What is the Nature of God?

[MobBoss]

I think there's no god.

And this adds to a conversation/thread about the Nature of God how?

 

[Masquerouge]

And this adds to a conversation/thread about the Nature of God how?

Well Eran clearly stated that people that did not believe in god could also express their views on god:

If you don't believe in God at all, why do you think the idea is such a common one among humans? What is the psychological basis for the concept?

I thought it was honest of me to say that I was not a believer before posting my opinions.

 

[puglover]

This thread exists not to ask what your religion is. There are enough threads about that already. The question is, how do you perceive God? Who is He/She/It/They? What is His relationship to any other forces in the universe? What is His relationship to humans? What can He do or not do, and why?

If you don't believe in God but consider His existence a possibility, what aspects or characteristics of God do you think are more plausible or likely than others, and why?

If you don't believe in God at all, why do you think the idea is such a common one among humans? What is the psychological basis for the concept?

As for me: I believe God to be a personal being, with both a spiritual and physical body. I don't consider Him to be anthropomorphic but humans to be theomorphic. We are made in His image and have the potential to one day become like Him.

He is omnibenevolent - His love for us is infinite. However, His powers are limited. There are fundamental laws of the universe that He could not violate without ceasing to be God. Among these are justice - He cannot violate justice, He must seek another way to satisfy it. He also cannot, merely by desiring it, turn humans into divine beings. It has to be done the hard way. He can do anything that can be done in the universe, but He is not omnipotent.

He is self-existing, ie was not created from nothing; on the other hand, the physical universe itself is also self-existing. When He created it, He organized it from pre-existing materials. I believe that modern cosmology, geology, and evolutionary biology describe the processes He used as well as we are able to understand.

He is a separate being from Christ, who I believe to be divine as well and His son in a way that most humans are not; they, as well as the Holy Ghost, work together to bring about God's greatest work: the salvation and perfection of mankind. Doing this will elevate both humanity and its Creator.

He has an influence on humans; He will sometimes intervene in our lives, although usually it is in a way that is not externally obvious. Thus miracles do not defy the laws of nature but may sometimes defy the laws of probability.

So what does everyone else think? If nothing else, this should show that not all theists, even all Christians, believe in the traditional Christian concept of God.

That sums up most of what I believe about the nature of God He is just enough to administer punishment for disobedience, but loving enough to sacrifice himself to save his universe.

Though I do have some objections. I don't understand the part about creating the universe from existing materials. He himself was all he needed to call the universe into being (most likely through the natural processes we observe around us), but the universe is not self-existing. And we have no potential to become like God, we are always subordinate. We are "theomorphic", but still are his creatures.

 

[Perfection]

You know that strange smelly guy that always has to sit next to you on the bus?

That's God, he's punishing you for your sins!

 

[Masquerouge]

He is omnibenevolent - His love for us is infinite. However, His powers are limited. There are fundamental laws of the universe that He could not violate without ceasing to be God. Among these are justice - He cannot violate justice, He must seek another way to satisfy it. He also cannot, merely by desiring it, turn humans into divine beings. It has to be done the hard way. He can do anything that can be done in the universe, but He is not omnipotent.

That's interesting. How would you define divine justice? Does it apply in the afterlife? Does it apply to non believers, or people that died without given the chance to prove their worthiness (like babies)?

 

[CaptainF]

God is a feeling. God is something you feel that gives one a sense of connection to the world, or a sense of beauty. The string that ties it all together so to speak.

I tend not to believe in God as a physical manifestation, or as a being that would punish what it created. God does not exist to lay down a silly law. That is for humans. God should be higher than mere legislation of sin and other such trifle matters. It doesn't matter if you sin or not, because he's God after all. He should know what you are really made of.

I also tend not to believe many holy men when they claim they know what God wants. How can something so powerful and transcendent be so readily understandable by a mere human such as yourself? For all we know, God doesn't give a damn about us, or what we do.

By the way, I'm an agnostic.

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

That's interesting. How would you define divine justice? Does it apply in the afterlife? Does it apply to non believers, or people that died without given the chance to prove their worthiness (like babies)?

Justice always applies. Because of justice, no one can be punished infinitely (like burn in hell forever) for a finite sin, and humans can't commit any other kind. Because of justice, no one can be held accountable for truths they didn't have and no one can be punished for sins they didn't commit (like babies, who are incapable of sinning). However, justice does mean that we need to be punished for our sins, and that our sins keep us from God.

What is more important is mercy. Mercy is God giving us more than we deserve or have any claim to. Mercy is Him forgiving us of our sins, even though He doesn't have to.

The conflict between justice and mercy that thus arises is an important theme in Mormonism. To satisfy justice, our sins must carry a penalty; however, as that penalty is separation from God, that seems to conflict with Mercy. To satisfy them both, we need a Redeemer - Christ paid for our sins, but because of his own sinlessness, he can't be kept from the presence of God. Thus all those who accept his sacrifice - those who are nonbelievers in this life, those who die as infants, etc. - can receive God's Mercy. Those who refuse His Mercy still get Justice.

 

[ComradeDavo]

I think that a lot of people believe in god just by tradition. Your parents do it, your coutrymen do it, so you take the easy way and do it too.

