[WIP] Indonesia Split (Community Project)

[Natan35]

Omg. I'll need to give you a title, like I gave Scott and JFD...

(I can do pedias if you'd like, and I guess I can get a part of Indonesia of my back now )

 

[BenZL43]

Here's some city names

Spoiler :

Bhumi Mataram (original capital of Medang)
Mamrati
Poh Pitu
Tawlang
Watugaluh
Wwatan
Anjuk Ladang
Watukura
Pucangan
Wanagiri
Pergota
Dahanapura
Kayumwungan From here below, these are Sima lands from inscription stating that these settlements are now exempt from tax
Tri Tepusan
Tanah Bunga
Kalasan
Linggasutan
Gulung-Gulung
Cunggrang
Jru-Jru
Waharu
Sumbut
Wulig
Lwaram -> local ruler of this city revolt against Medang king, and allied with Srivijaya kingdom, attack the King during his princess' wedding party with Airlangga. The latter build a new kingdom, Kahuripan, out of Mataram's ruin.

Suggestion for Events & Decisions: Pralaya Mataram.

Spoiler :

Lava from major Merapi Mt eruption destroy Medang's palace. Since Mt. Merapi is considered sacred, your citizen decipher this as sign that God has decided Mataram / your capital is no longer a blessed place / auspicious. They are demanding you to move eastward and found a new settlement there to calm the God and not incur more disaster.
Agree -> new settler, capital city move to the new city
Disagree -> unhappiness penalty?
Please somebody kind help me re-write this short description in a more interesting and thought-provoking style

I think Sima system should be enacted for each city individually instead of enacted once for all cities. Since Sima status makes a land/boundary free from tax and used for religious purpose, I think it should also lose some (like 50% less income from the city) but add , ,and . Read more here

I hope we still have space left to include Medang's leaning to agricultural empire aspect (contrasted to Sriwijaya which was a pure thalassocratic empire) and its religious-driven conflict for throne and kingdom policy aspect (between Sanjaya dinasty [Hindu] and Syailendra [Mahayana Buddhist] dynasty.) if we can't, never mind, because what Natan proposed is already a great one Especially the UU and UI synchronization.

Spoiler :

Btw, I finally have time to find out more on Natan's Rakyan Kanuruhan. It doesn't looks like it have something to do with Engineering but we can always find a name later.

 

[kul]

As always, intresting find BenZL43,

Please somebody kind help me re-write this short description in a more interesting and thought-provoking style

Pralaya Mataram
Mount Merapi, the sacred mountains that held the lands with its weight, has erupted. The lava brought fire and destruction to our capital, destroying the kingdom's Palace in its wake. Greatest soothsayers and advisors alike has interpreted this event as the wrath of the gods above, for they had no longer blessed the capital anymore! Please exodus your people to stop incurring further disasters.

>We cant anger the gods any further!
(Gain a Settler, removes Capital to the new city, which begin with all of Ancient Era buildings already built)
>Starts rebuilding, right here and right now!
(Unhapiness penalty for xx turns, and 5 random buildings are destroyed)

The effects are pretty much unbalanced, since I havent played with this mods yet.. What are your thoughts? Is it possible to make the events only happens if certain criteria was met? I mean, I think this event could only happen if you settled adjacent to mountain.

 

[King William I]

Omg. I'll need to give you a title, like I gave Scott and JFD...

(I can do pedias if you'd like, and I guess I can get a part of Indonesia of my back now )

Have at it (Both tasks )

Here's some city names

Spoiler :

Bhumi Mataram (original capital of Medang)
Mamrati
Poh Pitu
Tawlang
Watugaluh
Wwatan
Anjuk Ladang
Watukura
Pucangan
Wanagiri
Pergota
Dahanapura
Kayumwungan From here below, these are Sima lands from inscription stating that these settlements are now exempt from tax
Tri Tepusan
Tanah Bunga
Kalasan
Linggasutan
Gulung-Gulung
Cunggrang
Jru-Jru
Waharu
Sumbut
Wulig
Lwaram -> local ruler of this city revolt against Medang king, and allied with Srivijaya kingdom, attack the King during his princess' wedding party with Airlangga. The latter build a new kingdom, Kahuripan, out of Mataram's ruin.

