WW2-Global

[Hornblower]

USSR - SID - v 2.5 - early 1940

Beligerent allies!

Despite the best of diplomatic efforts it seems that Britain and the US have serious issues with the existence of the USSR. Initially a minor naval altercation in the Bering straight saw a hasty declaration of war by the USA upon the Russian people. Some heavy diplomatic lobbying saw peace prevail but not before British imperialist saw fit to annex Tajikistan.
Britains greed multiplied and they commenced warlike operations with their Indian armies early in the new year of 1940. The Tajiks have lost their beloved city to the British Indian army and an ill prepared people had to rally against the onslaught in the mountainous regions. A war of defence began and our scientists were urged to deliver a super weapon to save the state from the capitalist running dogs.
The Soviet airforce rallied and provided a constant rain of terror on the advancing troops. This seems to encourage British and French imperialists to continue attacking the Rodina. Fortunately the Soviet scientists have provided the people with the T34/76 tank just in time to prevent a capitalist onslaught.
Rapid buildup of tank armies has allowed a deployment of armour to destroy the British and French in the middle east. As compensation the Soviet state will occupy all of Persia and encourage the Imperialist dogs that peace is their only option.

The Axis aggressors.

In an unfortunate incident the Japanese Battleship Yamato collided with a Russian submarine of Vladivostok. Despite diplomatic assurances that this was simply an accident the Japanese Emperor has declare war upon the Soviet state. Fortunately the T-34 has been produced in sufficient numbers in the far east to ensure that Japanese aggression will fail. Soviet planners are eyeing Japan's Chinese cities as possible compensation for the insult.
Our trusted German trading partners had chosen to remain quiet during these altercations however their ridiculous pact with the Japanese has caused them to declare war. At this point though the Germans have wisely decided to remain on the correct side of their borders.
The Yugoslavs foolishly attempted to attack the USSR during this time of crisis however the German people in a sly move annexed that country whilst the Slavic armies were deployed against the USSR's Black Sea ports. Just desserts for traitorous swine.
Despite only limited numbers of T-34 and KV-1 tanks being available for defence the Soviet border cities are well defended and ready for the expected German and Finnish attacks. The sheer numbers of Pz-III's and the Luftwaffe may indeed bring the Axis armies early victories however the industrial might of the Soviet machine should turn back the enemy with a crimson tide of T-34's in the coming weeks.

 

[againsttheflow]

The download link on first page was updated with the new file, here is the link: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=107698&page=399

Ok, it's actually not the link on the first page that was updated but the one on page 399 which is where it leads. The edit date on the first page says Mar. 2 which is what had me confused. Thanks again.

 

[tom2050]

Germany - SID difficulty, AI most aggressive, no workers (clean pollution only), ironman rules (no reloads)