Agreed, thats another important thing I should have covered in my previous posts. Often believe in God is passed down from parents to children, and/or taught by schools. Education played a large role in the inbedding of a belief in a singular god into the minds of alot of people in the past, and to some extent it does today. Especially when you consider how closely some educational institutes have been linked to the church.

And this adds to a conversation/thread about the Nature of God how?

Masquerouge is correct in that if you read the OP you see that Eran asks for opinions from athiests about why God is such a common idea among humans.

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

Indeed, I did ask for atheist perspectives. Of course, I still hope that they add something useful to this thread, and explaining how you think that the idea of God is a human construct does add something relevant.

 

[aneeshm]

In my humble opinion , the only God that is compatible with the current universe is an attributeless ( just like consciousness ) , formless , and monistic God ( that is , assuming he exists ) .

 

[sanabas]

Indeed, I did ask for atheist perspectives. Of course, I still hope that they add something useful to this thread, and explaining how you think that the idea of God is a human construct does add something relevant.

Because people like to think they're important, that there's a reason they're alive, and that their life has a purpose. The idea that we're here simply by chance, that what you do in your life is going to make zero difference to the universe, is one that seems to make a lot of people uncomfortable. Seems to me that people have a need to assign meaning & purpose to life, and god fills that need nicely.

I also think that's a reason that some people are so insistent & vociferous about god's existince. They don't want to even consider the possibility that god doesn't exist, because if god doesn't, that makes their life pointless. That's a hard thought to have, so they prefer to metaphorically stick their fingers in their ears and go 'la, la, la.'

 

[Birdjaguar]

You know that strange smelly guy that always has to sit next to you on the bus?

That's God

Hey Perf, you do get it!

God alone is. God is that which is eternal, infinite, pemanent and unchanging. The universe is an illusion of separateness and finitness that is rooted in limited consciousness. Ego and desire isolate us from one another and make it difficult for each of us to find what we all want: to love and be loved.

 

[MobBoss]

TO CRUSH YOUR ENEMIES, TO DRIVE THEM BEFORE YOU, AND TO HEAR THE LAMENTATIONS OF THEIR WOMEN

Oh wait....wrong question....drat...

 

[FriendlyFire]

That may be true, but the concept of God is much older and more widespread than just the Abrahamic religions. It seems that almost all societies we know have some concept of God in some form. Is this satisfying a deep-rooted psychological need of some sort?

Indeed theres E, Y, P and D versions of god (this was the old testerment versions )

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

Indeed theres E, Y, P and D versions of god (this was the old testerment versions )

What are the D and P? I have heard of E (Elohim) and Y (Yhwh), but not the other two. And there seems to be plenty of evidence that the idea of the nature of God developed and changed among the Israelites.

 

[Birdjaguar]

TO CRUSH YOUR ENEMIES, TO DRIVE THEM BEFORE YOU, AND TO HEAR THE LAMENTATIONS OF THEIR WOMEN

Oh wait....wrong question....drat...

Such a fine quote is never out of place.

 

[CaptainF]

TO CRUSH YOUR ENEMIES, TO DRIVE THEM BEFORE YOU, AND TO HEAR THE LAMENTATIONS OF THEIR WOMEN

Oh wait....wrong question....drat...

Ghengis Khan? Such a fine specimen for one liners.

 

[GenMarshall]

My belief in the nature of God can be best taken from the Catechism of the Catholic Church as well as the Baltimore Chatechism.

God is a spirit that is infinitely perfect. He has no beguinning; he always was and always will be till the end of time. God is everywhere and anyplace. Since God is pure spirit, he cannot be seen with our bodily eyes. God is all knowing and all powerfull. God sees us and watches over us. He also knows all things, our secret thoughts, words, insecurities, and actions. God can do anything, and nothing is hard or impossible for him.

Then comes to my belief in God in the Trinity (Hense I am a Trinidarian Christian Catholic). here is only one God since there can only be one God, because God is supreme and infinite and cannot have an equal. There are three devine persons in God and equal to all things; The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit (or oftenly refered to as the Holy Ghost). The Father is God and the first person of the Blessed Trinity, The Son is God and the second person of the Blessed Trinity, and the Holy Spirit is God and the third person of the Blessed Trinity. In referiong to the Blessed Trinity, Christians mean one God in three Divine Persons and are equal in all things. The three Divine Persons are one and the Same God and having one and the same Divine nature and substance.

He is a separate being from Christ, who I believe to be divine as well and His son in a way that most humans are not; they, as well as the Holy Ghost, work together to bring about God's greatest work: the salvation and perfection of mankind.

I guess this is where we disagree about the nature of God because I am a Christian Catholic who believes and accepts the Trinity where as Mormons and JWs reject the Trinity .

 

[Darkness]

Considering I am an atheist, I think god does not exist.

But, hypothetically speaking, should he (or she) exist then I'd consider him a failure...

 

[Sidhe]

Considering I am an atheist, I think god does not exist.

But, hypothetically speaking, should he (or she) exist then I'd consider him a failure...

In what time frame, a mortal one or a biblical one, maybe one day we'll grow up and stop throwing hate at each other, maybe this is our rebelious teen phase and we think we know better than God, the religions seem hard pressed to follow even there own tennants some times. No give it time about 5.7 billion years and all will be well

I agree though it's one of the reasons I'm agnostic, the cataclysmic damage that religion has done in the past is a big factor in my psychology and philosophy of religion.