WW2-Global

[Adler17]

Yes I am able to sink many times ships with Blitz attacks. Also I don´t see it is that bad. I am playing Germany and from the beginning Germany has a small navy compared to the Brits and US. The only chance not to be sunk is that I use my Uboats. However the boats are very vulnerable. And I suspect the AI cheats a little bit by knowing where the Uboats are. Also the Uboats are indeed my only chance to cope with 200 DDs+ and the cruiser. So I think and strongly recommend to stay the Blitz ability. One attack is too few. Also you must consider the naval system in civ III is awful.
To the Swordfishes: I can also bear you in mind the Operation Cerberus, where the swordfishes were no big match for the FlaK...

Adler

 

[Rocoteh]

I just upgraded my memory from 512MB to 1.5GB (added a 1GB strip). I have an AMD Athlon 2gHz processor. Here are the differences in times:

computer move -- 15 mintes -> 5 minutes. Both were with minimal graphical changes (hardly any moves I could see).

Computer Build -- 10 minutes -> 5 Minutes

Take city -- 5 Minutes -> 5 Minutes

So, not much changed when the computer had to re-calculate trade routes and such. Other then that, I gained 50-70% on the main slowdowns. Of course, with all the moves I have to do (workers, bombers, etc), it still takes me 1/2 hour for each turn. But, at least I am productive during that 1/2 hour.

As for my Japanese playtest, I took Calcutta. Instead of going after Thailand, I decided to take out the Chinese (both of them) first. I'll then re-divert and finish securing the SE penisula later.

I successfully stole Air 1940 from the Americans, so I need to start building zeros. I'll probably divert all productive cities to building 1 zero each. That should give me about 12 or so to work with. I need to see how long they take to build before I know for sure. My ground forces are doing fine, so they really don't need the re-inforcements right now, so I should be able to afford the diversion.

allin1joe,

Thank you for the report.

Overall I think the reduced waiting-time you describe is very good.
It confirms that RAM is very important when playing CIVIII/Conquests.

On the playtest: Yes maybe its best to finish the Chinese campaign first.

Welcome back.

Rocoteh

 

[Rocoteh]

Sasebo,

Thank you for the report.

"Let me just lend my vote to that Wolfpacks only getting blitz; it sounds far more reasonable to me then the current situation. Germany should start with some of those in this case, and the allies should not be able to build them until a later point in time, at least 1941 I would say. You need to simulate that US had really lousy torpedos early in the war someway Rocoteh." Sasebo

I am working on a solution.

"Rocoteh: I agree with what Bob1475 said about those Japanese/Allied islands in the Pacific. In my Japan game I find them extremely necessary to be able to repair ships and advance fleets; their usefulness for airbases is obvious. It will be very difficult without them to project any force,that is probably why so few Japan games have gone for the US mainland. That is one BIG ocean! Anything that gets wounded has to limp all the way back to your nearest port for repairs, truly daunting. Even the allies only did a big invasion across the channel, not the whole bloody pacific!" Sasebo

The islands will remain in version 1.4.

"I will post a 1 year report today or tomorrow Rocoteh, just so you can see what I managed to build in that span. Bear in mind I only built 2-3 manufacturing plants and probably won't build a lot of coal/hydro plants either. Other then the cities I start with those southern islands are just not going to be productive AT ALL... I used a leader to rush an offshore platform in Hong Kong after I took it which was a very good deal; I am going to try and use any more leaders to do the same with some of those lousy island cities I have. Decent pop, but no industry whatsoever." Sasebo

Its hard to play Japan.
I am looking forward to read the report.

Welcome back.

Rocoteh

 

[LBPB]

LBPB,

Your forces were probably overextended.

Its interesting though that AI has capacity to counterstrike in such
a situation. The fundamental problem AI has is to wage a sustained
offensive. Thus I think the counteroffensives AI have launched soon
will run out of steam.

Then the problem is where to strike against the counteroffensives
with priority.

Your early offensive strategy is very interesting.
I still think it will pay off.

Thank you and welcome back.

Rocoteh

Roco,

You're right, my forces where probably overextended.