Week 10, 1942 - Took Rawalpindi (British-India). Took Kandahar (Persia). About 30 Soviet Infantry and several tanks attacked Dniepropetrovsk. I had 3 StuGs and many badly damaged panzers (1-2 HPs). They destroyed 1 StuG and had the others to 1 HP, to a loss of all attacking forces, but did not continue the assault with the plethora of remaining infantry next to the city. Instead they moved the big stacks of infantry onto the roads, theres no way I can bring in reinforcements.
Week 11, 1942 - Soviet Russia retakes Dniepropetrovsk (Germany). Took Groznyj (Soviet Russia). Iowa Class, 2 Battleships C2s and convoy headed towards Reykiavik, facing off with my 3 Hindenburgs and BismarckC. I have quit producing U-boats, they serve no purpose other than recon on US coast and in Atlantic to spot convoys coming across. It is tough to organize attacks on battleships (since usually 7+ are required to take 1 down), but are still useful for taking out carriers with their stealth attack. 28 armor pieces posed to strike Smolensk next turn, air recon of moscow shows no troops on ANY of the fortresses protecting Moscow.
Week 12, 1942 - Took Smolensk (Soviet Russia). US convoy and battleships were sunk with no losses. Japan finally has 1 Otsu sub! Axis powers now have the same % of world area as the allies, 28%. % of world population is much higher, 54% to 25%. Score is much less though, 56208 to 85738.
Week 14, 1942 - Japan takes and razes Srinagar (British-India), thank goodness, Britain was bombing Mashhad from that city. My Soviet city Riga, is now producing Baltic troops for Germany, great!
Week 15, 1942 - Took Dniepropetrovsk (Soviet Russia). Unable to assault Moscow, most of my forces are damaged, and barracks are constantly being destroyed by bombing runs, so things have slowed considerably.
Week 16, 1942 - Soviet Russia retakes Dniepropetrovsk (Germany) with a fury (they must be passionate about that city, rarely does the AI put everything into a particular city!). Took Tula (Soviet Russia).
Week 17, 1942 - Took Kotlas (Soviet Russia), with help of Finnish forces. Finland has quite a large force for being so small, they have tanks and infantry skirmishing all over with Russia (which helps me), and the Italians are all over the globe, haha! although only a unit here and there.
Week 18, 1942 - Ugh! Someone signed a peace treaty with Soviet Russia! Friggin idiots! Now I must wait 19 turns to declare war. Told Soviets to remove their forces or declare war (hoping for the latter), but they left my territory. Russia was making a very big comeback in terms of tanks, They have 63 now compared to the previous 24 on Week 8. My forces have reached Indian city of Bombay.
Week 19, 1942 - Took Kabul (Persia). Persia defeated! Took Bombay (British-India).
Week 20, 1942 - I now have almost full surveillance of much of the Atlantic ocean through use of about 70 uboats. I can coordinate engagements with enemy fleets and convoys by positioning my main naval fleets ahead of time. I also sink escort carriers with my subs regularly. US has 795 tanks and armored units. Thats around 90 more tanks in 12 weeks. At this pace, when I launch the coastal invasion in beginning of 1943, US would have over 1100 armored units.
Week 21, 1942 - Japan takes Khotan (China). China defeated. Japan declares war on Soviet Russia! This brings axis powers into the war. Soviets bombed the c**p out of a stack of units near Gomel, but most units were only slightly damaged and my 4 StuGs took the brunt. Other than that, Russia primarily just repositioned their forces.
Week 22, 1942 - Took Dniepropetrovsk (Soviet Russia) and I intend to hold on to it this time, knowing well, that Russia will attack it with mass force. Took Kharkov (Soviet Russia), looks like I wont have to worry about Russia attacking Dniepropetrovsk after all. First Mobile Artillery units are seeing action. Their blitz (double bombard) is great, although they are expensive units! Researching Sea 2 1941 to get convoys (4 turns left).
Week 23, 1942 - Combined German and Japanese bombing left British Hyderabad severely weakened. Japan took Hyderabad (British-India), my panzer brigades will continue south towards Madras, although most are at 50-75% health from continued British bombing runs. Took Voronezh (Soviet Russia). Took Kursk (Soviet Russia). Took Rostov (Soviet Russia). First He-177 Heavy Bomber is operational! My movements are
somewhat hampered from the fact that I destroyed several roads leading into Soviet territory during the first German-Soviet skirmish. Many cities are unconnected to luxuries, which causes these citizens to be a pain. The only way to connect these cities is to take Moscow.
Week 24, 1942 - Must pull India panzer force back to heal, the British bombing runs have them in horrible shape. It's strange the AI never fortifies their special fortresses when they are located in a city, another AI bug most likely. Took Tver (Soviet Russia).
Week 25, 1942 - Took Petjora (Soviet Russia).
Week 26, 1942 - Took Astrachan (Soviet Russia). Took Sosnovka (Soviet Russia). I have been making alot of cheap German Security Divisions lately to garrison inner cities and act as military police, to move german infantry up to combat.
Week 27, 1942 - Took Sevastopol (Soviet Russia), whose fortresses where a particular problem. Mobile Artillery was most effective in damaging them, but still lost 6+ panzers and a handful of aircraft taking the city. Declared war on Thailand. Took Samarkand (Soviet Russia). 12+ Soviet tanks are pushing up north toward recently taken Kotlas, slowed by Finnish forces in the area. I have launched an attack on Jaroslavl to try to distract some of those forces while I bring reinforcements over.
Week 28, 1942 - Soviet Russia retakes Samarkand (Germany). Took Stalingrad (Soviet Russia). There is only a handful of remaining Soviet cities I will take, the remaining Soviet nation would take too many resources and time given the lack of roads. I need to end the war with Soviets in no more than 12 weeks, to concentrate and coordinate building the US invasion fleet.
US Invasion Plan - My planned attack on the US is to hit Augusta (and probably Halifax at the same time). Augusta is a smaller city, but is at top of eastern coast, so is a good defensive point. Also, there is a river right below Augusta, which will provide my troops with additional defense. Halifax will be taken primarily to relieve British-Canada of their naval production, which will then simply defend, and to distract British Canadian forces from my forces in Augusta. I will initially send older Me-109Gs on bombing runs to try to shoot down enemy fighters, I will then send Fw 190Gs after to continue bombing
and clear any remainding air power. Once air supierority is achieved, I will use dive bombers, medium and heavy bombers to cripple city defenses, as well as massive naval bombardment (probably around 80-100+ ships, 75% being S-Boats <-- they have a great fire-to-hit ratio). Majority of carriers will have Fw 190As for air superiority to protect from enemy bombers. So far I have 18 carriers/escort carriers (holds about 50 aircraft), but looking to triple that. The reason is, I will need to dispatch probably
5-6 fighters to each conquered city initially, while carriers still provide fighter cover, so they can eventually move south to assault other coastal cities. My transports will carry infantry, while convoys will carry more expensive cargo (88s, mobile artillery, panzers, etc) when possible. If I can take these 2 cities using amphibious only, I can then land all my panzer divisions which can move freely that same turn to attack or defend depending on situation. I will attempt to take Albany and Boston next, then New
York. But like we all know, things never turn out quite the way they are planned.

 

[Rocoteh]

USSR - SID - v 2.5 - early 1940

Beligerent allies!