Suggestion for Events & Decisions: Pralaya Mataram.

Spoiler :

Lava from major Merapi Mt eruption destroy Medang's palace. Since Mt. Merapi is considered sacred, your citizen decipher this as sign that God has decided Mataram / your capital is no longer a blessed place / auspicious. They are demanding you to move eastward and found a new settlement there to calm the God and not incur more disaster.
Agree -> new settler, capital city move to the new city
Disagree -> unhappiness penalty?
Please somebody kind help me re-write this short description in a more interesting and thought-provoking style

I think Sima system should be enacted for each city individually instead of enacted once for all cities. Since Sima status makes a land/boundary free from tax and used for religious purpose, I think it should also lose some (like 50% less income from the city) but add , ,and . Read more here

I hope we still have space left to include Medang's leaning to agricultural empire aspect (contrasted to Sriwijaya which was a pure thalassocratic empire) and its religious-driven conflict for throne and kingdom policy aspect (between Sanjaya dinasty [Hindu] and Syailendra [Mahayana Buddhist] dynasty.) if we can't, never mind, because what Natan proposed is already a great one Especially the UU and UI synchronization.

Spoiler :

Btw, I finally have time to find out more on Natan's Rakyan Kanuruhan. It doesn't looks like it have something to do with Engineering but we can always find a name later.

Thanks for the city list. Honestly Unique events don't interest me too much, so I'm on the fence about that. Regarding the Sima Decision. How about we keep the Empire-Wide enactability, but have temple maintenance double to simulate the tax exemption?

 

[Natan35]

But that would go against everything that the UA represents.

 

[BenZL43]

Btw, if Kris Warrior is going to be an UU of any Indonesian split civs, I think it is more appropriate for Medang unless it replace Longswordman (which might be appropriate for Majapahit).

And storing a bit of interesting info I just found for future reference on Majapahit before I might lost the ebooks again in sea of Google,

Spoiler References : The Bullets by Apoorv shelke, et.al. :

The Javanese Majapahit Empire is argued to have grown to span most of modern day ASEAN due to its Javanese mastery of bronze-smithing and mass manufacture (via cottage industries which contributed to a central arsenal). Documentary and archaeological evidence indicate that Arab or Indian traders introduced gunpowder, gonnes, muskets, blunderbuses, and cannon to the Javanese, Acehnese, and Batak via long established commercial trade routes around the early to mid 14th century CE. [...]. The Javanese bronze breech-loaded swivel-gun, erroneously termed the lantaka, more correctly known as a meriam was used ubiquitously by the Majapahit navy and unfortunately pirates and rival lords. [...]. Read more here

 

[kul]

The Java Jong? Thats a nice sugestion that could blend well with its UA. However, do you think we should keep its need to settle in another continents? How about we only get 2 copies of each luxury for the first 3 Indonesian cities whenever they are erected, but doing so in another continent grant an additional 1 copy of said luxury? I think this would've sorta helped them if Majapahit is played on a pangea/land only map.

 

[Uighur_Caesar]

I agree with the Kris Swordsman as a longswordman replacement for Majapahit. What do you guys think the Majapahit should do besides war? I was thinking either culture or city state intimidation. If we go with culture we could use the Wayang as the UB since they invented it.

 

[Howard Tafty]

Wow this is certainly some interesting stuff here I'm just here to throw out a few stuff and wish good luck on your project.

As for the split, is there any chance you would be interested in The Malacca Sultanate from what I read I found it interesting as it became a bustling center of international trade and islamic culture in region. Just some food for thought as I found the current split a bit too Java centric.

 

[kul]

I share the sentiment with the passing-by Howard Tafty about the civilization proposed. I know that King William already explained its reasoning with the choice of his civs, but still a little bit of "spices" from outside Java would be nice. However if were going to the mostly Java route, then why dont we go all the way and only uses the civ from Java island and around? We can swap srivijaya with Bali kingdom. Altough yes, during its reign, Balinese kingdom had small teritory, but we can mix it up with modern Bali, the tourist and surfers haven. We could get the token cultural civilization for this batch. It would get tourism and production bonus from coastal cities for its UA.