Anyway in China, my frontline was made of approx 20 troops divisions, 8 armoured divisions, backuped by 12 artillery divisions and 8 bombers squads, and the Frenchs still broke it



Sidenote:

1)I'm now overproductive, all my cities are pumping troops, ships or planes...
For exemple, I've got 10 YamatoC and 4 Carriers C3, and much more others things...
Anyway it isn't enought
The allieds are replacing their equipments at an crazy rate !
For exemple, it will be about 10 months yet, that I'm bombing Singapor and Solmons Islands non-stop, killing each turn approx 4 bombers and 1 fighters, and they are replaced within a week !!!


2)For the US ships, I'm now understanding from where they are comming from !
The came from the East US coast !!!
They are using the northern passage in arctic sea, and this should be impossible (that's annoying, but you said you'll fix that).


A3)lso I think you should probably split up the Commonwealth countries...

 

[Adler17]

Germany had in 1940 also a "Torpedo Krise", but they found fastly a solution. Nevertheless some German ships were sunk because their torpedoes were dud and the enemy could sink them. Later no problems occured and the German use of torpedoes was excellent (sinking HMS Edinburgh, HMS Charybdis, HMS Limbourne, Norwegian CDS Norge and sister ship, HMS Hardy, HMS Hunter, HMS Trinidad (but most likely Kreisläufer (circlerunner) torpedo fired by Trinidad which returned, Norwegian DD Svenner, HMAS Sydney, USS Meredith, or the ships sunk by Uboats...), only beaten by the Japanese (Savo island, Tassafaronga).
So I think we should add boni resp. mali for the units:
German DD: Artilleristic superior to British and partly also US DD, Z 1936 A and A mob classes were bad sea going. Torpedoes very good.
British DD: Artilleristic inferior to many other DDs. Torpedo use good, although seldomly used...
US DD: Artilleristic good to excellent, on the same level with Japan. Partly inferiror to German DD. And although more torpedo tubes very bad use and many duds.
Japanese DD: Artilleristic on the same level than US, but no good Radar, like the Germans. However outstanding torpedoes.
German Torpedoboote: German bird of prey and predator classes equal to British DD, as well as German type 1939 Fleet torpedo boats. type 1935 and 1937 had only 1 10,5 cm gun, so underarmed.
CL: mostly the same in Britain and US; British ships better torpedoes, US relied on artillery. German CL seldom used in sea combat (if ever), should have been able to attack a Washington type CA and be winner. Japanese CL: Not good artillery but outstanding torpedoes.
CA: Japanese CA with good artillery and outstanding torpedoes. German CA outstanding armour, speed, artillery, very good torpedoes. UK CA much more inferiror due to age and worse artillery. US CA very good artillery but still lacking in good torpedoes, only artillery fight. In first battles dramatically inferiror to Japanese ships (Savo island, Tassafaronga), later better (Kaiserin Auguste Bay).


Adler

 

[LBPB]

Mid 1941 Japan - The turning of the war (part 2)


1) The reorganization of the Japanese army has take some time in south west China. The first assault wave sent by the allieds has been finally repelled, but a second even more powerful is entering the territory
An other part of my army is alway stuck in French Indochina. Hanoi as been retaked and my troops are fastly moving to Saigon, but the French have proved to be thought fighters, and I'm lacking of offensive units to finish them off
-> I'm not in really troubles here since I've got enought reenforcements coming from the Manchukuo. The plan is to finish off the french as soon as possible to return all my might against the others allieds in West China.

2) My attack on Singapor seems hopeless, since the British are rearming too fast !
-> I must decide what to do with the 20 bombers currently on this operation. Should I relocate them somewhere else where they could be valuable ? Or should I better continu to bomb every new British bomber sent in the city each turn, because this will drag some of their overall resources here, and it could be a too dangerous base of operations against my greatly needed cities in Java ?

3) Even the Dutchs are back in the operations !
They've landed troops (flamesthrowers, etc..) in Borneo but I've repelled them.
-> I must finish off their city of Batavia as soon as possible but I've got currently no troops to spare in that operation...

4) I'm equally always stuck on the Solomons Islands. I've got an impressive force here (6 YamatoC, 3 full Carriers C3, and numérous support ships and Heavy Cruisers), and it is impossible to clear the city because news Australians troops and planes are appearing all turns !
-> I'm thinking of bypassing this untakable island, and go for a direct hit on Australia. I've already sent some light ships to recon and preprepare the terrain (draging the sea in search of possible submarines by my destroyers and cutting the Australian coastal network roads with some cruisers).