Despite the best of diplomatic efforts it seems that Britain and the US have serious issues with the existence of the USSR. Initially a minor naval altercation in the Bering straight saw a hasty declaration of war by the USA upon the Russian people. Some heavy diplomatic lobbying saw peace prevail but not before British imperialist saw fit to annex Tajikistan.
Britains greed multiplied and they commenced warlike operations with their Indian armies early in the new year of 1940. The Tajiks have lost their beloved city to the British Indian army and an ill prepared people had to rally against the onslaught in the mountainous regions. A war of defence began and our scientists were urged to deliver a super weapon to save the state from the capitalist running dogs.
The Soviet airforce rallied and provided a constant rain of terror on the advancing troops. This seems to encourage British and French imperialists to continue attacking the Rodina. Fortunately the Soviet scientists have provided the people with the T34/76 tank just in time to prevent a capitalist onslaught.
Rapid buildup of tank armies has allowed a deployment of armour to destroy the British and French in the middle east. As compensation the Soviet state will occupy all of Persia and encourage the Imperialist dogs that peace is their only option.

The Axis aggressors.

In an unfortunate incident the Japanese Battleship Yamato collided with a Russian submarine of Vladivostok. Despite diplomatic assurances that this was simply an accident the Japanese Emperor has declare war upon the Soviet state. Fortunately the T-34 has been produced in sufficient numbers in the far east to ensure that Japanese aggression will fail. Soviet planners are eyeing Japan's Chinese cities as possible compensation for the insult.
Our trusted German trading partners had chosen to remain quiet during these altercations however their ridiculous pact with the Japanese has caused them to declare war. At this point though the Germans have wisely decided to remain on the correct side of their borders.
The Yugoslavs foolishly attempted to attack the USSR during this time of crisis however the German people in a sly move annexed that country whilst the Slavic armies were deployed against the USSR's Black Sea ports. Just desserts for traitorous swine.
Despite only limited numbers of T-34 and KV-1 tanks being available for defence the Soviet border cities are well defended and ready for the expected German and Finnish attacks. The sheer numbers of Pz-III's and the Luftwaffe may indeed bring the Axis armies early victories however the industrial might of the Soviet machine should turn back the enemy with a crimson tide of T-34's in the coming weeks.

Hornblower,


This will be very interesting to follow!

Hopefully you will be able establih a peace-treaty with the Axis
so you can occupy The Middle East and Persia.
After that you will probably get a peace offer from US and Britain.

Many options should then be possible.

Thank you for the report and welcome back.

Rocoteh

 

[Rocoteh]

tom2050,

Thank you for the report.


"Germany - SID difficulty, AI most aggressive, no workers (clean pollution only), ironman rules (no reloads)

Week 10, 1942 - Took Rawalpindi (British-India). Took Kandahar (Persia). About 30 Soviet Infantry and several tanks attacked Dniepropetrovsk. I had 3 StuGs and many badly damaged panzers (1-2 HPs). They destroyed 1 StuG and had the others to 1 HP, to a loss of all attacking forces, but did not continue the assault with the plethora of remaining infantry next to the city. Instead they moved the big stacks of infantry onto the roads, theres no way I can bring in reinforcements.
Week 11, 1942 - Soviet Russia retakes Dniepropetrovsk (Germany). Took Groznyj (Soviet Russia). Iowa Class, 2 Battleships C2s and convoy headed towards Reykiavik, facing off with my 3 Hindenburgs and BismarckC. I have quit producing U-boats, they serve no purpose other than recon on US coast and in Atlantic to spot convoys coming across. It is tough to organize attacks on battleships (since usually 7+ are required to take 1 down), but are still useful for taking out carriers with their stealth attack. 28 armor pieces posed to strike Smolensk next turn, air recon of moscow shows no troops on ANY of the fortresses protecting Moscow.
Week 12, 1942 - Took Smolensk (Soviet Russia). US convoy and battleships were sunk with no losses. Japan finally has 1 Otsu sub! Axis powers now have the same % of world area as the allies, 28%. % of world population is much higher, 54% to 25%. Score is much less though, 56208 to 85738."
tom2050

Soviet still seems to have some offensive capacity.
Earlier it looked liked they soon should run out of steam and be forced
to take defensive positions.

"Week 14, 1942 - Japan takes and razes Srinagar (British-India), thank goodness, Britain was bombing Mashhad from that city. My Soviet city Riga, is now producing Baltic troops for Germany, great!
Week 15, 1942 - Took Dniepropetrovsk (Soviet Russia). Unable to assault Moscow, most of my forces are damaged, and barracks are constantly being destroyed by bombing runs, so things have slowed considerably.
Week 16, 1942 - Soviet Russia retakes Dniepropetrovsk (Germany) with a fury (they must be passionate about that city, rarely does the AI put everything into a particular city!). Took Tula (Soviet Russia).
Week 17, 1942 - Took Kotlas (Soviet Russia), with help of Finnish forces. Finland has quite a large force for being so small, they have tanks and infantry skirmishing all over with Russia (which helps me), and the Italians are all over the globe, haha! although only a unit here and there.
Week 18, 1942 - Ugh! Someone signed a peace treaty with Soviet Russia! Friggin idiots! Now I must wait 19 turns to declare war. Told Soviets to remove their forces or declare war (hoping for the latter), but they left my territory. Russia was making a very big comeback in terms of tanks, They have 63 now compared to the previous 24 on Week 8. My forces have reached Indian city of Bombay."
tom2050

The increased Soviet tank force is a surprise.
No doubt they will benefit very strong from the peace treaty.

