 23
Legion 22
Longbowman 37 +1
Minutemen 32
Mohawk Warrior 22
Musketeer 15
Naresuan's Elephant 14
Pictish Warrior 12
Samurai 12
Sea Beggar 33
Ship of the Line 27
Tercio 18
War Elephant 22

I'm approaching this from the point of view of units coming at me.

From what I've seen the Horse Archer is quite easy to kill off with Composite Bowmen...

And the Longbowmen have given me a fair bit of grief...and I notice they even upgrade to a 3-range Gatling Gun [Edit: Or is it a 2-range??...one more than the basic anyway]...maybe even a 3-range [2-range..??] Machine Gun...though I can't remember that part now....

 

[Tabarnak]

I have seen plenty of good players mind you, Sultan, Carls, Universal Soldier etc (And some NQ players play league too - like Universal and are very good there too). Now adays there is just little impressive about Landsknechts.

Question : What is your steam name? I wanna play someday against you

I played Sultan and Carls but not Universal yet.

whan i played Sultan(2nd time, 1st time was like a year ago) he rushed me with Camels and brought 2 other guys against me and i resisted them all

Their Camels couldn't get through my wall of Longswordmen (i think i said how to defend against these guys in another post...well it was against Sultan and his horde of Camels around turn 85). Fortunately, i was the tech leader and production/gold as well.

 

[theguy8882]

African Forest Elephant 4
Atlatlist 17
Ballista 18
Battering Ram 20
Berserker 17
Camel Archer 18
Carolean 27
Cataphract 12
Chu-Ko-Nu 35
Companion Cavalry 23
Conquistador 17
Dromon 15
Foreign Legion 22
Horse Archer 22 -3
Hussar 19
Hwach'a 15
Immortal 15
Jaguar 24
Janissary 32
Keshik 30
Landsknecht 23
Legion 22
Longbowman 37 +1
Minutemen 32
Mohawk Warrior 22
Musketeer 15
Naresuan's Elephant 14
Pictish Warrior 12
Samurai 12
Sea Beggar 33
Ship of the Line 27
Tercio 18
War Elephant 22

The Immortal goes obsolete to quickly, and I don't find it useful for anything but killing barbs

The Janissary is awesome. It's great when on the attack and is arguably the best gunpowder unit.

 

[Captain Fargle]

African Forest Elephant 4
Atlatlist 17
Ballista 18
Battering Ram 20
Berserker 17
Camel Archer 18
Carolean 27
Cataphract 9 (-3)
Chu-Ko-Nu 35
Companion Cavalry 23
Conquistador 17
Dromon 15
Foreign Legion 22
Horse Archer 22
Hussar 19
Hwach'a 15
Immortal 15
Jaguar 24
Janissary 32
Keshik 30
Landsknecht 23
Legion 22
Longbowman 37
Minutemen 32
Mohawk Warrior 22
Musketeer 15
Naresuan's Elephant 14
Pictish Warrior 13 (+1)
Samurai 12
Sea Beggar 33
Ship of the Line 27
Tercio 18
War Elephant 22

Voting down Cataphracts because, while being able to fortify is nice and all, they're still Horsemen. Meant for early game hit and run or finishing off weakened foes. They shouldn't be what you're using to tank damage in the first place and I've always found them fairly weak.

Voting up Picts because they are absolutely glorious units for anti-barb duty. That extra Faith really adds up and the ability to pillage for no movement cost is just icing on the cake. Don't underestimate them in an early war, the ability to tear up early roads and keep marching can really mess you up.

 

[Shimicakan]

A 1 post voter... we seem to be seeing more of these in the vote threads...

The Cho-Ko-Nuh is by far not the only unit better than it. And it is with decent planning not hard to deal with a Landsknecht rusher - in NQ people have at least complained a Landsknecht rush is actually LESS effective in GK now than ever. Originally on paper it looked like it would become better but in fact it hasn't. Simply focusing on terrain and dealing with a player who only spams Landscknechts is easy to deal with - I know I do so often.

Charging with melee units unless they have some significant advantage is rarely advantageous (ie Jaguar upgrades/Janissary/Carolean) even with a Zerg unit.

Some units all better than the Landsknecht. Camel Archer, Cho-ko-nuh, Longbowmen, Keshik, Janissary, Jaguar, Carolean, Minuteman, War Elephant (Great UU, poor Civ), War Chariot, Horse Archer, Battering Ram, Ship of the Line, Sea Beggar, B-17, the Turtleship, and quite arguably many more here.

