[R&F] Why the trade exclusion of markets vs. lighthouses?

[acluewithout]

The challenge with using trade routes internally for this purpose is the length of time those routes run. The shortest possible route runs 22 turns (standard speed, the route between the cities on the map covers 11 hexes)) and if you're not careful could be as high as 40 turns (if the route between the cities on the map covers only 10 hexes instead of 11). For a reasonably typical route between two cities of 8 hexes length, the route will be in place for 32 turns.

I never mind getting science/culture/gold/faith for as long as the route is running. Food and production are less likely to be of material benefit for the full term of the trade route.

So while I definitely agree that there are times, especially in the early game, when boosting your population or completing a district (or building you can't afford to buy) is better than a small science or culture boost from an international trade route, in practice I rarely find situations where this true, and end up running international routes as my default.

The game is so forgiving, however, that I'm not pressed to play it so efficiently as to be forced to carefully evaluate that, even in the early game. As I stopped using internal trade routes and started sending external ones, my games got easier and my empire developed more quickly, and I just kind of stopped worrying about internal trade routes unless a clear situation for one sat up and slapped me in the face.

Even though I knew international routes were better, I’d been using internal trade routes, running them from say my cap to a nearby city. When they repeated, I’d then run them through that city again (trading post) and then to a foreign city. I was doing this partly for fun, partly because I thought maybe this was how you were meant to use trade routes (ie slowly extending the distance they travel) and partly to avoid too much early culture or science (which makes the game go to fast).

... but to be honest, I’m just a touch tired of deliberately playing the game inefficiently to give the AI a sporting chance.

...sigh. But yeah, I like trade routes. I think international routes win hands down, but the split between international and domestic is still one of the things I really like. It still feels like a meaningful or at least interesting choice.

Yeah, definitely the increased yields for allied routes is finally a good reason to want to stay allied with someone. I know I'm usually very upset when an alliance runs out and they don't want to renew.

That and Wisselbanken.

That card, and the related one for later eras, I think were a very cool addition to the game. There really is some good stuff going on with diplomacy in the game.

 

[craney1987]

I feel tweaks to Reyna could be used here. Whether it be for pop. caps or route capacity...

 

[qadams]

Tweaks to the Govs are sorely needed. It's a good idea in concept, but in practice they often have such little impact that I nearly forget all about them.