"Week 20, 1942 - I now have almost full surveillance of much of the Atlantic ocean through use of about 70 uboats. I can coordinate engagements with enemy fleets and convoys by positioning my main naval fleets ahead of time. I also sink escort carriers with my subs regularly. US has 795 tanks and armored units. Thats around 90 more tanks in 12 weeks. At this pace, when I launch the coastal invasion in beginning of 1943, US would have over 1100 armored units."
tom2050

I have never seen such a huge AI force reported earlier!
Its incredible.

"Week 21, 1942 - Japan takes Khotan (China). China defeated. Japan declares war on Soviet Russia! This brings axis powers into the war. Soviets bombed the c**p out of a stack of units near Gomel, but most units were only slightly damaged and my 4 StuGs took the brunt. Other than that, Russia primarily just repositioned their forces.
Week 22, 1942 - Took Dniepropetrovsk (Soviet Russia) and I intend to hold on to it this time, knowing well, that Russia will attack it with mass force. Took Kharkov (Soviet Russia), looks like I wont have to worry about Russia attacking Dniepropetrovsk after all. First Mobile Artillery units are seeing action. Their blitz (double bombard) is great, although they are expensive units! Researching Sea 2 1941 to get convoys (4 turns left).
Week 23, 1942 - Combined German and Japanese bombing left British Hyderabad severely weakened. Japan took Hyderabad (British-India), my panzer brigades will continue south towards Madras, although most are at 50-75% health from continued British bombing runs. Took Voronezh (Soviet Russia). Took Kursk (Soviet Russia). Took Rostov (Soviet Russia). First He-177 Heavy Bomber is operational! My movements are
somewhat hampered from the fact that I destroyed several roads leading into Soviet territory during the first German-Soviet skirmish. Many cities are unconnected to luxuries, which causes these citizens to be a pain. The only way to connect these cities is to take Moscow."
tom2050

That the time of peace with Soviet become so short should be of crucial value for you.

"Week 24, 1942 - Must pull India panzer force back to heal, the British bombing runs have them in horrible shape. It's strange the AI never fortifies their special fortresses when they are located in a city, another AI bug most likely. Took Tver (Soviet Russia)."
tom2050

Agree.
Its probably an AI bug.

"Week 25, 1942 - Took Petjora (Soviet Russia).
Week 26, 1942 - Took Astrachan (Soviet Russia). Took Sosnovka (Soviet Russia). I have been making alot of cheap German Security Divisions lately to garrison inner cities and act as military police, to move german infantry up to combat.
Week 27, 1942 - Took Sevastopol (Soviet Russia), whose fortresses where a particular problem. Mobile Artillery was most effective in damaging them, but still lost 6+ panzers and a handful of aircraft taking the city. Declared war on Thailand. Took Samarkand (Soviet Russia). 12+ Soviet tanks are pushing up north toward recently taken Kotlas, slowed by Finnish forces in the area. I have launched an attack on Jaroslavl to try to distract some of those forces while I bring reinforcements over.
Week 28, 1942 - Soviet Russia retakes Samarkand (Germany). Took Stalingrad (Soviet Russia). There is only a handful of remaining Soviet cities I will take, the remaining Soviet nation would take too many resources and time given the lack of roads. I need to end the war with Soviets in no more than 12 weeks, to concentrate and coordinate building the US invasion fleet."
tom2050

Yes the invasion of America should be high priority.

"US Invasion Plan - My planned attack on the US is to hit Augusta (and probably Halifax at the same time). Augusta is a smaller city, but is at top of eastern coast, so is a good defensive point. Also, there is a river right below Augusta, which will provide my troops with additional defense. Halifax will be taken primarily to relieve British-Canada of their naval production, which will then simply defend, and to distract British Canadian forces from my forces in Augusta. I will initially send older Me-109Gs on bombing runs to try to shoot down enemy fighters, I will then send Fw 190Gs after to continue bombing
and clear any remainding air power. Once air supierority is achieved, I will use dive bombers, medium and heavy bombers to cripple city defenses, as well as massive naval bombardment (probably around 80-100+ ships, 75% being S-Boats <-- they have a great fire-to-hit ratio). Majority of carriers will have Fw 190As for air superiority to protect from enemy bombers. So far I have 18 carriers/escort carriers (holds about 50 aircraft), but looking to triple that. The reason is, I will need to dispatch probably
5-6 fighters to each conquered city initially, while carriers still provide fighter cover, so they can eventually move south to assault other coastal cities. My transports will carry infantry, while convoys will carry more expensive cargo (88s, mobile artillery, panzers, etc) when possible. If I can take these 2 cities using amphibious only, I can then land all my panzer divisions which can move freely that same turn to attack or defend depending on situation. I will attempt to take Albany and Boston next, then New
York. But like we all know, things never turn out quite the way they are planned"
tom2050

It looks like a good plan.
This campaign will be very interesting to follow!

Thank you and welcome back.


Rocoteh

 

[Andreas68]

Germany AI production-strategy works better in version 2.5 then in 2.4.
That is because its not possible to produce the 88s anymore.
They will now only come from autoproduction.
When it was poosible to produce the 88s the result was a to defensive
production-strategy from Germany AI.

