US clawing back visa-free travel

[silver 2039]

Don't come to the US if you don't want to deal with it. You act as if its our duty to let you in easily or something....

 

[Winner]

How constructive...

 

[Winner]

Thats true, you dont hear much in the news about the Estonian suicide bombers. Liberal media?

Post-communist countries don't have large Muslim communities like Germany, France or the UK. Terrorists would find it hard to estabilish a base of operations there. But for some idiotic reason, the US Senate believes that they constitute a great threat to the US.

Yeah, right. Poles are waiting for an opportunity to navigate some boeings into tall buildings...

 

[luiz]

I'm not coming while I'm likely to be fingerprinted and photographed and interrogated and searched for no good reason. This is just one more asinine little cherry on a rather crappy cake. If that's going to happen to me, I'm going to at least make it part of a visit to a county where I expect that, and it's part of a story about a crazy backwards dictatorship... like stalinist Belarus, which I nearly went to last month.

Those are all measure that are likely to do no good you are right in that. But the fingerprinting and photographing takes only a few seconds, and the officers were quite polite to me all times I went through it.

In fact I always spend far less time doing the immigration in the US than in Brazil, and I am treated far worse here. I see no reason to stop going there, the inconvenience is negligible and there is no disrespect.

 

[emzie]

Don't come to the US if you don't want to deal with it. You act as if its our duty to let you in easily or something....

Yeah, that's a privlage reserved for Mexicans only.

Post-communist countries don't have large Muslim communities like Germany, France or the UK. Terrorists would find it hard to estabilish a base of operations there. But for some idiotic reason, the US Senate believes that they constitute a great threat to the US.

Yeah, right. Poles are waiting for an opportunity to navigate some boeings into tall buildings...

Immigration isn't worried about terrorists, they're worried about people overstaying their visas, and importing the wrong plants.

 

[Bill3000]

I, for one, am happy to go through a few security checks if it means that people who are doing their upmost to kill me will be kept out of my country.

There's more efficient ways to waste taxpayers money over something whose only purpose is to comfort people with self-delusion. Like, say, a government study showing that water is wet.

 

[Shylock]

Those are all measure that are likely to do no good you are right in that. But the fingerprinting and photographing takes only a few seconds, and the officers were quite polite to me all times I went through it.

In fact I always spend far less time doing the immigration in the US than in Brazil, and I am treated far worse here. I see no reason to stop going there, the inconvenience is negligible and there is no disrespect.

It's tyranny, but it's convenient tyranny.

That makes it ok right?

Who are these people are why do they want all this information? Doesn't this strike anybody as creepy? What if I were to go up to you and ask for biometric data?

 

[luiz]

It's tyranny, but it's convenient tyranny.

That makes it ok right?

Who are these people are why do they want all this information? Doesn't this strike anybody as creepy? What if I were to go up to you and ask for biometric data?

It's not OK, but some context is necessary. It is hardly making travells to the US any more difficult (thus far, at least). And I don't particularly care what they will do with my fingerprints and photographs; I am not an american citizen and the US government only has jurisdiction over me in the few days a year I spend there.

 

[Mr. Dictator]

This is stupid to be honest. Political correctness gone crazy damaging our tourism industry.

I'm sure the PC squad will jump on me but I don't care. If some 50 year old woman from the UK wants to come to this country for a visit, don't put her through strip searches and finger prints. Save it for muslims between the ages of 18-40 coming in and that will improve security far more than making sure every Japanese person that wants to tour this country has a full DNA profile in our computer.

Lets be honest here. There has never been a foreign non muslim terrorist attack on the US. So why the hell are we making their ability to travel here miserable just so that we can say we are treating everyone equally?

. .. .. .. . that. If your name is mohammad al jabrani bin hussein, guess what? We should make sure you are not a terrorist if you want to come here regardless of what country you are trying to enter from. If your name is Thomas Mackenzie, chances are you don't have a suicide vest strapped to you or a bunch of boxcutters in your pocket.

It kills me how efficient we could actually be if we would start profiling instead of this nonsense where we assume everyone has an equal chance of being a bad guy.

because timothy mcveigh was such a camel jockey...

 

[Joker85]

because timothy mcveigh was such a camel jockey...

No, but he is so rare that he is STILL all that can be brought up.

If 9,999 of the past 10,000 terrorists were muslims... if you want to avoid a terrorist attack the best place to start is profiling muslims.

I don't think you want to take the past decade and compare the number of non muslim terror attacks world wide against the number of muslim. You will only make the religion of peace look bad.

 

[Shylock]

No, but he is so rare that he is STILL all that can be brought up.

If 9,999 of the past 10,000 terrorists were muslims... if you want to avoid a terrorist attack the best place to start is profiling muslims.

I don't think you want to take the past decade and compare the number of non muslim terror attacks world wide against the number of muslim. You will only make the religion of peace look bad.

The Troubles were Al Qaeda's doing.

 

[Joker85]

The Terrors were Al Qaeda's doing.

Since when are al qaeda the only muslim terrorists in the world?

Let us take the past few days alone:

6/7/2008 (Narathiwat, Thailand) - Islamists gun down a 23-year-old civilian.
6/6/2008 (Dera Ismail Khan, Pakistan) - Five people are killed in a bombing by suspected Islamists.
6/6/2008 (Songkhla, Thailand) - Two construction workers are murdered by Muslim militants.
6/6/2008 (Yala, Thailand) - A Budhhist woman is murdered by Islamic gunmen.
6/6/2008 (Huriwa, Somalia) - Five civilians are killed during an ambush by Islamic militia.
6/6/2008 (Narathiwat, Thailand) - A middle-aged man is shot to death by Muslim radicals while returning from work.

