Unique units that represent military failures of a Civ

[Lionic]

Hello! Has anyone thought of adding unique units to your epic mods that represent a weaknesses of a particular civ? What would you select? Some of my thoughts on what could these be:
- Rome (Italy)--WWII Tank like M13/40;
- Russia--WWII Fighter;
- Spain--a Napoleonic era Cavalry or Infantry perhaps?

My knowledge on history is mostly on XX century so your ideas for such units from Medieval and Ancient eras are welcome.

 

[Predator145]

This could work in a scenario like the WW2 Pacific/Napoleonic Wars where you only have a few factions with unique Infantry/Tanks/Airpower/Naval unit lines. But in an epic mod with 31 civs it would look silly. Italy's mechanized forces only paled if you compare them on the top major powers. They're still in the top 10 in the world at the time. Ditto with Soviet airpower. Spanish military was up to date with the latest tactics (and some more considering guerilla warfare) and gear during the Nap wars, contributing greatly to French defeat in the Peninsular war. There were plenty of major powers during that period that had more outdated gear than Spain. The Qing or Ottomans for example.

The medieval Persians were known for having weak heavy infantry. Theirs being described as a "rabble" by the Romans. The Mamluk Sultanate embraced gunpowder too late and were annexed by the Ottomans. The Koreans were known to be good missile troops but lacked in cold steel heavy infantry and were not able to go toe to toe with the Japanese during the Imjin War. The Qing green standard troops were just a neglected mess for most of their existence as their Manchu overlords distrusted them and refrained from arming them with the latest gunpowder tech and tactics. Steppe nomads of course never much of a infantry force to begin with. Their infantry being dismounted cavalry and sedentary auxiliaries. Mughal infantry despite belonging to the wealthiest faction in the world at the time suffered from shoddy gear and imported not just gunpowder weapons, but also cold steel ones from the west. These are a few ideas to weaknesses that factions that weren't behind in tech or wealth had.

 

[Delta_Strife]

There is so many failed naval ideas. All the way with the age of sail with Mary Rose to the Littoral Combat Ships.

 

[Ozymandias]

Humble @Delta_Strife has also made numerous Interwar Behemoths & Other Ill-Fated Beasts.

 

[Lionic]

There is so many failed naval ideas. All the way with the age of sail with Mary Rose to the Littoral Combat Ships.

Yep, although there is slight difference between one or two failed designs in otherwise effective branch of service and the branch of service that itself failed all the tasks it was supposed to accomplish...

 

[Ozymandias]

@Wyrmshadow made a "Holt Land Monitor" at my request.

"The 150 ton Field Monitor design has its origins with the designers of the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank, this being their initial design. Optimism in the States for the Big Wheel theory was still quite high, even though America had all sorts of tracked machines to experiment on. The designers chose to use two huge pairs of wheels, forward and aft, powered by two large steam engines, presumably designed by Holt, with the help of engineers from Doble, most likely their chief engineer, Abner Doble, who had designed the engine for the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank.

The Field Monitor was essentially a huge version of the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank, with four 20 foot tall wheels. Unlike the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank, the Field Monitor did not have a steering wheel in the rear, instead it had two of the four 20 foot wheels. Each wheel had an individual gear box, connected to a central transmission. The transmission was connected to the two steam engines, located in the center of the Field Monitor.

It was to carry two American six inch naval guns, arranged side by side in the front, in the same arrangement as the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank’s 2.95" (75 mm) mountain gun. (The six inch was a secondary armament for most American ships at this time.)"

 

[timerover51]

@Wyrmshadow made a "Holt Land Monitor" at my request.

"The 150 ton Field Monitor design has its origins with the designers of the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank, this being their initial design. Optimism in the States for the Big Wheel theory was still quite high, even though America had all sorts of tracked machines to experiment on. The designers chose to use two huge pairs of wheels, forward and aft, powered by two large steam engines, presumably designed by Holt, with the help of engineers from Doble, most likely their chief engineer, Abner Doble, who had designed the engine for the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank.

The Field Monitor was essentially a huge version of the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank, with four 20 foot tall wheels. Unlike the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank, the Field Monitor did not have a steering wheel in the rear, instead it had two of the four 20 foot wheels. Each wheel had an individual gear box, connected to a central transmission. The transmission was connected to the two steam engines, located in the center of the Field Monitor.

It was to carry two American six inch naval guns, arranged side by side in the front, in the same arrangement as the Holt Steam Wheeled Tank’s 2.95" (75 mm) mountain gun. (The six inch was a secondary armament for most American ships at this time.)"

The secondary armament of most American ships at the time of World War One was either the 5 inch 50 caliber gun or the higher velocity 5 inch 51 caliber gun.

 

[Ares de Borg]

Just a rant, but Delta made a T-14 Tank.

 

[Kyriakos]

A Ratte unit, depleting all resources, might be nice ^^

 

[Lionic]

Just a rant, but Delta made a T-14 Tank.

Russians praise the T-14 just like they praised Black Eagle 15 years ago...

 

[Ozymandias]

A Ratte unit, depleting all resources, might be nice ^^

Wyrmshadow interestingly refused to make one (claiming that someone called "HelenHunt" was making one, although he did make a Maus, and E100, among others.

 

[Wyrmshadow]

It's a very old Red Skelton joke. "Go to Helen Hunt for it."
Now read that out loud several times until you get it.

 

[timerover51]

It's a very old Red Skelton joke. "Go to Helen Hunt for it."
Now read that out loud several times until you get it.

I can remember Red using it.

 

[Ozymandias]

It's a very old Red Skelton joke. "Go to Helen Hunt for it."
Now read that out loud several times until you get it.

HE'S BACK!

 

[Ozymandias]

And I have no idea how I could have forgotten the WW1 Russian Tsar tank. (Link is to @Wyrmshadow's Unit.)



Addendum:

 

[timerover51]

Hello! Has anyone thought of adding unique units to your epic mods that represent a weaknesses of a particular civ? What would you select? Some of my thoughts on what could these be:
- Rome (Italy)--WWII Tank like M13/40;

The Italian M13/40 was not that bad a tank, as the Australians and British were happy to use any that they captured. It you want to mention a bad Italian tank, try the M11/39, which had a hull-mounted 37mm gun and a one man turret carrying machine guns. The Italian only made 100 of them, and the British pretty much wiped them out. Note, the Italians initially called this a "breakthrough tank". Not a good design at all.

- Russia--WWII Fighter;

For the Russian fighter, probably the Polikarpov I-153, a biplane fighter introduced in 1939. It also had an engine with a very short life expectancy.

- Spain--a Napoleonic era Cavalry or Infantry perhaps?

My knowledge on history is mostly on XX century so your ideas for such units from Medieval and Ancient eras are welcome.

The Spanish infantry could at times be good, but the Spanish cavalry was a lot more of a toss-up. Had this tendency to charge when not ordered too, and not charge when ordered too. A bit like the French men-at-arms during the Hundred Years War.

 

[Ozymandias]

For the Russian fighter, probably the Polikarpov I-153, a biplane fighter introduced in 1939. It also had an engine with a very short life expectancy.

Yes, but consider how the Soviets wanted to use them! -

 

[Lionic]

It's not made into Civ 3 unit yet. As far as I understand Wyrmshadow's I-15 represents an earlier biplane in Spanish Republicans markings.

 

[Ozymandias]

It's not made into Civ 3 unit yet. As far as I understand Wyrmshadow's I-15 represents an earlier biplane in Spanish Republicans markings.

Which?

 

[Lionic]

This one https://forums.civfanatics.com/resources/polikarpov-i-15.9597/