Rocoteh

Which was exactly the case here again. As soon as Germany researched Land 1940 for the StuGIIIA, it was producing them like mad and almost nothing else. When it's number exceeded that of the German tanks (75 Panzer IIIe, 97 STuGIIIA and only 9 Panzer IIIg) I terminated this playtest at week 9, 1941.

Now I have set it to be autoproduced at Stuttgart, and the autoproduction is set to stop when Sea 1942 (StugIIIG) is researched.

And if this works, I will try to do something about the Japanese Yamato battleships - having Japan run around with 33 (in my Germany game earlier) or even 47 (as reported here by another fellow player) Yamato's isn't really something good.

Regarding workers, with spies the latest figures were;

Soviets - 117 - yes they stopped mass producing them
Italy - 1
China - 11
Japan - 23
Germany - 27 - up 26 from week 44/40 to 9/41
France - 4
USA - 62
Finland - 10
Persia - 4
Spain - 7
Brasil - 14
Communist-China -1
Sweden - 7
Norway/Denmark - 2

Actually I think the workers are okay now, after implementing your idea of railroads being a late war tech.

 

[Rocoteh]

Andreas68,


"Which was exactly the case here again. As soon as Germany researched Land 1940 for the StuGIIIA, it was producing them like mad and almost nothing else. When it's number exceeded that of the German tanks (75 Panzer IIIe, 97 STuGIIIA and only 9 Panzer IIIg) I terminated this playtest at week 9, 1941.

Now I have set it to be autoproduced at Stuttgart, and the autoproduction is set to stop when Sea 1942 (StugIIIG) is researched."
Andreas68

Yes with regard to production AI seems to like units with high defense numbers.

"And if this works, I will try to do something about the Japanese Yamato battleships - having Japan run around with 33 (in my Germany game earlier) or even 47 (as reported here by another fellow player) Yamato's isn't really something good."
Andreas68

This is discussion that have been going on since the scenario was launched
in December 2004.

Some people mean that its possible to produce an unrealistic number of units
in WW2-Global. (Far example Yamatos.)

The problem is that if production was reduced to historical numbers
that would create results that is much more unrealistic.
Take for example the Japanese navy.
The few Japanese surface ships that Japan completed 1939-1945
AI would consume within 3-4 turns.

Historic production-rates will not just work with the Civ 3 game-engine.
Historic rates will work with a game engine like the one in
The Operational Art of War but it will not work here.

"Regarding workers, with spies the latest figures were;


Soviets - 117 - yes they stopped mass producing them
Italy - 1
China - 11
Japan - 23
Germany - 27 - up 26 from week 44/40 to 9/41
France - 4
USA - 62
Finland - 10
Persia - 4
Spain - 7
Brasil - 14
Communist-China -1
Sweden - 7
Norway/Denmark - 2

Actually I think the workers are okay now, after implementing your idea of railroads being a late war tech."
Andreas68

Yes I think the railroad-tech will be a good solution.

Rocoteh

 

[Andreas68]

It's not historical production rates I am after, I know that this will not work - I am thinking of having 1 Yamato auto-produced every 20 weeks, which still gives Japan a good number of Yamato's. And having the Yamato auto-produced will probably force AI to produce the BattleshipC2 instead.

That some if not all ideas I am pondering here have already been discussed ages ago is something I know too, after all I haven't played Civ III for years and am only in again since about a year.

Next thing is submarines. Never in any game or scenario have I seen the AI produce a single submarine. In other scenarios, AI doesn't even produce destroyers, but in your scenario, it does.

 

[againsttheflow]

Some people mean that its possible to produce an unrealistic number of units
in WW2-Global. (Far example Yamatos.)

The problem is that if production was reduced to historical numbers
that would create results that is much more unrealistic.
Take for example the Japanese navy.
The few Japanese surface ships that Japan completed 1939-1945
AI would consume within 3-4 turns.

Historic production-rates will not just work with the Civ 3 game-engine.
Historic rates will work with a game engine like the one in
The Operational Art of War but it will not work here.

I agree with you here, the production rates just won't work out well if done realistically. What I would like to see is a at least a quasi-realistic number running around in game at any one time. This means of course that they'll have to produce more than the realistic amount but I agree with Andreas that they're producing too many at the moment.

Perhaps you could implement an auto production queue or perhaps you could up the cost, I'm sure that only testing will show what really works but yeah, it'd be nice to see a tweak in this area.

railroads being a late war tech.

I don't remember all the discussion on it (was it going to be a really expensive tech?) but I would prefer to have them out completely; ie assign the RR tech to "no era" so nobody can research it.

 

[Serutan]

I don't remember all the discussion on it (was it going to be a really expensive tech?) but I would prefer to have them out completely; ie assign the RR tech to "no era" so nobody can research it.

From what I remember of the discussions on RRs, there never was really
a consensus. So I think it's best to leave things as they are; anyone who
doesn't like railroads or prefers their own railroad prereqs/construction time can always use the editor to please themselves.

 

[Rocoteh]

It's not historical production rates I am after, I know that this will not work - I am thinking of having 1 Yamato auto-produced every 20 weeks, which still gives Japan a good number of Yamato's. And having the Yamato auto-produced will probably force AI to produce the BattleshipC2 instead.

That some if not all ideas I am pondering here have already been discussed ages ago is something I know too, after all I haven't played Civ III for years and am only in again since about a year.

