Will there be Rhye's and Fall of Civilization 6?

[TheMarshmallowBear]

If RFC ever takes off PLEASE take into consideration Hotseat/MP as well, don't want a watered-down version of your beautiful mod.

 

[Azama]

Hello,

I noticed the other day that there is a mod with the true name location already implemented.
https://forums.civfanatics.com/thre...rue-location-corresponding-city-names.605960/

The earth map from YnAMP seems to be big enough to have many european civs, although it could be modified in order to have more room in Europe like the original RFC.

Anyways, it would be good to know if this project is going to be started and what can we do to help.

Best regards,

 

[Xefjord]

I am going to have to second what was said above me, the YNAEMP map is HUGE. To address some of the concerns from before:

Even with the second to largest map (As not everyone can use the largest map) you should have plenty of space. I have to honestly say that I was worried when the game first came out. I know how cluttered YNAEMP was in Civ 5 and fully expected the expanded cities to take up far too much space in civ 6. But I actually have MORE space for cities than I did in Civ 5 on the newest YNAEMP. Japan for instance, before in Civ 5 I might have been able to fit 4-6 cities. Now I can fit 7-9 cities on Civ 6's YNAEMP. You can easily keep the same level of city clutter as was in the original Civ 4's RFC. Another thing to keep in mind is that a lot of people worry about unit clutter. But having watched some AI only TSL battles (Especially the recent one by Drew Durnil on youtube) I have realized that there is not NEARLY the unit spam that there used to be. Don't get me wrong, I remember the unit carpets from Civ 5 and how bad they were. But it just doesn't seem to be nearly as much of a problem in Civ 6. I have heard some complaints about map sizing, but I think MOST people can handle the second biggest YNAEMP map size. My computer is a potato that takes 10 minutes to load it, but after you get into the game it runs pretty smoothly.

A lot of complaints I have seen regarding the size of cities and carpets of units have been from people who frankly don't seem to have played a lot of Civ 6 yet. I know most of my friends bought Civ 6 then within the first couple of weeks wrote it off as bad and never touched it again. But they didn't really get to know the new mechanics at all and of course Firaxis has fixed most of the game breaking bugs. I never really played Rhyes and Fall of civilization because I was never able to get myself into Civ 4, but a lot of its features seem very interesting and I think they could be applied to Civ 6.

So forgive me if I make any mistakes in my surface knowledge, but the features I would suggest are having Historical Victories like seemed to be in the old RFC (Those sound pretty nice). Have the Civilization Spawn Time with Civilizations coming back and historical zones of control (With debuffs for going outside of them like in Civ 4 but still available as an option). Civ 6 has multiple leader capability so maybe at the moment you can't have it cycle through multiple leaders as history goes on, but you can further down the line. I don't think Districts need to represent smaller cities or cities need to be unstacked, I think the maps are big enough to handle it with few crowding issues. It sounded like RFC to an extent was pretty good at following the normal timeline of history with a few minor alterations that can change the course of history by the player. I really like that idea and hope you can find some way to make replicate that in Civ 6. I don't know anything about modding in Civ 6. But I can say I have already seen a lot of detailed and high quality mods come out that speak a lot for the potential of Civ 6 modding. If you could find a way to bring RFC to Civ 6 it would truly make Civ 6 modding great again lol.

Rhyes, Fighting!

 

[AbsintheRed]

I never really played Rhyes and Fall of civilization because I was never able to get myself into Civ 4

How can you potentially compare maps / gameplay / potential use of districts to the needs of RFC then?
Also, Civ IV is THE modding platform. Possibilities in V and VI are not even close.

 

[Gedemon]

How can you potentially compare maps / gameplay / potential use of districts to the needs of RFC then?
Also, Civ IV is THE modding platform. Possibilities in V and VI are not even close.

Civ5 can't replace terrain, that was the biggest problem for total conversion, Civ6 can.

Once we'll have DLL access, I do think that civ6 will have nothing to envy from Civ4 and Civ5.

 

[Infixo]

Civ5 can't replace terrain, that was the biggest problem for total conversion, Civ6 can.

What do you mean by that Civ6 can replace terrain?
I tried to change terrain and feature during the game and it works but is not shown in 3D view (with few exceptions, like forest). You can see changes in Strat View only. Am I missing something?

 

[Gedemon]

See https://forums.civfanatics.com/thre...-these-art-assets.611112/page-2#post-14677641

And screen : https://goo.gl/uPLEhf

 

[Xefjord]

Civ5 can't replace terrain, that was the biggest problem for total conversion, Civ6 can.

Once we'll have DLL access, I do think that civ6 will have nothing to envy from Civ4 and Civ5.

Do you really think Civ 6 has good opportunity for total conversion mods? That is pretty exciting to hear! I always wanted to experience some of the Civ 4 total conversion mods, but I just have a difficult time getting into older games (Plus my Civ 4 is pretty bugged out and I can't play most scenarios) So I would love to see more Total Conversion mods (Including Rhyes and Fall of Civilization Civ 6 version!)