5) The Americans have once more **** me (by using the cheating passage in Arctic Ocean, see my previous post). So, once more appearing from nowhere... with a nice fleet they sunk my defense fleet (3 ships) near Japan coasts and land one more time in Hokkaido with two landing barge full of marines !
-> This is annoying ! I have mobilized enought forces to stop them, but to success in killing them all, it will take some serious time...
The worst, is that I made a terrible mistake in willing definitively crushing the US fleet near Japan. I've recalled both the Northern (currently in Alaska) and the Eastern (near Californian coast) fleets in Japan...
So the US did have much more troops and ships than I though, they have mount a quick task force, and landed in Hawaii and recaptured the city . How stupid am I to left the sea near Hawaii undefended...
In fact, their landing in Hokkaido appeared quickly to be only an diversion ! They want to reget all the pacific islands...
So I'm wondering what to do since my two fleets are in the middle of the way in the Pacific Ocean... return to Japan as initialy planned or go to Hawaii ???

 

[KristiB]

France - v1.3 - Sid

Week 37 - 38, 1939:

We take Madrid and destroy the Spainards. We see that the Germans took Brussles but didn't reinforce so we take Brussels and move in strong defensive units. Not sure if we can hold it but if it looks like we are going to be booted out, we'll raze the city... In the east, the Germans have YET to take a single Polish city so until they do, we should be ok. We're still just building power plants but are drafting as fast as we can.

A small infantry mass is now approaching Tripoli but I hesitate to risk the troops on a city assault...

In the Med, I'm pretty much just staying out of the way and letting the Italians and British slug it out. We're still based in our ports and only picking off subs and destroyers as they pass near our forces. We're slowly wearing down the Italian Air Force as they are losing 3 or 4 bombers per turn to our destroyer air defense in the cities.

 

[Snorken]

Germany had in 1940 also a "Torpedo Krise", but they found fastly a solution. Nevertheless some German ships were sunk because their torpedoes were dud and the enemy could sink them. Later no problems occured and the German use of torpedoes was excellent (sinking HMS Edinburgh, HMS Charybdis, HMS Limbourne, Norwegian CDS Norge and sister ship, HMS Hardy, HMS Hunter, HMS Trinidad (but most likely Kreisläufer (circlerunner) torpedo fired by Trinidad which returned, Norwegian DD Svenner, HMAS Sydney, USS Meredith, or the ships sunk by Uboats...), only beaten by the Japanese (Savo island, Tassafaronga).

I thought the HMAS Sydney was sunk by the Auxiliary Cruiser Komoran's guns...

 

[Rocoteh]

LBPB,

"Anyway in China, my frontline was made of approx 20 troops divisions, 8 armoured divisions, backuped by 12 artillery divisions and 8 bombers squads, and the Frenchs still broke it" LBPB

Very strange! AI seldom acts like this.

"The allieds are replacing their equipments at an crazy rate !
For exemple, it will be about 10 months yet, that I'm bombing Singapor and Solmons Islands non-stop, killing each turn approx 4 bombers and 1 fighters, and they are replaced within a week !!!" LBPB

Again:This playtest differ much from most others I have followed.

"2)For the US ships, I'm now understanding from where they are comming from !
The came from the East US coast !!!
They are using the northern passage in arctic sea, and this should be impossible (that's annoying, but you said you'll fix that)." LBPB

It have been fixed in version 1.4.

"A3)lso I think you should probably split up the Commonwealth countries..."
LBPB

I do not think its a good idea for these reasons:

It would make the British situation even harder. I think AI, for example
would not handle a independent Australia well.

1939 Australia had 7 million in population. Canada had 11 million.
As independent Civs they would not have been strong.
I say would have since they were parts of the British Empire.
If the game-engine had been more advanced, I would have been
positive to have for example Australia as a semi-independent Civ.

"-> I'm not in really troubles here since I've got enought reenforcements coming from the Manchukuo. The plan is to finish off the french as soon as possible to return all my might against the others allieds in West China."
LBPB

Sounds like a good plan.

"2) My attack on Singapor seems hopeless, since the British are rearming too fast !
-> I must decide what to do with the 20 bombers currently on this operation. Should I relocate them somewhere else where they could be valuable ? Or should I better continu to bomb every new British bomber sent in the city each turn, because this will drag some of their overall resources here, and it could be a too dangerous base of operations against my greatly needed cities in Java ?" LBPB

I would continue the attack

"5) The Americans have once more **** me (by using the cheating passage in Arctic Ocean, see my previous post). So, once more appearing from nowhere... with a nice fleet they sunk my defense fleet (3 ships) near Japan coasts and land one more time in Hokkaido with two landing barge full of marines ! " LBPB

Again,this will be impossible in 1.4. Hopefully it will create a better
play-balance.

