What is acceptable diplomacy in a GMR game?

[New Weird Order]

And, yes people, we need few rulesets.
Lets brainstorm!

To be fair to Deebo, that's what he was saying to a strong degree.

 

[Slvynn]

To be fair to Deebo, that's what he was saying to a strong degree.

I am fair, and that's only (sadly) thing of him i approve!
(but, eh, there is one!)

 

[michaeltrnka]

First off let me say that my intention is not to bag on any player here but just to state my opinion on global politics in GMR and help improve GMR as a general platform.

I don't understand why it is a problem to comment on global politics before two civs meet. Sorc I understand your point is about immersion. After all how can you comment on a war between 2 civilizations if you don't know either exist. But Civ has always had a skewed time frame. It can take several years to move between 2 cities, it can take decades to train a group of men and wars can last a thousand years. There is no point in waiting to meet a Civ to comment on their situation as it will not change my actions or my opinions about it. Also it is not inconceivable that news of a distant empire may travel across the world to another ruler even if they have never met the other Civ. Alexander the Great new of India long before he ever set foot in Persia but no Greek had ever been to India or even so much as met an Indian. The English use to tell stories of evil Mongols raiding in the 1200 even though it would be at least 500 years before an Englishmen ever saw a Mongol. And in 1200 I'm sure King John would tell you he despised Mongols.

NWO I know that you don't like secret diplomacy (e.g. off the general message board) but I really don't see how this can be prevented. If you make a rule against this people are just going to do it and not tell you about it. Also, if you are worried about language barriers you have to stop quoting A Clockwork Orange. I am an native English speaker, and I am currently reading the book and I still have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[tommynt]

i agree, simply you dont play GMR tommy, we are not talking just about general FFA, GMR are months-long games

so what?
There are 2 options:
you set a clear ruleset before game
you dont complain

if there are clear rules (like no alliances no chatting, no whatever) you can ask people to acept them.
But quitting when nobody is hurting a rule which isnt clear - is pretty ridic and one should at least be quiete about it.

 

[The_J]

@tommy: that could have been a bit friendlier.

I hope you are talking about previous quotes from other players and you are not talking about my quote which you posted only a minute after which was:

You're correct . Had not seen your post, meant the other one .

 

[Slvynn]

so what?
There are 2 options:
you set a clear ruleset before game
you dont complain

if there are clear rules (like no alliances no chatting, no whatever) you can ask people to acept them.
But quitting when nobody is hurting a rule which isnt clear - is pretty ridic and one should at least be quiete about it.

okok thats why thread exist.... GMR community growing, and some templates should be done.....

the main complain, still about the tone/ruining /spoiling my game
Also, i am still, have my own right for my own oppinion, which states that in game which was (1st version which goes screwed because forgotten reason) was said "In-Game diplomacy", and even without it, some basic Civ V diplo mechanics/ sense honor code should persist
same CivLeague have own rule set for CTONs, so, it's a sign that it's a time for some templates for GMR community.

again, i did quit because i dont feel like playing year-long game in company of people who talk in such tone, game that was spolied and certain interest ruined. If those are not solid reasons to quit (it was my 1st quit thru 1000s of games i played) for you, i am glad for you, but for me they are, and others should/could/could not/may respect/accept that.

and, again, Tommy, i do remember how you were pissed and complained about other people were gang banging you in ctons, may be you changed during year+, but i remember that

 

[michaeltrnka]

that could have been a bit friendlier.

Sorry I was trying to decide whether or not to be offended. And If I did decide to be offended I didn't want to sound to ingratiating.

 

[Islandia]

Hey guys - I don't want to dig into the misunderstanding that led to this as I don't have all the information in front of me, but I know how frustrating it is to have a player drop out of a GMR game so even though I don't like epic speed, I would be happy to substitute in as Japan. And feel free to denounce me all you want and have secret alliances against me as well because I guarantee you on epic speed, Foffaren will be dead before I meet any of the rest of you

 

[The_J]

Sorry I was trying to decide whether or not to be offended. And If I did decide to be offended I didn't want to sound to ingratiating.

Missunderstanding again ^^, was again not directed at you .

 

[Foffaren]

Hey guys - I don't want to dig into the misunderstanding that led to this as I don't have all the information in front of me, but I know how frustrating it is to have a player drop out of a GMR game so even though I don't like epic speed, I would be happy to substitute in as Japan. And feel free to denounce me all you want and have secret alliances against me as well because I guarantee you on epic speed, Foffaren will be dead before I meet any of the rest of you

God I hate you.

Because its GMR you can often choose your own rules for diplomacy, but it has to be there. Playing GMR like a league would be dreadfully boring.
As to the matter of deciding common rules for it, I dont know. I like the way diplomacy is handled in Onans speed optimized for example, and I play like that in many, if not all my games. IC mixed with OOC to be able to add some funnies. Thats the kind of person I am and it comes naturaly when I write in the same way.

