WFYABTA...... Buddy.

facistal

facistal

Civer
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Jul 27, 2006
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I was playing Shaka today, and was getting along Nicely with HC and Rangar both @ Friendly in Buddhist Block with me. (I actually had a +7 brothers of our faith from Rangar which I have never seen before) But out of the blue HC WFYABTA's me while he was @ +17 with one -1 You declared on our friend.. It was inopportune too, because I was relying on him to get my chemistry slingshot in good timing.

Anyway, I thought that friendly was the cure all for WFYABTA. Was I mistaken, is there another overriding force?

Thoughts?
 
Nope.... Although I was at war with someone he was pleased with. But like I said, +17 -1 modifiers.
 
It seems to be that there is a difference between "We fear you are becoming too advanced" and "We just don't like you enough" and "We're not ready to trade this tech yet"
I'm not sure what the difference is, though. Seems that "We just don't like you" can be overcome with good diplomacy, but the WFYABTA in my experience doesn't really depend on diplomacy.
 
WFYABTA stands for We Feel You Are Becoming To Advanced.

Every AI has a limit on the number of techs it know you have received in trade, and then it will not trade with you anymore. The number varies from leader to leader. Toku and some down at 5 to Mansa the sole member of the 20 tech club.

There are exception however, and one of them is supposed to be that if you are at friendly with a civ (not pleased... must be friendly) then it does not apply and they will trade freely with you. There are other ways of avoiding it such as both of you being in the bottom half of the scoreboard i think.

If ever a Civ has known you for a while, and doesnt hate you, and all their techs are red in the trade screen then you are probably at the WFYABTA limit. If you haver over the red tech it will say why.

The biggest thing to remember about this is not to trade for a tech you dont really want. Like if you still dont have archery in 1300 AD and then it looks like you can get it thrown in on another deal, dont bother , it will increase your WFYABTA. Sometimes less is more in tech trading.
 
friendly only covers the WFYABTA redline, other redlines may still apply. i can't tell from your "If ever a Civ has known you for a while, and doesnt hate you, and all their techs are red in the trade screen then you are probably at the WFYABTA limit. If you hover over the red tech it will say why." whether you actually did hover and you did specifically see the WFYABTA there or not.

you mention chemistry ... maybe what you wanted to trade for was engineering, and they were trying to build Hagia Sophia? in that case, the redline would be "We Have Our Reasons". that means they're building the wonder and aren't going to let you have the tech until they're done (or lose the race to build it), no matter how much they like you. i can't blame them, i act the same way.

another possibility is something like "we're not ready to begin trading this tech just yet". means they consider it too much of a monopoly so far to share it with you, no matter how much they like you.

you may have already known that, i can't tell how much you understand about the whole WFYABTA thing. you keep mentioning the +17 -1. the actual numbers don't matter a single bit. all that matters is the word Friendly. the numbers just give you a sense of how easy it would be to stay friendly if you have to do something to irritate him a bit. but the AI himself doesn't care whether you're at +9 or +300, if he considers you a Friend you're a Friend and there's no such thing as Friend/Good Friend/Best Friend. well, until you get into voting for UN ... but for WFYABTA, you can ignore the numbers, it's all in the words.

as DaveMcW suggested, the best way for us to help is to upload a save. without that we can only guess.
 
My guess is that Shaka is unwilling to trade because like KMadCandy says he considers everything is too much of a monopoly. If I recall about 70% of the world needs to know that tech before he is willing to trade.
 
Well thanks for the responses - sorry I don't think i have a save from that era of the game which I have now finished. (Diplo win 1584)

Sice everyone agrees that WFYABTA is cancelled out by friendly status I guess I must've been wrong about the exact situation. Maybe I had vassalized Germany by that point. Ah well...
 
well you won :). so that's good! but yeah i know the feeling of wanting to understand why it happened. be careful with vassals. i so very much love it when i get mansa as an early vassal, then meet someone on the other continent who instantly hates him and demands that i stop trading with him. ummmmmm, NO.
 
Friendly WFYABTA.

I believe I was just barely Friendly with HC at the time, so I assumed it was a bug that had to do with that. I might have even went to Pleased next turn. But when it happened to you, it seems like you were deep in Friendly territory, so it's probably something else.

Civ4ScreenShot0002-small.JPG
 
Mr. Z said:
Friendly WFYABTA.
Click to expand...

Look in the lower right hand corner of the image... why can you see what Qin is researching? Noviche, nil point

Also note: had you cropped the photo, there wouldn't have been any way to tell. This is why posting a save is critical - it allows for independent confirmation.
 
if you have a vassal, or the other guy has (or is) a vassal, the whole equation is changed. the AI considers his (team's) attitude towards your entire team when deciding whether to trade. a team is defined as team when set up at the start of the game, a PA, or master/vassal. for the Friendly/WFYABTA cancellation to count, the entire team has to be friendly with the other entire team.

that even applies to your vassals if you have more than one. if you have mansa musa and gandhi as vassals, and you're friendly with mansa and gandhi, but gandhi and mansa are only pleased with each other, then you do not qualify for the get-out-of-WFYABTA-free card with either one of them, because your team isn't at friendly status as a whole.
 
is the WFYABTA limit dependent on level? Ive never hit it (ever) on noble, but now that Ive started on prince I see it a lot. However, this could also be because im more depending on researching techs the ais dont and then trading around to stay caught up, which is less necessary on noble
 
You have vassal.
It is a bug in my opinion, but currently tech trde is dome with team and rounded down. I bet HC is not friendly with your vassal.
 
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