NKVD
Cossack
i dont know i never had games without it. i had always a big stack to get it right after its appearance. it was easier though with colonies...i dont know why there are no colonies in civ 4! those were fun and easy
Why no chickens?
- Thread starter LegioCorvus
- Start date
i dont know i never had games without it. i had always a big stack to get it right after its appearance. it was easier though with colonies...i dont know why there are no colonies in civ 4! those were fun and easy
binhthuy71
Emperor
Colonies were a nice way to grab a resource a bit earlier than you might otherwise. It was also nice to be able to get Incense or Saltpeter without having to settle otherwise-useless tiles. Another thing I miss from III was the ability to have a Worker become an airfield in one turn. The CivIII AI's expansion model almost always left one or two tiles on the edges of their empire out of their cultural boundaries so it was easy to land a Worker wit6h a small stack of defenders, pop an airfield on the next turn and then airlift beaucoup units to it. Either that or just bring along Workers with your SOD. It sure sped up late game warmongering.
Yes, horseman and chariots co-existed, but the stirrup and the chariot did not. chariots were relegated to purely entertainment use by the 3rd century bc, stirrups were still being developed in asia at the time although the stirrup has been dated as far bck as 6th centry bc india, it really didn't come into it's own until the 3rd century bc saw improvements in saddle design which distributed the pressure of the stirrups evenly on the horses back, allowing for the increased and extended demands of warfare. Really, they weren't in large scale use until the 3rd or 4th century AD. So actually, horsemen had rendered chariots obsolete before the stirrup was even on the scene.
whitelaughter
Warlord
Yes, an important qualification.
Hmmm....sort of. Given the way the phalanx smashed mounted opponents though?
Let's see:
chariot beats most infantry.
phalanx though beats chariot.
mounted archer beats phalanx.
knight beats mounted archer.
pike block (effectively new phalanx) beats knight.
Giving pistols to your cavalry allows them to beat pike block, but:
cavalry trained to execute the caracole are no match for a cavalry trained to execute a charge.
So, paper/scissors/rock:
Light horse beats disciplined foot
Heavy horse beats light horse
disciplined foot beats heavy horse.
Any objections?
I would believe that incense are there just to make desert squares somewhat "usable", same with the bananas/Jungle (along with rice and gems)
I dunno. Someone thought very wise believed that bringing the gift of Frankensence (sp) was as good as bringing gold.
capnvonbaron
Democratia gladii
I disagree slightly; you could still win by spamming artillery and bombing the crap out of their infantry and tanks, then cleaning up with cavalry...
also the issue with chariots ended up being maneuverability and speed. Simply, you could run a horse faster without it having to haul a big cart, and you can turn and stop in a MUCH smaller distance. Soggy terrain is less of an issue, as is rough and uneven terrain. Mounted units eventually proved to be more flexible. I also think another factor was the breeding of larger horses to carry riders+armor+weaponry, as was just developing the methods of training war horses. That sorta thing takes a few hundred years of trial and error...
TheLazyHase
King
- Joined
- Sep 24, 2009
- Messages
- 867
So true. I talked about stirrup, but I were thinking to rein and saddle too, simply the words were outside my head. Horse training, too, since a panicking horse is a lot worse if you're on the sadle than in a cart.
Once you know how to work it, chariot are expensive and less effective than horseman (most of the time). But, effective horsemanship need to combine a lot of idea and imply to be a little daring at least
I didn't bother to read the whole thread but some people kept asking why deer is an resource in Civ games and the answer is quite simple. Deers (mainly reindeers) are a huge resource on many places on the northern parts of the world. Deers in Civ games are found in the northern, or southern, part of the world. What would be there instead of deers? Bears?
binhthuy71
Emperor
Beers!
binhthuy71
Emperor
Only if you had saltpeter. Otherwise it was human wave attacks with riflemen.
Speaking of artillery; I still miss the CivIII bombardment model. I know: it was overpowered. So they replaced it with a model that results in kamikaze cannons or in having a warship unable to fire a shot after a certain point. "Silly" is not necessarily a cure for "overpowered".
"Balanced for the purposes of gameplay" is, though
Though one could argue that siege is still overpowered (I don't think so myself).
capnvonbaron
Democratia gladii
"Balanced for the purposes of gameplay" is, though
I wouldn't say "overpowered" as much as "under-utilized by the AI".
I do miss the Civ3 model though, mostly because of warship arty. Battleships and destroyer bombardment were a great way to keep the enemy pinned down. BTW saltpeter was for cannons.. proper replaceable parts arty didn't require any resources.
Izmir Stinger
Deity
Not just advancements if training methods, but also in selective breeding. The earliest domesticated horses were not strong enough bear a rider (especially not an armored one) and did not have suitable temperament for bearing a rider and accepting heel/reign commands unquestioningly in high stress situations. Prior to these advancements, horses were relegated to being a draft/food animal.
Badtz Maru
King
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2001
- Messages
- 674
Chariots used much smaller horses than those bred for horseback riding. Some of the earliest chariots were pulled by onagers (a good unique unit for the Sumerians would have been a chariot that did not require horses to represent this).
whitelaughter
Warlord
Oh, I like....
Hsinchu
Prince
Chicken chariots!
binhthuy71
Emperor
Real historians know that the chariot of the king of Parthia was pulled by fifty of the feared Parthian War Chickens. Their war cry was "Cluck you!".
well, add it to the "weird/improbable weapons" thread!