"In fact, their landing in Hokkaido appeared quickly to be only an diversion ! They want to reget all the pacific islands...
So I'm wondering what to do since my two fleets are in the middle of the way in the Pacific Ocean... return to Japan as initialy planned or go to Hawaii ???"
LBPB

I would return to Japan.

Thank you and welcome back.

Rocoteh

 

[Adler17]

The Kormoran fired also two torpedoes into the ship, which left the battlefield burning and sinking. So I think the torpedoes finished the job. However the HMAS Sydney is still missing so I could be wrong...

Adler

 

[Rocoteh]

France - v1.3 - Sid

Week 37 - 38, 1939:

We take Madrid and destroy the Spainards. We see that the Germans took Brussles but didn't reinforce so we take Brussels and move in strong defensive units. Not sure if we can hold it but if it looks like we are going to be booted out, we'll raze the city... In the east, the Germans have YET to take a single Polish city so until they do, we should be ok. We're still just building power plants but are drafting as fast as we can.

A small infantry mass is now approaching Tripoli but I hesitate to risk the troops on a city assault...

In the Med, I'm pretty much just staying out of the way and letting the Italians and British slug it out. We're still based in our ports and only picking off subs and destroyers as they pass near our forces. We're slowly wearing down the Italian Air Force as they are losing 3 or 4 bombers per turn to our destroyer air defense in the cities.

KristiB,

France should be very hard to play on this level!

I am looking forward to see if you can repeat the incredible
results you achieved as Argentina.

Thank you and welcome back.

Rocoteh

 

[Snorken]

The Kormoran fired also two torpedoes into the ship, which left the battlefield burning and sinking. So I think the torpedoes finished the job. However the HMAS Sydney is still missing so I could be wrong...

Adler

Ok, you probably know more about that then me, since your German...

Oh, BTW... 600th post!

 

[vlad1917_a]

France - v1.3 - Sid

Week 37 - 38, 1939:

We take Madrid and destroy the Spainards. We see that the Germans took Brussles but didn't reinforce so we take Brussels and move in strong defensive units. Not sure if we can hold it but if it looks like we are going to be booted out, we'll raze the city... In the east, the Germans have YET to take a single Polish city so until they do, we should be ok. We're still just building power plants but are drafting as fast as we can.

A small infantry mass is now approaching Tripoli but I hesitate to risk the troops on a city assault...

In the Med, I'm pretty much just staying out of the way and letting the Italians and British slug it out. We're still based in our ports and only picking off subs and destroyers as they pass near our forces. We're slowly wearing down the Italian Air Force as they are losing 3 or 4 bombers per turn to our destroyer air defense in the cities.

Cool. I am also playing France SID. I have use my bombers and navy to concuer Spain. But I was afrade attack germans because I have put my forces against itally.

Well I have build the factories on first atempt but then Germans just bomb it out. So I stick all my town production to airport 1 turn then buy, aa battery 1 turn then buy, temple....

Any way do not reserch any thing. All money using to buy everything.

I have concuer most of ittalian cites.
Good luck.

 

[Rocoteh]

