What would a "better" society look like?

[civver_764]

Decisions on an intercontinental scale, such as which experiment to run on the next massive particle accelerator, coordinating relief efforts to a devastated region, etc.

There could be a worldwide association of physicists that would probably handle that sort of thing.

Relief efforts similarly could be handled by those in the communities affected, with volunteers from other parts of the world joining if they wanted to.

 

[Borachio]

Aren't these two things a reality now? Certainly to some extent?

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

There could be a worldwide association of physicists that would probably handle that sort of thing.

All of them vote on it then?

with volunteers from other parts of the world joining if they wanted to.

Funny you should mention that (#1 on the list). As said in that article, what happens when one area gets too many volunteers that aren't that useful? What authority would compel them to go elsewhere?

 

[civver_764]

Yeah, but if you can't even expect those most *basic tenets* of society to be accepted by the world writ large, how can you expect your additions to be universal? Personally I agree with what joe said. Government needs to strive to achieve an equitable society, but beyond that I don't think there's much we can do.

Just because we can't achieve absolute perfection doesn't we shouldn't strive for improvement.

And while there are lots of people that have no qualms with killing, I generally feel pretty safe around other people knowing that they would have a problem with killing.

I'm not advocating that we just get rid of the government tonight and watch what happens. I'm advocating a process, whereby we become more empathic, more conscious of the abuse of authority in our society, more skeptical towards the virtues of capitalism, etc. and as a whole gravitate towards the kind of society I outlined in my first post. Basically what I'm saying is, if you asked me how society could improve, that's what I would say.

And one last point: There seems to be an assumption that people don't change(I could be wrong.) But we've definitely seen an increase of moral behavior as society has progressed. We've come a hell of a long way since even 50 years ago.

Alright, I see what you mean, I agree with these basic goals, I just don't see why individualism or government need to be taken out of the mix to achieve them. A democratic government can promote a stable society in which people are free to do as they wish, which can include people choosing to be more altruistic and empathetic towards others.

Well, "individualism", as I mean it, is responsible for lots of nasty stuff like xenophobia, war, racism, excessive accumulation of wealth, exploitation of workers in third world countries, etc.

The government, likewise, can be pretty well described as merely an instrument of the powerful to maintain their power. Even the democracies we have today are hopelessly corrupted.

So that's why I think these would be absent in a better society.

 

[rugbyLEAGUEfan]

And what's wrong with being an optimist and loving life and what you have? My life is perfect in every way. I'm completely happy, and I love where I live. No improvement is necessary. It's not possible for me to be happier than I already.

Nothing is wrong with being an optimist and I certainly love life and what I have. I've traveled to and lived in some very poor countries and it always pleases me to see so many people think this way regardless of wealth. And America is certainly an awesome place on the whole and I've had some serious fun there.

But remember before you get too happy or think improvement isn't necessary(even if things are going great for you individually) well I'll leave it to one of the great Americans to say it best

Skip to the 30 second mark.....


Link to video.

 

[civver_764]

All of them vote on it then?

I dunno, they'd probably discuss the issue and come to some sort of general consensus. If someone disagreed they'd be free to leave the project and pursue something else.

Funny you should mention that (#1 on the list). As said in that article, what happens when one area gets too many volunteers that aren't that useful? What authority would compel them to go elsewhere?

Nobody would force them to do anything. If they didn't want any extra help they'd probably just tell them. I don't think anyone would have a problem with that.

 

[Patroklos]

So you mean some sort of anarchy? Some people will always have power over others. It may be due to being physically stronger, having more friends to help out or whatever. But there will always be an inequality of power. A just government is a mean to keep that power in check.

Which is itself an exercise in enshrining an inequality in power.

 

[Tahuti]

Just because we can't achieve absolute perfection doesn't we shouldn't strive for improvement.

Well, if you want my humble opinion, attempting to improve a society is a waste of time that is better used on improving yourself. At least you can set a goal for yourself of which more or less objectively can be said you support, whereas regarding society, we collectively do not even know what a good society should be like.

Besides, human nature, unfortunately, works in such way that it is susceptible to petty behaviors like racism and herd-mentality which are pretty much hardwired in humans. These instincts are much older than any institution singled out be Left-Wing anarchists to be the source of all evil, and they won't simply dissappear with the elimination of any of them.

 

[civver_764]

Well, if you want my humble opinion, attempting to improve a society is a waste of time that is better used on improving yourself.

Well it's not a waste of time, but I agree 100% that improving ourselves is more important. Transformation comes first from within.

Besides, human nature, unfortunately, works in such way that it is susceptible to petty behaviors like racism and herd-mentality which are pretty much hardwired in humans.