 

[Gedemon]

Do you really think Civ 6 has good opportunity for total conversion mods? That is pretty exciting to hear! I always wanted to experience some of the Civ 4 total conversion mods, but I just have a difficult time getting into older games (Plus my Civ 4 is pretty bugged out and I can't play most scenarios) So I would love to see more Total Conversion mods (Including Rhyes and Fall of Civilization Civ 6 version!)

The DLL access will be mandatory for some features (everything related to controlling units like a settlers map for example, and maybe most diplomatic features like world congress), but some others are already possible, I've converted my Historical Spawn Dates mod from civ5 for example, and my Revolutions mod was also done in Lua before DLL access, I'm almost certain that I can convert it for civ6 in its current state.

Technically, since the DLL source code was released, there was nothing preventing a RFC-like mod for civ5, except the huge amount of time it takes to convert/make such a mod of course.

 

[Azama]

Gedemon, it is great to see that some features of Rhye's and Fall are already being written for civ VI. Great work. Do you think it will be plausible to implement the UHV mechanics in the current state of civ vi?
As said by Xefjord, the YNAEMP map is big enough for the RFC mod. It could even be modified to make europe slightly bigger just like the original civ iv mod. In my experience with civ vi, army sizes aren't very big compared to civ V, not even in deity difficulty. In any case, the use of army and corps could be moved to much earlier in the game.
I hope this project keeps evolving, maybe Rhye could come back to this thread and give some feedback.
Best regards

 

[TheMarshmallowBear]

Gedemon, it is great to see that some features of Rhye's and Fall are already being written for civ VI. Great work. Do you think it will be plausible to implement the UHV mechanics in the current state of civ vi?
As said by Xefjord, the YNAEMP map is big enough for the RFC mod. It could even be modified to make europe slightly bigger just like the original civ iv mod. In my experience with civ vi, army sizes aren't very big compared to civ V, not even in deity difficulty. In any case, the use of army and corps could be moved to much earlier in the game.
I hope this project keeps evolving, maybe Rhye could come back to this thread and give some feedback.
Best regards

Given that it's quite easy to implement custom victory types, I'd say I'd be pretty easy, and would barely require LUA to do it

Since you can use a combination of Requirement to set certain goals (Does the player have Pyramids, Great Library and Great Lighthouse and is before Turn X?)

The only issue is that there needs to be a game effect we can use to trigger said victories.

 

[1SDANi]

I'm not sure how much the AI turn speed will impact RFCiv6 though. It seems that 20 civs on a huge map gets base game super slow even before the medieval era even starts. I've heard that 6 has the worst AI turn time scaling in the series, though I'm not exactly sure if that'd affect a RFCiv6, as I've really only played the ancient era civs in it.

BTW, if anyone knows a way to fix the AI turn times, that'd be awesome. (And no, it's not my computer, I've had much better performance on ciV and cIV)

 

[Gedemon]

Have you tried without barbarians?

there is an issue with them on large map reintroduced with the latest patch I think.

 

[1SDANi]

Have you tried without barbarians?

there is an issue with them on large map reintroduced with the latest patch I think.

Ah, that may be a good idea. I do play without goody huts, and no barbarians means I won't have to worry about choosing which civs to face so I don't accidentally get Sumeria and their tribal village encampments

 

[Bonci]

Well, but RFC surely needs barbarians >_<

 

[Gedemon]

Well, but RFC surely needs barbarians >_<

We can hope that the Barbarians turns time is a temporary issue that will be resolved in the next patch.

 

[isau]

Although I don't know too much about the specifics of Rhys, I can say one thing personally holding me back from broader modding at the moment is the lack of a clean way to add and remove Modifiers using Lua. I think this would be easily fixed once we get DLL access, because we can easily create a clone of any of the various things that currently apply Modifiers and just simplify them. Our situation right now is thus:

• Buildings can do it, and remain the best option at the moment. But they present particular irritations with clashing with UI, have to be cleaned up when a city is captured/razed/etc. It all leads to some very unnecessary entanglements and possibility of crashes due to null objects.
• Projects are the second best option. But you can't complete a project with Lua as far as I've seen, nor can you remove a project once it is complete. Also, Projects are always global, not city-specific.
• Tech and Civics can attach a modifier. But there is now way to make a tech or civic hidden without deleting it, nor any current way to prevent the research of a civic or tech. (Are you listening Firaxis? Adding this would make a ton of things possible for modders, because so many systems tie to techs and civics. It's such a frustrating near-hit.)
• Beliefs can do it, but are impractical for anything but religious fixings for a long list of reasons.

The Modifier system is very well designed. The only problem is the way a Modifier is attached doesn't take into account modder's needs. Creating a new object, called, say, a "ObjectAbility," that has all the characteristics of a Project or a Building, except it doesn't appear in Building lists, and that can be added and taken away from a player/city, would do wonders.

(Note the exception case: It is already possible to add or detach modifiers easily to Units, because that is basically what a UnitAbility is. We just need a CityAbility and PlayerAbility that follows that pattern. From what I see in the code this should be fairly easy to set up for a person with proper access.)

 

[Azama]

Does anyone know the status on this mod? Has development started?

 

[TDK]

@Rhye I will not buy the game until Rhyes and Fall comes out... I'm still on cIV.

 

[-Perceval-]

Ok why not open a kickstarter?
Personally i would invest 30€ in it with no hesitation