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Vokarya's Workshop: Buildings

Discussion in 'Rise of Mankind: A New Dawn' started by Vokarya, Sep 21, 2013.

  1. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    I like some of this, but not Storyteller Circle. I like the idea of linking Fire Pit/Ceremonial Altar/Temple because they are all ritual buildings. Storyteller Circle is more about entertainment; thus the happy bonus. I think I will push Elder Council going obsolete back to Alphabet so as to give you a window to upgrade EC to School of Scribes, and then push Scribes going obsolete to Journalism to give you the window to upgrade to Printer. There are a couple other buildings that are going to get their obsoleting pushed back to make proper lines (Town Watch and Gambling Hall are on my list).

    I think Shrine going obsolete is to keep it from being too good in the late game when you have lots of resources. I think there is also too much of a cluster of religion civics in the Ancient Era and that they could be broken up somewhat.
     
  2. Zeta Nexus

    Zeta Nexus Chieftain

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    Than how about replacing Storytellers Circle with Theatre? First you just tell the story, later you play it.

    I see your point, but Shrine is good or too good only until changing to State Church or Free Church, witch doesn't take too long.
    How about replacing this one too with the temples? That would give a little early bonus to those civs, that could not fund a religion.
     
  3. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    I'm going to have to clean my screenshots out of this thread. I'm getting full on attachments and need to make some room. I think just about everything in here that isn't very recent is now in the mod.
     
  4. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    I'm redoing my comprehensive list of what each tech allows and finding a few things as I go that should be cleaned up.

    I want to push Boatyard to go obsolete at Screw Propeller. It currently goes obsolete at Navigation, which is also where its replacement Marina appears. If the Boatyard is obsolete, then the Marina never gets to upgrade it.

    Gambling Hall doesn't necessarily need to go obsolete at Legalized Gambling. I think it would be better if it never went obsolete but was replaced by Casino. Then the gamblers flock to the new, clean, legal gambling place and the Hall disappears. The 10% gold from the Casino should be better than the +3 gold from the Hall.

    Likewise, I think Town Watch should be allowed to evolve into Police Station. If we push Town Watch's obsoleting back to Labor Union, then there is a window where Town Watch can upgrade to Police Station. I also think Police Station should require either/both of Courthouse and/or Jail (and maybe even Jail requiring Courthouse first). What do you think?
     
  5. 45°38'N-13°47'E

    45°38'N-13°47'E Chieftain

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    I agree on everything but would prefer Police Station to require Jail OR Courthouse: sounds better to me and easier to get.
     
  6. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    Sure, we can do that. I was trying to make a law enforcement "cluster" of buildings (not necessarily replacements, but still linked together). It's still easy enough to do.
     
  7. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    Some minor touch-ups coming in the next revision:

    I will have Elder Council stay around until Alphabet but be replaced by School of Scribes. I will have to look more carefully at establishing the School of Scribes - Printer connection. I don't want science to go down because one building replaces another.

    Fire Pit will lead into Ceremonial Altar and then all Temples.

    For those who use Guilds, Apothecaries Master Guild will require Apothecary instead of Healer's Hut. It seems to make more sense this way.
     
  8. Zeta Nexus

    Zeta Nexus Chieftain

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    I just realized that Movie Theatre is replacing Theatre :confused:
    While I see your point with it Vokarya, i don't think it is an accurate choice, sinse they serve two different purposes: Theatre is a source of culture, while Cinema is rather a source of entertainment. They coexist in our days.
    However Theatre could lose some of its bonuses with the appearance of Movie Theatre's tech, since it's no longer so attractive.


    I totally agree with Wirtual Reality replacing them both.
    (...maybe Opera house too? :rolleyes:)


    And what do you think of Theatre replacing Storyteller's Circle ?
    At least SC would not hang in the air.
     
  9. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    Some more minor changes:

    Town Watch: Add 1 Spy slot. I don't currently think the number of available Spy slots is balanced against the number of other specialist slots, and this will help.

    Candlemaker's Shop: Can build with Apiary OR Butchery. It should not need both - either Butchery for tallow or Apiary for wax.

    Drydock: Move from Steel to Machine Tools. Right now, Machine Tools is a totally agricultural tech, as it provides the Cannery and +1 food from Farms. I'd like to give Machine Tools something non-food-related as well.
     
  10. Rezca

    Rezca The Greatest Jaggi

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    I really like the Town Watch idea :)
    Spy Specialists are so rare before the Industrial/Modern, and it does make sense too :)

    I like the other ideas too, but the Town Watch spy addition was the highlight for me ^^
     
  11. Combat Wombat

    Combat Wombat Chieftain

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    Tanks made static defenses like barb-wire obsolete. Letting them continue to be useful past that point doesn't make much sense. There is no useful static defense in the modern era against ground attack. Letting it pick back up in the post-modern eras with energy shielding makes sense though.
     
  12. Zeta Nexus

    Zeta Nexus Chieftain

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    I was thinking about the usefulnes of Palaside. Doesn't it get replaced too quikly with walls? :mischief:
    IMHO you get walls too quikly, before you would need any fortification.
    I don't think walls should be pushed back in the tec tree, but maybe walls could require a city size of 6 or so.
     
  13. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    Most units by this point are Ignores Building Defense. This will help you against any unit that is not, which would include most of the basic gunpowder units.
     
  14. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    I don't want to do city size requirements on buildings. Palisade is supposed to be cheap early defense. I could bring the cost down even further -- it currently costs half of Walls, but it could be lowered even more. I find the Ancient Era to pretty tedious at this point because building costs are so high compared to hammer production.
     
  15. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    Something that I am trying to avoid with buildings in general is for them to go obsolete without giving you the opportunity to upgrade them first. The Armourer is a building like this; it shows up at Smithing, gives +20% land unit production and 1 Engineer slot, and then disappears at Flintlock. I think it would be a good idea to fold this building into the Siege Weapons Workshop-Cannon Forge-Arsenal line, like this:
    • Cannon Forge gets +20% to Land Unit production (mirroring Armourer). This then increases to 25% for all units at Arsenal.
    • Cannon Forge and Arsenal get 1 Engineer specialist slot.
    • Armourer then upgrades to Cannon Forge and Arsenal. It still goes obsolete at Flintlock, but you have from Gunpowder to Flintlock to upgrade it.

    What do you think?
     
  16. Noyyau

    Noyyau Privateer Captain

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    In gameplay terms that looks really good!

    Though I'm not sure how a cannon forge is supposed to speed construction of ALL land units. (It makes sense for the Arsenal though)
     
  17. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    Think of it as making gunbarrels and other military equipment.
     
  18. JosEPh_II

    JosEPh_II TBS WarLord

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    Amen Brother! +1

    JosEPh
     
  19. Kryanni

    Kryanni Twisted Sister

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    I didn't see where Palisade was on the tech tree until my recent game. Agreed, if it was cheaper I might've bothered but as it was I decided to just wait until walls, which weren't far off.
     
  20. Zeta Nexus

    Zeta Nexus Chieftain

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    I see.
    Than lower the price to 1/4 or 1/5, maybe and change obsolate tech to the same as for walls. In this way we will allways have the chance to get a quick-built low deffence buildings even in the new small cities.
    What do you think, does it make sense?
     

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