The Landsknecht is not what it used to be (even with the str raise) and at least now thanks to random 1 voters coming out of the *woodworks* cough* cough*... I will continue to vote them down - simply because they don't belong anywhere near the top

Woah, no "welcome to the forums, shimi" here, huh? Ive been a lurker for a long time. It so happens to be that i mostly play single player, i didnt see this being an only-multiplayer thread, just since you happen to like it doesnt mean its everyone's cup of tea. Ive seen you cracking down on people with you negative attitude, and with the same "a smart multiplayer player can counter" and it sickens me. And i seriously ing doubt that anyone would take the time to create a new account, just to give a single upvote to a uu in a ing civ thread, dont you?

So i suggest you drop your attitude and start realizing many people dont think like you.

 

[eisforeccentric]

Woah, no "welcome to the forums, shimi" here, huh? Ive been a lurker for a long time. It so happens to be that i mostly play single player, i didnt see this being an only-multiplayer thread, just since you happen to like it doesnt mean its everyone's cup of tea. Ive seen you cracking down on people with you negative attitude, and with the same "a smart multiplayer player can counter" and it sickens me. And i seriously ing doubt that anyone would take the time to create a new account, just to give a single upvote to a uu in a ing civ thread, dont you?

So i suggest you drop your attitude and start realizing many people dont think like you.

True to your name, eh?

Welcome!

 

[Shimicakan]

True to your name, eh?

Welcome!

Not really, monty has no reason for his anger

edit: oh and thanks

 

[Loucypher]

African Forest Elephant 1 (-3)
Atlatlist 17
Ballista 18
Battering Ram 20
Berserker 17
Camel Archer 18
Carolean 27
Cataphract 9 (-3)
Chu-Ko-Nu 35
Companion Cavalry 23
Conquistador 17
Dromon 15
Foreign Legion 22
Horse Archer 22
Hussar 19
Hwach'a 15
Immortal 15
Jaguar 24
Janissary 32
Keshik 30
Landsknecht 23
Legion 22
Longbowman 37
Minutemen 32
Mohawk Warrior 22
Musketeer 15
Naresuan's Elephant 14
Pictish Warrior 13
Samurai 12
Sea Beggar 34 (+1)
Ship of the Line 27
Tercio 18
War Elephant 22

Bringing the Elephant to the brink of destruction. While it isn't bad, the fact that its promotions don't carry on are a major hit to me. So no, I don't like 'em and while there are worse units, those are already eliminated.
Upvoting the Sea Beggars because of the opposite reason as the downvote to the Elephants. Its promotions are already quite silly and if you got a Brandenburg city, you got some powerhouse Sea Beggars to begin with. If you then proceed to make them into Destroyers, things get silly really fast and even Suleiman will think twice about launching a naval invasion.

 

[Carl5872]

African Forest Elephant 1
Atlatlist 17
Ballista 18
Battering Ram 20
Berserker 17
Camel Archer 18
Carolean 27
Cataphract 9
Chu-Ko-Nu 35
Companion Cavalry 23
Conquistador 17
Dromon 15
Foreign Legion 22
Horse Archer 22
Hussar 19
Hwach'a 15
Immortal 15
Jaguar 24
Janissary 32
Keshik 31 (+1)
Landsknecht 21 (-2)
Legion 22
Longbowman 37
Minutemen 32
Mohawk Warrior 22
Musketeer 15
Naresuan's Elephant 14
Pictish Warrior 13
Samurai 12
Sea Beggar 34
Ship of the Line 27
Tercio 18
War Elephant 22

The Keshik IMO is the best UU in the game. The ability to take out a city without taking any damage is amazing. The only thing that limits their conquest is happiness.

The landsknect would be really useful if it weren't for Germany's UA. By the time I can get Landsknects, I already have a horde of barbarians, and don't really need cheap units, I need siege or quality swordsmen.

 

[Jimjemael]

African Forest Elephant 1
Atlatlist 17
Ballista 18
Battering Ram 20
Berserker 17
Camel Archer 18
Carolean 27
Cataphract 9
Chu-Ko-Nu 35
Companion Cavalry 24 (+1)
Conquistador 17
Dromon 15
Foreign Legion 22
Horse Archer 22
Hussar 19
Hwach'a 15
Immortal 15
Jaguar 24
Janissary 32
Keshik 31
Landsknecht 20 Corrected should have been -3
Legion 22
Longbowman 37
Minutemen 29 (-3)
Mohawk Warrior 22
Musketeer 15
Naresuan's Elephant 14
Pictish Warrior 13
Samurai 12
Sea Beggar 34
Ship of the Line 27
Tercio 18
War Elephant 22

Companion cavalry can be a real pain to go up against. So fast and good at reaching strategic resources to pillage.

I don't hate minutemen I just think they come in too late for their ability to be that highly rated. Yeah it carries with promotion but so do better abilities from other units.