What is that violet-white civ on the mini map down there?

Menzies said:
Put bluntly, the colours of the "unknown" civ are the ones from the Venetian flag, and the only way this could conceivably happen is if they got it from said flag.
Click to expand...

I don't have a fully-formed opinion on whether I think Venice is in.

I just had to step on this particular claim, to point out that I don't think inconceivable means what you think it means.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D58LpHBnvsI
 
look this is just basic paint. are you SURE!!! that in whatever software they used they didn't just use the default light purple???
 

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PerceeP927 said:
look this is just basic paint. are you SURE!!! that in whatever software they used they didn't just use the default light purple???
Click to expand...

Do you know of a program that happens to have that exact purple and that exact cream as default colours? Do you then know the odds that they happened to pick that particular purple or that particular cream from said programs.

If you going to suggest that a program uses those exact colours, how about you actually find it. Otherwise you may as well suggest that Hahmdy von Splookenspeil, the mystical elf, gave them the idea to put us off the trail of the real addition, the Empire of Xhanthitatulnua.
 
Also, in case anyone was wondering:



To the left is the closest default colours in paint, to the right is the colours seen.

Compare this to:



To the left is the colours from Wikipedia's version of Venice's flag, to the right is the colours seen in game.
 
Poor Menzies, he doesn't even really like the idea of Venice in the game but he has grown into the civ's most ardent supporter.
 
Menzies said:
If you going to suggest that a program uses those exact colours, how about you actually find it. Otherwise you may as well suggest that Hahmdy von Splookenspeil, the mystical elf, gave them the idea to put us off the trail of the real addition, the Empire of Xhanthitatulnua.
Click to expand...

Besides, a Xhanthitatulnuan Civ would probably have a stark Xanthan yellow as their main color. That's just common sense.
 
I only have paint I can't afford these programs. If the person making the wikipedia graphic used the same program as the civ designer (like photoshop - not impossible, in fact likely) and they both clicked on purple, that explains everything.

I just want you to admit that this isn't impossible, you are making a dangerous assumption that they clicked randomly in a color pallete for that venitian flag. It has been shown that the original was blue earlier in this thread - clearly they didn't go for accuracy.

maybe... just clicked on that preset purpley periwinkle
 
PerceeP927 said:
I only have paint I can't afford these programs. If the person making the wikipedia graphic used the same program as the civ designer (like photoshop - not impossible, in fact likely) and they both clicked on purple, that explains everything.

I just want you to admit that this isn't impossible, you are making a dangerous assumption that they clicked randomly in a color pallete for that venitian flag. It has been shown that the original was blue earlier in this thread - clearly they didn't go for accuracy.

maybe... just clicked on that preset purpley periwinkle
Click to expand...

That's an interesting point, where did the maker of the SVG for the Venetian Flag get his purple and cream from, as the part that is purple should be Venetian Blue, whilst the cream and such should be Gold. From my limited work vectorising such badges and flags, generally you'd use what you're working from for the colours. Surely he wouldn't have just used default colours, and even if he did, they'd surely be closer to the actual colours than this was.

That said, even if they were default colours (very odd default colours mind you) for some program, the odds of the creators using that particular default program, and picking, at random, those particular default colours, seems very slim indeed. You're right though, without knowing exactly where these colours on the flag actually came from, there is a very small chance that this is just some very big coincidence.

That said, when you throw in that Riga looks almost certain to be replaced, it would still take close to a miracle of sorts for this all to be some huge coincidence overall.
 
Menzies said:
That's an interesting point, where did the maker of the SVG for the Venetian Flag get his purple and cream from, as the part that is purple should be Venetian Blue, whilst the cream and such should be Gold. From my limited work vectorising such badges and flags, generally you'd use what you're working from for the colours. Surely he wouldn't have just used default colours, and even if he did, they'd surely be closer to the actual colours than this was.

That said, even if they were default colours (very odd default colours mind you) for some program, the odds of the creators using that particular default program, and picking, at random, those particular default colours, seems very slim indeed. You're right though, without knowing exactly where these colours on the flag actually came from, there is a very small chance that this is just some very big coincidence.