Next thing is submarines. Never in any game or scenario have I seen the AI produce a single submarine. In other scenarios, AI doesn't even produce destroyers, but in your scenario, it does.

Andreas68,

I did not mean it was wrong to bring up an issue that have been
discussed earlier.
My point was that the Civ 3 game-engine will make historic production
rates a problem.
However its possible that production capacity should be reduced.
I will look over it.

Its positive that AI produce destroyers.
As mentioned earlier no one really knows how AI works
with regard to production.

Rocoteh

 

[Rocoteh]

I agree with you here, the production rates just won't work out well if done realistically. What I would like to see is a at least a quasi-realistic number running around in game at any one time. This means of course that they'll have to produce more than the realistic amount but I agree with Andreas that they're producing too many at the moment.

Perhaps you could implement an auto production queue or perhaps you could up the cost, I'm sure that only testing will show what really works but yeah, it'd be nice to see a tweak in this area.

againsttheflow,

I will look over production again with regard to version 2.6.
Its possible there will be reduction of overall production-capacity.


Rocoteh

 

[Rocoteh]

From what I remember of the discussions on RRs, there never was really
a consensus. So I think it's best to leave things as they are; anyone who
doesn't like railroads or prefers their own railroad prereqs/construction time can always use the editor to please themselves.

Serutan,

OK, notes have been taken.

Version 2.6 is still far away and I have not made a final decision yet
on how to solve the problem with railroads.

Rocoteh

 

[tom2050]

I may do a minor update to the civilopedia... I just realized some aircraft are not capable to aircraft carrier operations, I must have missed that while going through the editor. All the He-177 bombers I made cannot load to carriers, along with several others in my game.

 

[tom2050]

Germany - SID difficulty, AI most aggressive, no workers (clean pollution only), ironman rules (no reloads)

Week 30, 1942 - Took Saratov (Soviet Russia). Took Samarkand (Soviet Russia). Soviet air power has diminished severely, and their ground forces no longer have much air protection. By Week 40, I will gain as much territory as possible and call a truce.
Week 31, 1942 - Took Kujbysjev (Soviet Russia). Ive just noticed I've passed the 1000 total units mark (1097 units)!
Week 32, 1942 - Took Jaroslavl (Soviet Russia). Took Krasnovodsk (Soviet Russia).
Week 33, 1942 - Took Aralsk (Soviet Russia). FW 190Gs destroyed remaining infantry at Soviet city Vorkuta, for Finnish troops to take. British-India assault force (13 panzers) has reached Madras along with 10 Japanese infantry, but most panzers are at 50% health from continued bombing.
Week 34, 1942 - Took Chelyabinsk (Soviet Russia). Took Gorki (Soviet Russia). Having taken Gorki, Moscow is completely surrounded by my territory and cut off from reinforcements. Took Madras (British-India). All my panzers had about 3 HPs or less each, lost several of them.
Week 35, 1942 - Took Moscow! (Soviet Russia). Finally, all my cities are connected by roads and can use their badly needed marketplaces to make citizens happy. Made peace with Thailand (other Axis powers didn't join in). US has 877 armored units and 548 infantry.
Week 36, 1942 - Finally, Land 1943! Panthers, SS Panzers and Panzer IVh will be rolling out soon. Finland takes and razes Vorkuta (Soviet Russia). Took Sverdlovsk (Soviet Russia). Took Kazan (Soviet Russia). That about does it for the cities I want, I will take Perm and maybe a couple other cities but that is it. Took Tasjkent (Soviet Russia). Im surprised Soviet Russia hasn't researched Land 1943 yet, if they had earlier, things would not have gone so well for me.
Week 37, 1942 - Panzer IVh and Mobile Rockets roll out of production. Took Madurai (British-India). British India has been conquered, except for city of Colombo on small island south of Madurai.
Week 38, 1942 - Japan takes Kashgar (Communist-China). Communist-China defeated! 3 Iowa Class battleships and convoy sunk by my northern atlantic fleet of 5 Hindenburgs/1 BismarckC. US has close to 900 armored units.
Week 39, 1942 - Took Alma-Ata (Soviet Russia). 1943 SS Panzer rolls out of production.
Week 40, 1942 - Took Perm (Soviet Russia). Took Omsk (Soviet Russia).
Week 41, 1942 - Took Karaganda (Soviet Russia). Took Tobolsk (Soviet Russia). I have taken all the Soviet cities I desire, and will extend no further into Soviet territory. Setting up defensive positions along Soviet border and bringing all troops back to Lissabon to prepare for naval launch against the US. Naval assault force will leave port Week 1, 1943. Signed peace treaty with Soviet Russia, other axis powers did the same. Panthers roll out of production.
Week 42, 1942 - There are 13 YamatoCs, 5 carriers, 3 Battleships, and an assortment of light and heavy cruisers launching a massive bombardment assaults on the netherlands city of Surabaya and Makassar. There are likely more ships out of the Konigsberg Light Cruiser view range. A couple transport were spotted several squares back. My subs near Davao witnessed several amphibious assaults on that city as well.
Week 43, 1942 - Japan takes Surabaya (Netherlands). It appeared the whole japanese force there moved west. I will follow them to track their progress and movements. I have begun loading aircraft and troops to aircraft carriers and transports and will continue to do so as they arrive. I am also bringing along close to 30 Artillery Offensive units to help with inland assaults and/or defense. I will post a unit count of my offensive forces when the assault force leaves port Week 1, 1943. I don't expect too much to happen until then, unless someone declares war on Soviet Russia, ha! US has 910 armored units, they dont seem to building them as fast as they were previously.

