Upgrade path for Berzerk

[joycem10]

When I first found out about the Berzerk unit in PTW I was anticipating a strategy similar to what I sue with the Egyptians. Build 20 or so chariots, or in this case archers, get the Great Library, and mass upgrade when I get the necessary tech. With the egyptians its chariots to knights, with the Vikings archers to berzerks. Having 20 knights at the dawn of chivalry is usually an overwhelming force and i figured that 20 berxerks would be even worse for the AI nearest me.

I figured this was a safe assumption as archers upgrade to longbowman and the berzerk is the unit that supersedes longbowman. Considering that berzerks are so much more expensive that longbowman I expected it to be pretty pricey, maybe around 3000 w/o Leo's shop. But with the GL that price was doable and would provide me with an overwhelming force.

Obviously I didnt check the civalapedia because guess what, nothing upgrades to berzerks, making this the only UU you cannot upgrade to. So instead of having 20 berzerks ready to line up against the arabs, i was stuck with 20 archers.

I imagine they didnt make anything upgradeable to berzerks because it is such a powerful unit, but man that really sucked. Berzerks take a long time to build.

Anyway, just an FYI for anyone that uses the GL strategy like I do.

 

[Aries]

That just happened to me in the game I’m playing- I had built up a TON of archers just waiting for Invention so I could do a massive upgrade, I had even saved up lots of gold to pay for it…and then I find that I cannot upgrade a single one, I had to instead switch my cities to berserk and disband the archers in those cities…very disappointing that they are the only UU that cant be upgraded to…

 

[Nakar]

The Spanish can't upgrade to Conquistadors either, actually. At least, not unless you have some way of getting scouts as the Spanish... of course there aren't very many reasons to build Conquistadors (except pillaging; best pillagers in the game) instead of Cavalry in the first place.

 

[joycem10]

Thanks Nakar, havent played the Spanish yet but that makes sense.

 

[Bamspeedy]

You can't upgrade your catapults to Hwachas either.

 

[sealman]

it was like this with the original. UU could not be upgraded to. will probably be fixed in a patch. anyone post something in the "bugs" forum?

 

[SVAN]

So, guys, why don't you go to Editor, select "edit units" and just add an upgrade path as you wish?
As for me, I was not happy with swardsmen running around in 2000AD, so I edited them to be upgradable to marine (I presumed that swardsmen were early footsoldier elite, as marines are).

SVAN

 

[joycem10]

sealman, i think it might be an intentional move by FIraxis to compensate for the power of some of the new UUs.

 

[gugalpm]

It shouldn't be modified in the patch. It seems more balanced. More to the point of exploiting, for me.

 

[sealman]

Originally posted by joycem10
sealman, i think it might be an intentional move by FIraxis to compensate for the power of some of the new UUs.

I would not know about their power. I still can not get ptw to play

 

[Cantankerous]

I think it makes sense that an archer shouldn't upgrade to a Berzerk because they are dissimilar types of troops.

Granted the Berzerk takes the place of a Longbowmen for the Vikings, but that doesn't mean it's a different type of longbowman.

It makes sense for Horsemen to upgrade to Knights and all other associated horse-based UUs that take the place of Knights because they are similar types of units. The same goes for swordsmen variants and the Knight->Cavalry-based UUs.

Of course the Samurai is the lone exception of the Horseman->Knight bunch, and an argument could be made that if a Horseman upgrades to a Samurai, then an Archer should upgrade to a Berzerk. Personally I consider the Samurai upgrade path to be a "fudge" so as to keep the Japanese player from being screwed. I don't see the same need for the Vikings though as Archers are not generally built in great numbers unless you're at war early and don't have iron.

But like some others said, Archer->Berzerk should not be allowed because of the unbalancing of the unit. Berzerks are tremendously powerful and the fact that they are so expensive is what primarily helps to balance them.

 

[Rammstein]

It's weird that the berserker should be so expensive. Any thoughts on that?

 

[erez87]

for any good thing, there is a bad thing, why you think they did it without upgrade path? thats you won't have too many berserk going on too fast... a prety nice idea i think...
and it's exepensive couse it so good...

 

[ezdraft]

I see this was fixed in the newest patch, does that mean that a berzerk will also upgrade to a better unit or just that archers can be upgraded to berzerk?

 

[Bamspeedy]

archers now upgrade to berserks.
Catapults can now upgrade to H'wacha.

 

[Silverflame]

I think beserks are too powerful if you can stockpile archers. Their defense should be 1, because even if attack by knights they still have a 1/3 chance of surviving.