That said, when you throw in that Riga looks almost certain to be replaced, it would still take close to a miracle of sorts for this all to be some huge coincidence overall.
Click to expand...

Venice will be in, but not as the purple civ. I bet you 10 bucks :lol:
 
PerceeP927 said:
maybe... just clicked on that preset purpley periwinkle
Click to expand...

You would have thought the preset purple they chose would be the same as the purple they used for Rome, Egypt, Carthage or Byzantium...

They have used a different shade of purple to their "preset" for this. It would be an awful big coincidence that the new shade of purple, that they just so happened to start using for this civ, they chose to add just so happened to be the exact same one as featured on the Venetian flag.

Also i believe the flag with the blue globe thingy's is actually a newer version of the flag, originating as far back as 1997 from what i can tell. From what i've read the purple is the original, unless i'm missing something.
 
In defence of Menizes, not that he needs my help I'm sure, he has come up with some really remarkable evidence for a Venetian civ, from the city state list changes, and their colour scheme usage - he has made mistakes in the latter, by his own admission - and even then, after correcting himself, his proposals still stand up to scrutiny. Before the mini-map spot, and the wiki Venetian flag find, Venice looked very likely, a likelihood cemented by Menizes keen nose (and others, of course, credit where due) - but now we have near mathematically perfect colour matches to a Venetian source, the likelihood of Venice as jumped to very improbable it won't be in.

Kudos to Menizes, he's done some really good work on this, to give us all an edge on knowing what's in our favourite computer game. Good job Menizes. Nice one.
 
The only thing that could make it not Venice is if the SVG flagmakers on Wikipedia have a certain program with preset, specific colours, that uses this specific shade of purple and white. That way, it could also be any other flag containing these two colours. Going through some of the other flags the author of this one made, there seem to be colours reused throughout, but none of them seem to have these specific colours in them. Similarly, going through flags of states and nations, I can't find any with these exact colours. I challenge anyone to find any other use of these two colours together, anywhere :p
 
I just came here (not really), saw a reply that's act like Venice is confirmed, check the "What we know" thread and then here. Standing ovation for Menzies, You did it again. (1. Even you aren't Archangel, I'll vote for you :D )

I think you have to argue with lot of uh... "that kind of people" who have none of slightest of evidence that disprove your theory. Unless dev are like "Oh, How about using color from Venetian flag for another civ? lol." ,Venice would be in BNW. (For me, It's about 85% sure)

I think "that kind of people" is like someone who think the world is flat in nowadays.
 
poom3619 said:
I just came here (not really), saw a reply that's act like Venice is confirmed, check the "What we know" thread and then here. Standing ovation for Menzies, You did it again. (1. Even you aren't Archangel, I'll vote for you :D )

I think you have to argue with lot of uh... "that kind of people" who have none of slightest of evidence that disprove your theory. Unless dev are like "Oh, How about using color from Venetian flag for another civ? lol." ,Venice would be in BNW. (For me, It's about 85% sure)

I think "that kind of people" is like someone who think the world is flat in nowadays.
Click to expand...

Thers probably 10% chance it isn't which is pretty low. There a few alternative Euro civs bit none particularly compelling or backed with evidence. The Tatars (Golden Horde) fit but they seem redundant as do the Visigoths but they have a connection to the Moors as do the Vandals.
 
Maybe they chose purple and white (the exact same shade of purple from the venetian flag) just to mess with us.

Once we're done arguing whether this is a reference to the Sioux colour palate from civ II or the Venetian flag and that these both suit the alphabet and city state theory, and the devs stop laughing, they will reveal Galapagos and Antarctica civs and leave us scratching our heads...

But more seriously, I think there is enough evidence here to be confident it's Venice.
 
Agreed that White on Purple would fit The Iroquois the best (currently they have Yellow/Tan on Gray), but I don't see Firaxis changing them... At best, a new Native American could take the Iroquois' current color scheme and change The Iroquois', but I don't see that as being probable - besides, the purple is different from the one in the screenshot... :sad:

I'd kinda enjoy if they revealed to be someone completely different though! :lol:
 
I don't believe that this purple is Venice.
I more in agreement with the new NAtive American. Apache or Sioux...
 
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