 

[BenZL43]

Regarding the Java-centric split, it is understandable since Firaxis' Indonesian civilization is actually a Javanese civilization using modern name and modern city list. It's hard to imagine a Minangkabau or Timorese civilization born from Javanese civilization split.

 

[kul]

I agree with the Kris Swordsman as a longswordman replacement for Majapahit. What do you guys think the Majapahit should do besides war? I was thinking either culture or city state intimidation. If we go with culture we could use the Wayang as the UB since they invented it.

How about Full War?

Majapahit Empire
Leader: Gajah Mada

UA: Palapan Oath
Units gain 15% combat bonus against civilizations whom you had territorial issues with (coveting lands, settling near cities, stealing lands with citadels, etc). Each puppeted cities connected to the Capital increases the range and gold yields of naval Trade routes by 5% each, to the maximum of 30%.

UU: Bhayangkara
Majapahit replacements for the Longswordsman. Has Cover 1 and 2 promotion, in which the Cover 1 stays on upgrade. Stationing a Bhayangkara on a city will provides 2 happiness.

UU: Cetbang Warships
Majapahit replacements for the Caravel. Stronger (27 ) but doesnt have additional sight and the ability to withdraw before melee. It has, however, the Boarding Party I promotion.

Spoiler :

Okay maybe not ALL war. Majapahit was also all about those trading gold during its reign, so I tried to duplicate that in he UA. The first UU was elite majapahitan troops that gain its infamy by being led by Gajahmada to retake Capital after a rebellion, hence the 2+ happiness. Meanwhile the second UU was based around BenZL finds about how Majapahit uses canons in their ships, which was the Cetbang, a custom swivel guns

 

[Kerfuffle]

Units gain 15% combat bonus against civilizations whom you had territorial issues with (coveting lands, settling near cities, stealing lands with citadels, etc).

Maybe it could just be:
+15% Combat bonus against enemy Cities settled near* friendly/your own Cities.

*within 6 tiles maybe?

It's a lot simpler and achieves a similar effect (in terms of historical flavour). Also, I'm not entirely sure, but this option may require less code too? (Would someone be able to verify that?)

 

[kul]

I guess you are right, after all, if we really had to change Majapahit UA in this design, Im still not sure where to put the original Indonesian UA, the spice islanders thingy..


BTW, hows this for Medang leader Icon? I had no Idea whos this supposed to be, since I just do it on the prompt of the sculpture that BenZL gave and get somewhat carried away. Sugestions are welcome, but since I accidentally forgot to save over the man's layers, editing his features would be tricky.. The buildings behind him are just placeholder.

 

[BenZL43]

I don't think there could be a single kingdom/polity/civilization that fit the original UA; but probably Ternate Sultanate is the closest one (if we replace Pepper with Cajuputi or Sandalwood).

Btw, awesome work! Just like the Soekarno one.. I like it...
That chest looks a bit feminine, and perhaps can you darken the complexion just a little bit?

 

[kul]

Can do! But I'll probably post it later when it has more concept poured into it. Im not really sure I can edit the chest easily since I think it looks okay and I I guess thats just what happens when you used the body of a caucasian male stripper with Ahmad Dhani's face.

Also, I found that, if the UU is a Great Engineer replacement, Why dont we use "Silpin"?
Simply put, Silpin are peoples who had mastered Silpa-sastra, the science of art and crafts, these are the peoples that build candis upon the request of rulers. Silpin means artisan in hindi, I think this term had also been absorbed by the Medang Kingdom, since Indonesian references I read about the history of making candis uses this word as well. Link
Silpin that was tasked to build candi was divided into 4 groups which are,
1. Sthapati, The Architect
2. Sutragrahin, The Engineer and Field Leader
3. Taksakha, The Engraver of bas-reliefs, ornaments, etc.
4. Vardhakin, The Sculptor of ornaments and statues.

Also, it was also mentioned that one of the desired location for religious building such as Candi was to built it beside sources of freshwater. Do you guys think we can somehow add this bit?