But now we as a society largely reject racism. It doesn't seem to be very hard-wired to me.

 

[Borachio]

Well it's not a waste of time, but I agree 100% that improving ourselves is more important. Transformation comes first from within.

So you need a thread to discuss "what would a "better" person would look like?"

 

[civver_764]

So you need a thread to discuss "what would a "better" person would look like?"

I made a thread a while ago about the ego, but nobody seemed interested

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

I dunno, they'd probably discuss the issue and come to some sort of general consensus.If someone disagreed they'd be free to leave the project and pursue something else.

I don't think they'd build two colliders. And they can't afford to keep the collider idling while decisions are deadlocked.

Nobody would force them to do anything. If they didn't want any extra help they'd probably just tell them. I don't think anyone would have a problem with that.

Given that there was a disaster, they likely wouldn't be told by the people affected by the disaster until they were already there. It's a waste of a lot of people's time and resources that could have been avoided by coordination by authorities.

 

[Borachio]

I made a thread a while ago about the ego, but nobody seemed interested

That's funny, I've only recently made one about the self. No one seemed interested either.

 

[Smellincoffee]

Military officers would wear bright pajama-looking uniforms, and Earth would be a pleasant park, and we'd occasionally fight aliens who thought they were Vikings.

 

[civver_764]

I don't think they'd build two colliders. And they can't afford to keep the collider idling while decisions are deadlocked.

I don't know much about the collider, how is it currently run?

Given that there was a disaster, they likely wouldn't be told by the people affected by the disaster until they were already there. It's a waste of a lot of people's time and resources that could have been avoided by coordination by authorities.

Why would they not be told? The people that organize a relief effort are just as capable of communicating with people, regardless of the structure of their organization.

 

[Chimera Kitty]

So what would you like to see changed about our current society?

- an end to gun-control, censorship, the War on Drugs, and other anti-freedom nonsense.

- an end to government involvement in stuff that the free market has really been proven to be better at delivering. This means both privatization and deregulation.

- keeping a closer eye on corporations, if not keeping them on a tighter leash. A thorough rejection of corporate personhood. More individual accountability (i.e., prison time for CEOs instead of fines for which the shareholders are ultimately on the hook)

- oh wait, this is about society as a whole, not just government? NO RELIGION.

- M:tG restored to the pre-8th-Edition layout and pre-6th-edition rules

- How about some live-action Transformers movies that don't suck?

- NO RELIGION

- A sane policy regarding issues that affect the Middle East (see also NO RELIGION)

- No Communism (including the total dissolution of the Democratic party)

- Public ownership of land, stricter pollution laws, and the replacement of all taxes with a property tax or land value tax or something similar

- Voter competency tests or otherwise stricter requirements for voting

- NO RELIGION

So you need a thread to discuss "what would a "better" person would look like?"

May I direct you to the babe thread?

 

[Goodfella]

I'll answer the thread without a response particularly to the society in the OP:
-A capitalist economic system with some intervention in place to prevent abuse (much like we currently have)
-Two tiered health care system
-Campaign finance reform that eliminates Super PACs and caps the maximum donation at around $5,000 (what it currently is)
-Candidates stop talking about religion and creationism is not a thing
-Voter participation levels at around 80%
-Public Universities are cheaper
-Higher education levels
-Less advertisements on the internet

 

[ace99]

Society will be run on a rational scientific basis.

At birth, every citizen, as of right, will be issued with a bicycle and an umbrella. Thus assured of a mobile workforce adequately protected against the elements, this great country can go forward once more to glory!

Second, every American male shall have their knee measured to establish that the American knee is indeed the most superior knee of all the races. The American knee is strong! The American knee is not the knobbly weak knee of the intellectual or the suspect knee of the criminal classes. No! The American knee is muscular! The American knee is on the march!

A ban will be placed on the import of foreign root vegetables. In order to ensure that the great American nation is self sufficient in all its needs the entire state of New Jersey shall be given over to the cultivation of turnips.

Legislation will be passed to make the eating of asparagus mandatory.

Railroads shall be widened in order to ease the transport of livestock.

With these measures we can be assured that nothing stands between us and our victory except defeat! Tomorrow is a new day! The future lies ahead!

 

[Chimera Kitty]

nothing stands between us and our victory except defeat!

You were making perfect sense until you said this. Obviously, with all of the improvements that you suggest, not even defeat could stand between us and victory, although reality TV most certainly could.

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

I don't know much about the collider, how is it currently run?

I know for sure that not everyone at CERN gets to have a say in the LHC schedule.

Why would they not be told? The people that organize a relief effort are just as capable of communicating with people, regardless of the structure of their organization.

Well, I'm assuming it's not the far future where people can communicate very quickly even in the absence of electricity.