Edit:

I see you edited your post to the Troubles I thought by terrors you meant 9/11. Again, there have been roughly 11,000 deadly islamic terror attacks since 9/11 alone. I don't know how many terrorist attacks on civilians the IRA carried out or how many people died. But I would venture that in the decades of conflict less people died than in an average year of violence from the religion of peace.

That said, when the British were still under terrorist threat from the IRA, it would be only prudent of them to profile and come up with the conclusion that it is more likely that a terrorist attack against them will come from an Irishman rather than a Japanese citizen. So if you can only search one... guess which one should get searched?

 

[emzie]

Since when are al qaeda the only muslim terrorists in the world?

Let us take the past few days alone:



AQ is our biggest enemy, but not our only enemy.

Someone's reading religionofpeace.com? Well I know who I never have to take seriously again. Form your own opinions man.

 

[Ecofarm]

The only thing that Immigration can do to keep 'teh terrorists' out is fingerprint and make sure the person's papers are in order. After that, everything they do is show. Everything.

It's fake! ALL FAKE!!11!!!

What happened to no black-and-white?!

It's unfair

Poor baby! It's a terrible and cruel world for you, isn't it? God damn those Americans and their iron heel crushing down upon thee! Bastards!! I hate them!!!!

Spoiler :

 

[Joker85]

Someone's reading religionofpeace.com? Well I know who I never have to take seriously again. Form your own opinions man.

Nice ad hominem. Way to contribute nothing. Do you deny those events took place? If not... seems you are attempting to divert and deflect by attacking the messenger rather than the veracity of the message.

So, again, do you contest that the events listed took place?

 

[LesCanadiens]

. .. .. .. . that. If your name is mohammad al jabrani bin hussein, guess what? We should make sure you are not a terrorist if you want to come here regardless of what country you are trying to enter from. If your name is Thomas Mackenzie, chances are you don't have a suicide vest strapped to you or a bunch of boxcutters in your pocket.

It kills me how efficient we could actually be if we would start profiling instead of this nonsense where we assume everyone has an equal chance of being a bad guy.

If your name is Mohammed al Jabrani bin Hussein, chances are you aren't a terrorist either. How many Muslim foreigners enter the United States every year? How many of them are terrorists? How many Muslim foreigners have entered the United States since 1958? How many of them were terrorists? Once you answer these questions, you'll understand that racial profiling is an exercise in futility, and serves only to piss people off.

 

[Ecofarm]

If your name is Mohammed al Jabrani bin Hussein, chances are you aren't a terrorist either. How many Muslim foreigners enter the United States every year? How many of them are terrorists? How many Muslim foreigners have entered the United States since 1958? How many of them were terrorists? Once you answer these questions, you'll understand that racial profiling is an exercise in futility, and serves only to piss people off.

And how many have names that are Chinese? Japanese? Swedish? French?

Once you answer these questions, you will understand why racial profiling is a matter of efficiency. It pisses me off everytime I see security waste their time (and my money) with an old Swedish woman.

Racial profiling is not only about targeting Muslims, it's about NOT TARGETTING old white ladies. But, of course, a victim mentality could never see that.

 

[emzie]

It's fake! ALL FAKE!!11!!!

What happened to no black-and-white?!

Well played!

I mean, I guess those measures might do something but if I wanna blow up a bus, and I couldn't get a proper visa to the US, I'm going to get a tourist visa to Mexico and just head north. As I said, the 'front line' of keeping terrorists out of the US is the embassies abroad.

Nice ad hominem. Way to contribute nothing. Do you deny those events took place? If not... seems you are attempting to divert and deflect by attacking the messenger rather than the veracity of the message.

So, again, do you contest that the events listed took place?

I'm being dismissive because the site is a load of crap, yet you're eating it up. I really don't care if those incidents happened. Not all of those events are terrorism. The site's entire premiss is false. Muslim kills a non muslim? MUST BE TERRORISM!!!!111

 

[Joker85]

If your name is Mohammed al Jabrani bin Hussein, chances are you aren't a terrorist either. How many Muslim foreigners enter the United States every year? How many of them are terrorists? How many Muslim foreigners have entered the United States since 1958? How many of them were terrorists? Once you answer these questions, you'll understand that racial profiling is an exercise in futility, and serves only to piss people off.

You seem to have missed the point.

On 9/11/01 at around 8:00am if you were a muslim between the ages of 20-40 boarding a plane, the "chances" are that you were not a terrorist, or one of the hijackers.

My point is not that every muslim is a terrorist, but that most terrorists are muslim. If we are going to institute extremely tight security measures, it is wise to target them towards the people more likely to carry out attacks.

If you only have time to fully search 1 person, do you pick the 25 year old from yemen or the 60 year old from mexico? Frankly I don't care if people are pissed off or not. I'm pissed off that our idiotic policies treat everyone as equal threats when that is clearly not the case. Of course that does not mean you just let whites or asians or blacks skate through unchecked. But you do need to target your scrutiny to the people most likely to be in a gotta get my virgins mood.

It is really common sense and goes beyond muslims/arabs. Not all whites are klansman. But all klansman are white. Not all mexicans cross our southern border and enter illegally, but most people that cross our southern border and enter illegally are mexican. It is not a difficult concept to anyone not in a hyper PC state of stagnation.

 

[Grisu]

I, for one, am happy to go through a few security checks if it means that people who are doing their upmost to kill me will be kept out of my country.

the problem is, that this won't really keep out that kind of people. what it will achieve is keeping paying tourists out. but VRWC is right, it's your country and ultimately your own money you lose