Germany had in 1940 also a "Torpedo Krise", but they found fastly a solution. Nevertheless some German ships were sunk because their torpedoes were dud and the enemy could sink them. Later no problems occured and the German use of torpedoes was excellent (sinking HMS Edinburgh, HMS Charybdis, HMS Limbourne, Norwegian CDS Norge and sister ship, HMS Hardy, HMS Hunter, HMS Trinidad (but most likely Kreisläufer (circlerunner) torpedo fired by Trinidad which returned, Norwegian DD Svenner, HMAS Sydney, USS Meredith, or the ships sunk by Uboats...), only beaten by the Japanese (Savo island, Tassafaronga).
So I think we should add boni resp. mali for the units:
German DD: Artilleristic superior to British and partly also US DD, Z 1936 A and A mob classes were bad sea going. Torpedoes very good.
British DD: Artilleristic inferior to many other DDs. Torpedo use good, although seldomly used...
US DD: Artilleristic good to excellent, on the same level with Japan. Partly inferiror to German DD. And although more torpedo tubes very bad use and many duds.
Japanese DD: Artilleristic on the same level than US, but no good Radar, like the Germans. However outstanding torpedoes.
German Torpedoboote: German bird of prey and predator classes equal to British DD, as well as German type 1939 Fleet torpedo boats. type 1935 and 1937 had only 1 10,5 cm gun, so underarmed.
CL: mostly the same in Britain and US; British ships better torpedoes, US relied on artillery. German CL seldom used in sea combat (if ever), should have been able to attack a Washington type CA and be winner. Japanese CL: Not good artillery but outstanding torpedoes.
CA: Japanese CA with good artillery and outstanding torpedoes. German CA outstanding armour, speed, artillery, very good torpedoes. UK CA much more inferiror due to age and worse artillery. US CA very good artillery but still lacking in good torpedoes, only artillery fight. In first battles dramatically inferiror to Japanese ships (Savo island, Tassafaronga), later better (Kaiserin Auguste Bay).


Adler

Adler,

Thank you for your comments. They are very interesting.
The changes you propose above will probably be a question for 1.5
due to lack of time.

I have spend yesterday and today with new research and work
on a new Order of Battle for USA destroyers.

It will include the some 80 US destroyers from the reserve.
These ships are not present in version 1.3.

In 1.4 they will be rated as WW1-destroyers, less powerful than
standard destroyers.

Type IX will still have the blitz, but I am considering to remove it from
Type VII. That, in combination with the added WW1-destroyers should
result in play-balance with regard to the Battle of the Atlantic.

Rocoteh

 

[Adler17]

PC turn week 29:
I lost a Uboat in the Pacific to US subs. The Hindenburg, my 4th Bismarck class BB is ready.

Week 30:
My LAH SS takes the new Soviet Capital Avam after the defenders are bombed by artillery. A rare example of a classical attack... By this attack a new leader emerged. He is used to build an army in Berlin to form my first army with Pz IIIg. Pokhodsk is the next town taken. Olyutorskoye is also mine, damaged U 110 runs into the port. And also Kamchatsk. With Kamchatka mine the Soviets have only North Sachalin. But in 5 turns my airport in Khabarowsk is ready then the Soviets will be eradicted as well as the Amis in Toyohara.
U 64 sinks the US sub which sank my Uboat. U 103 attacks the main stack of the USN: 10 BB and 8 CA. Hmm I have en route 5 BB, 7 CA, 4 CL, 2 CV, 13 DD, 2 SS. I have to make an air strike first to weaken the enemy... USS Minneapolis is history. Before the Battle Of The Pacific I will also use my Uboats en route...
In Africa Bretonnet falls. Also Tabora is mine. With that town mine the first town of the former German East Africa is liberated from the tyrannic rule of these barbarian "Tommies" . Bamako is no longer French. And the new French capital Dakar is no longer the ne French capital. Marrakesh is mine.

I will now cease my posting here for, I hope so, only a few days. Wednesday I should be online again.

Adler

 

[Adler17]

Rocoteh, I think that will be a good compromise. However Uboat yard should build then a type VII each turn and a type IX every 2. Also will you introduce the German and Italian torpedo boats?
Until Wednesday.

Adler

 

[KristiB]

Yeah, I'm not sure yet if I'm comfortable going over to the offensive although Milan is sure looking inviting. With Poland now destroyed, we're going to have the entire weight of the Luftwaffe coming down on us and they already have started. Brussels has become untenable and we razed it after pulling out all troops in week 41.

And yes, I have tech set at the lowest level as always in the first 40 turns of this scenario. Show me the money!

 

[andis-1]

When is the new version coming? just thinking if i have enought time to start new playtest....

 

[Rocoteh]

Rocoteh, I think that will be a good compromise. However Uboat yard should build then a type VII each turn and a type IX every 2. Also will you introduce the German and Italian torpedo boats?
Until Wednesday.

Adler

Adler,

Yes, that sounds good.

I will introduce the German torpedo boats.
They were de facto destroyers.

Thank you and welcome back.

Rocoteh

 

[Rocoteh]

When is the new version coming? just thinking if i have enought time to start new playtest....

andis-1,

New research and the work that it means when it comes to
new OOB:s is very time-consuming.

I think it will take 2 weeks at least.

Rocoteh