 

[Rocoteh]

tom2050,

Thank you for the report.

"Germany - SID difficulty, AI most aggressive, no workers (clean pollution only), ironman rules (no reloads)

Week 30, 1942 - Took Saratov (Soviet Russia). Took Samarkand (Soviet Russia). Soviet air power has diminished severely, and their ground forces no longer have much air protection. By Week 40, I will gain as much territory as possible and call a truce.
Week 31, 1942 - Took Kujbysjev (Soviet Russia). Ive just noticed I've passed the 1000 total units mark (1097 units)!
Week 32, 1942 - Took Jaroslavl (Soviet Russia). Took Krasnovodsk (Soviet Russia).
Week 33, 1942 - Took Aralsk (Soviet Russia). FW 190Gs destroyed remaining infantry at Soviet city Vorkuta, for Finnish troops to take. British-India assault force (13 panzers) has reached Madras along with 10 Japanese infantry, but most panzers are at 50% health from continued bombing.
Week 34, 1942 - Took Chelyabinsk (Soviet Russia). Took Gorki (Soviet Russia). Having taken Gorki, Moscow is completely surrounded by my territory and cut off from reinforcements. Took Madras (British-India). All my panzers had about 3 HPs or less each, lost several of them."
tom2050

Soviet will never recover from this.

"Week 35, 1942 - Took Moscow! (Soviet Russia). Finally, all my cities are connected by roads and can use their badly needed marketplaces to make citizens happy. Made peace with Thailand (other Axis powers didn't join in). US has 877 armored units and 548 infantry."
tom2050

For sure a very impressing force.

"Week 36, 1942 - Finally, Land 1943! Panthers, SS Panzers and Panzer IVh will be rolling out soon. Finland takes and razes Vorkuta (Soviet Russia). Took Sverdlovsk (Soviet Russia). Took Kazan (Soviet Russia). That about does it for the cities I want, I will take Perm and maybe a couple other cities but that is it. Took Tasjkent (Soviet Russia). Im surprised Soviet Russia hasn't researched Land 1943 yet, if they had earlier, things would not have gone so well for me."
tom2050

The reason is probably that when a AI-controlled Civ comes under pressure they
will often cease to research.

"Week 37, 1942 - Panzer IVh and Mobile Rockets roll out of production. Took Madurai (British-India). British India has been conquered, except for city of Colombo on small island south of Madurai.
Week 38, 1942 - Japan takes Kashgar (Communist-China). Communist-China defeated! 3 Iowa Class battleships and convoy sunk by my northern atlantic fleet of 5 Hindenburgs/1 BismarckC. US has close to 900 armored units."
tom2050

The overall situation does not look good for the British Empire.

"Week 39, 1942 - Took Alma-Ata (Soviet Russia). 1943 SS Panzer rolls out of production.
Week 40, 1942 - Took Perm (Soviet Russia). Took Omsk (Soviet Russia).
Week 41, 1942 - Took Karaganda (Soviet Russia). Took Tobolsk (Soviet Russia). I have taken all the Soviet cities I desire, and will extend no further into Soviet territory. Setting up defensive positions along Soviet border and bringing all troops back to Lissabon to prepare for naval launch against the US. Naval assault force will leave port Week 1, 1943. Signed peace treaty with Soviet Russia, other axis powers did the same. Panthers roll out of production."
tom2050

A good decision.

"Week 42, 1942 - There are 13 YamatoCs, 5 carriers, 3 Battleships, and an assortment of light and heavy cruisers launching a massive bombardment assaults on the netherlands city of Surabaya and Makassar. There are likely more ships out of the Konigsberg Light Cruiser view range. A couple transport were spotted several squares back. My subs near Davao witnessed several amphibious assaults on that city as well.
Week 43, 1942 - Japan takes Surabaya (Netherlands). It appeared the whole japanese force there moved west. I will follow them to track their progress and movements."
tom2050

It will be interesting to see if Japan AI is able to conquer the whole of
Dutch East india.

"I have begun loading aircraft and troops to aircraft carriers and transports and will continue to do so as they arrive. I am also bringing along close to 30 Artillery Offensive units to help with inland assaults and/or defense. I will post a unit count of my offensive forces when the assault force leaves port Week 1, 1943. I don't expect too much to happen until then, unless someone declares war on Soviet Russia, ha! US has 910 armored units, they dont seem to building them as fast as they were previously."
tom2050

The artillery offensives should be of great value in this campaign.


Thank you for the report and welcome back.


Rocoteh

 

[tom2050]

Germany - SID difficulty, AI most aggressive, no workers (clean pollution only), ironman rules (no reloads)

Current world map of the game.