 

[Slvynn]

Hey guys - I don't want to dig into the misunderstanding that led to this as I don't have all the information in front of me, but I know how frustrating it is to have a player drop out of a GMR game so even though I don't like epic speed, I would be happy to substitute in as Japan. And feel free to denounce me all you want and have secret alliances against me as well because I guarantee you on epic speed, Foffaren will be dead before I meet any of the rest of you

haha go for it! banzai!

@everyone
i quit not bc of ganbang / i did complained / , but because games healthy atmosphere was ruined by bad tone talk

good luck , Islandia

 

[LostKnight]

I think the problem was that Slvynn think in term of competitive gaming. He keep talking about *OOC*, league game and such, why I (at least) have no idea what that ever mean. I dont play competively and I do expect getting crushed in every single GMR game I play. I still do it for fun.

He took for granted rules that a lot of players has no idea what they were and got pissed when we stated we did not know about it. All I(godcyric) did was dissagreeing with you being a warmonger. Yes, it is a denouncment, and I could not have done that in single player game since I did not meet you, but it was NEVER stated that it could not be done, and no one has grouped on you. Both you and Foffaren called for help on the other, but unless it was done publicly, no one has answered the call.

 

[Slvynn]

I think the problem was that Slvynn think in term of competitive gaming. He keep talking about *OOC*, league game and such, why I (at least) have no idea what that ever mean. I dont play competively and I do expect getting crushed in every single GMR game I play. I still do it for fun.

He took for granted rules that a lot of players has no idea what they were and got pissed when we stated we did not know about it. All I(godcyric) did was dissagreeing with you being a warmonger. Yes, it is a denouncment, and I could not have done that in single player game since I did not meet you, but it was NEVER stated that it could not be done, and no one has grouped on you. Both you and Foffaren called for help on the other, but unless it was done publicly, no one has answered the call.

my call was for jokes after Foff call and after others denouncement-of-unmet-civ-with-promise-to -aid -other

thats not denouncement, and i dont want to play many month game with player that allow to himslef to talk to another in such tone + my warplanswere spoiled, and i dont like it. I have own rights to dislike it , and i do. For this game bc it was remake it gone awry but in chillout 1 which save got screwed were mention "in game diplomacy". means no diplomacy prior metting civ. Also its been rediculous i been called waronger after me being fair ooc. I didnt even attacked yet. Stop being rediculous.

did i attacked someone?
did those denouncing civs met me or Foff?
is giving promise of help =! denouncement?
is my complaint good reason for such tone?
are you making any rason with your post?
why should i tolerate such atmosphere for game i plan for month and plan to get joy from it?

 

[michaeltrnka]

Hey guys - I don't want to dig into the misunderstanding that led to this as I don't have all the information in front of me, but I know how frustrating it is to have a player drop out of a GMR game so even though I don't like epic speed, I would be happy to substitute in as Japan. And feel free to denounce me all you want and have secret alliances against me as well because I guarantee you on epic speed, Foffaren will be dead before I meet any of the rest of you

As India I think you are despicable. But as michaeltrnka I think that I like you.

 

[michaeltrnka]

We also have another AI (Russia) in the game. It would be nice if we could add another player for that AI (Russia). Anyone interested?

Islandia since you could put yourself in could you put someone else in also?

 

[michaeltrnka]

Also I want to tell Sorc that I am not grudging you for leaving. I hope you understand that I was completely ignorant of any rules and or etiquette.

Also I have a post on this page which I would really like to hear everyone's opinion on. http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=472525
Sorry for plugging my post but I think that it is important.

 

[Islandia]

We also have another AI (Russia) in the game. It would be nice if we could add another player for that AI (Russia). Anyone interested?

Islandia since you could put yourself in could you put someone else in also?

I do not have that ability - only species zero and nullmaster as far as I know. I'm not sure who is "running" this game now, but if that person can make a request in the GMR games thread they have been very accommodating and responsive.

 

[Onan]

Slvynn or others, if you want to come up with a particular description of a rule set to use as reference for certain games you run, sounds like a good idea for those games.

I don't think there needs to be any standardisation across the GMR community. The great thing about these games is how varied they are. And because they're played at most by 12 players, it makes sense for any specific rules to be set just between those players in that particular game. Just be clear about things before you start. With your game that blew up above, it would've probably been wise to paste the original rules discussion from the previous thread, so anyone coming into the new thread would be sure to see that.

Myself I tend to find the less rules which aren't part of the game mechanics, the better, since there's no way to enforce anything else, beyond the honor system. More rules usually just makes for more disputes about them.