 

[Uighur_Caesar]

If we want another none-Javanese civ, I would recommend Bali. The civ would probably have to be more of a blob civ rather than a particular era of Balinese history though. I was thinking it could be a culture/food civ. They have an irrigation system called Subak which could be a watermill replacement or maybe even a UI. They also have an interesting culture and are the most Hindu place in Indonesia today. If we wanted something religious, we could use the Pura (Balinese Hindu Temple) as the UB. Other possible UBs are the Gamelan ensemble as an Opera House replacement or the Wayang as an Amphitheater replacement. Airlangga could be the leader since he appears to be the most important leader Bali has had and this civ would be a blob anyway.

 

[BenZL43]

Also, I found that, if the UU is a Great Engineer replacement, Why dont we use "Silpin"?
<snip>
Also, it was also mentioned that one of the desired location for religious building such as Candi was to built it beside sources of freshwater. Do you guys think we can somehow add this bit?

Silpin is a great name! Perhaps, instead for holy sites, Silpin can be consumed to enhance the effect of Candi improvement (one time) since you mentioned they also 'decorate' the candis with relief, ornaments and statues. When it is not used, it gives effect Natan35 drafted.

Also, I think Candi should require fresh water (lake/river) instead of flat lands. Borobudur and Dieng Complex are some of the candis built in hills. This way, we won't see Candi in arctic or desert flatlands.

That face, no wonder it's familiar.. Ahmad Dhani??

If we want another none-Javanese civ, I would recommend Bali. The civ would probably have to be more of a blob civ rather than a particular era of Balinese history though. I was thinking it could be a culture/food civ. They have an irrigation system called Subak which could be a watermill replacement or maybe even a UI. They also have an interesting culture and are the most Hindu place in Indonesia today. If we wanted something religious, we could use the Pura (Balinese Hindu Temple) as the UB. Other possible UBs are the Gamelan ensemble as an Opera House replacement or the Wayang as an Amphitheater replacement. Airlangga could be the leader since he appears to be the most important leader Bali has had and this civ would be a blob anyway.

The good thing about Bali, it is already sort of blob civilization anyway.
Wikipedia themselves don't bother describing each kingdom and instead anachronistically mentioned Kingdom of Bali / Balidvipa that rules the island in unbroken chain from the dawn of recorded history (914 AD) to 1908 AD when Dutch East Indies take over.

Alternatively, Subak as UA (since it's mostly a Balinese religious philosophy Tri Hita Karana imposed on farming) and Pura replace Temple as UB. Pura gives faith and tourism (with Mass Media?). Bali is then suitably designed for culture victory.

I'm thinking of Udayana, Airlangga's father and considered a prominent figure in Bali and associated with Bali's past glory. His name is enshrined in Bali's top university (Universitas Udayana) and Bali's military region/district (Kodam IX/Udayana). Airlangga is only half Balinese and I'm not sure if his Kahuripan kingdom ever rule Bali either directly or through vassalage.






btw, I'd like to propose renaming kul's Majapahit's proposed UA "Palapan Oath" to Hasta Mandala. I have yet to find any English reference, but it's a concept in Majapahit (described in Nagarakartagama book) where the kingdom divide Malayan archipelago into 8 Mandalas and aiming to unite these 8 (hasta) mandalas serve as base concept for Gajah Mada to declare his Palapa Oath so a combat bonus on nearby cities is appropriate.

 

[Uighur_Caesar]

Also, another none-Javanese one could be the Dayak People. They're the natives of Borneo and they seem interesting enough that a civ could be made of them. The Headhunter could certainly be an interesting UU.

 

[kul]

Also, another none-Javanese one could be the Dayak People. They're the natives of Borneo and they seem interesting enough that a civ could be made of them. The Headhunter could certainly be an interesting UU.

Ooh I can see it being led by Panglima Burung /Pangkalima, the quasi-mythological immortal unifier of the Dayak People. One of the stories about him that I heard is how he could let his mandau (Dayakese traditional blade) fly on its own and beheads his enemies in their hiding place. It could be a great UA.

Unique Ablity: Flying Mandau
Regardless of their action, Enemies that have been attacked by melee unit will slightly lose their health on their turn. This effect is doubled if said enemies are now fortified inside structures.

This is just wishful thinking I guess. Someday maybe I tackles actual modding instead of just drawing stuff. Not to mention now how Dayak really wishes people to look past their violent and headhunting imagery, and view them as a normal civilized community.