Week 44, 1942 - I had a uboat near the Japanese city of Truk for quite some time, and a US Battleship, 2 WWI Destroyers and a transport showed up. 1 of the WWI Destroyers itself actually attacked the city of Turk (and was sunk by the Japanese Infantry defender), then my sub was sunk.. but I must say it is strange that happens, I've never seen that happen before in a regular game. 9 YamatoCs and 3 transports have entered into the range of US held Davao city. We'll see if they launch another assault.
Week 45, 1942 - The US actually had the nerve to bring a convoy and 3 Iowa Class Battleships right next to Ponta Delgada (which is where my naval bombard fleet of 11 Hindenburgs, 44 S-Boats, 2 BismarckCs, and 6 other various cruisers and battleships are stationed). The bombard alone had each Iowa class at 5/13 hitpoints. Bringing over my bombers to start bombing Colombo, if I can kill the troops stationed there, I will paratroop an infantry in to take the city.
Week 47, 1942 - Masses of Finnish and Italian forces appear to be heading down into Africa (although it is a long way), and hordes of Japanese infantry are beginning to come over through the middle east (since the rest of the continent has been mostly conquered). YamatoC sinks a British battleship near Palembang, and my 2 uboats sink the other damaged battleship and a carrier.
Week 49, 1942 - Caught France attempting to plant a spy. US has 944 tanks. US has 92 aircraft, and I will be bringing over around 60, so air protection should be adequate.
Week 50, 1942 - Took Colombo (British). 17 YamatoCs are continually bombarding British Kuala Lumpur.
Week 51, 1942 - Japan takes and razes Kuala Lumpur (British). US has 958 tanks. The naval bombardment fleet has left port from Ponta Delgada (ahead of the naval transport fleet, due to slower S-Boat speeds) and will arrive near Halifax in 9 turns. Naval Bombardment fleet consists of: 8 Hindenburg, 1 BismarckC, 2 Gneisenau, 2 Deutschland Class Battleships, 2 Predreadnoughts, 2 AA Cruisers, 1 Carrier C3, 16 Escort Carriers (Carriers have 16 FW 190A, 5 Ju88/Ju188, 8 Ju87B, 8 He-219/Hs-129), and 64 S-Boat Flotillas.
Week 52, 1942 - All the other axis powers are sending a ton of troops and tanks down to southern Africa, once they arrive, I will assist in the assault with the 16 panzers and large force of infantry I have stationed along the front.
Week 1, 1943 - The US coastal invasion fleet leaves port from Lissabon and will catch up to the naval bombardment fleet in about 4 turns. The US coastal invasion fleet consists of: 1 Hinderburg, 1 Gneisenau, 11 Deutschland Battleships, 2 Heavy Cruisers/C2, 1 Light Cruiser C2, 5 AA Cruisers, 2 Destroyers, 2 Uboats, 5 Carrier C3, 1 Carrier C2, 1 Carrier (Carriers have 15 FW 190A/G, 7 Ju87, 9 Hs129, 2 Ju88), 17 Convoys, 29 transports (These have 344 units: 21 SS Panzer 1943, 27 Panther, 95 Panzer IVh/f2, 23 Panzer IIIe/g/h, 21 StuGIII, 52 Infantry, 14 German 88, 15 Mobile Artillery/Rockets, 36 Artillery Offensive, 22 Flak, 10 (SS Infantry, Marines, Paratroops), 3 Army HQ, 3 Panzergrenadier).
The US invasion will begin in 7-8 turns when they reach the coastline. Even with these forces, I will still be outnumbered 8:1.

 

[tom2050]

From what I remember of the discussions on RRs, there never was really
a consensus. So I think it's best to leave things as they are; anyone who
doesn't like railroads or prefers their own railroad prereqs/construction time can always use the editor to please themselves.

To be honest, I have never liked the fact that railroads give you unlimited movement (I think most would agree). They should have double movement points (or something of the sort) instead. So having railroad build times very long is an excellent way to go, as well as having it as a later tech. But railroads take alot of the strategy out of the game because you could zap your whole army anywhere in 1 turn. But this would not likely happen since it would take a huge stack of workers to build a railroad each turn. The current game I am playing, using no workers, is probably one of the most enjoyable I've played yet, due to the fact that certain locations take much more time and effort to conquer and reinforce (and sometimes are not even worth it) since roads may be sparse and not connected. I'd have to say make it a very late tech (late 1944 or 45) as to not diminish the strategic portion of the mod.

 

[Andreas68]

The problem is, in the current 2.6 version, workers actually do nothing at all. That's why railroads need to be in, and Rocoteh wrote about his idea to make railroads a late-war tech to be researched.

And as soon as this is implemented in the scenario, workers suddenly do their job even in 1939, no matter that railroads is a tech somewhere late 1945.

Good luck for your invasion, tom.

 

[tom2050]

The problem is, in the current 2.6 version, workers actually do nothing at all. That's why railroads need to be in, and Rocoteh wrote about his idea to make railroads a late-war tech to be researched.

And as soon as this is implemented in the scenario, workers suddenly do their job even in 1939, no matter that railroads is a tech somewhere late 1945.

Good luck for your invasion, tom.

Yes, I remember playing way back in the day when version 2.2 was out, then I didn't play for a while. When I loaded up 2.5 I was wondering why stacks of workers were just standing around, I thought they may have been on strike or something. So I figured if they dont use em, I wont to level the playing field (although on SID it's anything but level), but has been quite a challenge.

Thanks, hopefully my invasion force doesn't get decimated