Your Experience Starting New Game with Spring 2017 Patch

[MadDjinn]

I will try this. I am also considering the possibility that they just made continents more massive (and I am playing on a huge map) but I've played on huge maps before and never seen a continent this big.

the script that creates the 'continents' can be really screwy sometimes. It's not always good at making properly sized continents, or in the case of islands, ensuring that a landmass is entirely one continent.

 

[chazzycat]

I'm a little late to the party but finally got my hands on the patch...from my first game I'm feeling good about it. The AI seems a lot more competent to be honest. I am on King (was on emperor/immortal before) and still way behind most of the AI after 100 turns.

 

[Victoria]

but even if her focus was culture you would expect her to focus on other things first.

yeah but there is weighting that can just be unlucky. Just playing one game is your choice sir, I personally suspect if you play a couple more you will come across a better challenge. To be fair if you are a competent early rusher ou are least likely to be impressed because You are militarily outbuilding most civs quite quickly anyway. But yes, they should switch over when they get the gist.

 

[Futumch]

I'm just loading a game where I'm playing as Cyrus. While I was waiting for the game to load, it occurred to me that his wrist guards look like he has strapped a couple of iphones or samsung galaxy devices to his wrists : )

 

[Babarigo]

I am playing with the AI+ mod on continents and the AI is quite better than at the launch. I remember that on Immortal difficulty that I had the highest score by turn 120 and now on Emperor I am more in the middle of the score board. The AI also expands a lot more than before where in 250 turns most civs had 5 cities even if there was plenty of empty space. Basically I have the feeling that the AI builds more cities and more units and is more aggresive. Sadly the AI is still terrible at handling district placement. I know that it's probably hard to make the optimal choices like a human player would do but there are basic things such as placing in a triangle formation the city, the commercial district and the harbor that I almost never see.

I have also played on Island Plates Empreror difficulty and my feedback is negative for this map type. The AI barely builds cities and most of the time half of the island is empty even by turn 200. Has anyone experienced a noticably worse AI performance on Island Plates? I would like to know if it's from the game or from the AI+ mod to give feedback the the author of the mod.

 

[gettingfat]

I've got -21 diplomacy rating from that "different government". Can someone tell me if it is a bug or what? I'm playing on TSL earth, epic speed, immortal level.

 

[Piruparka]

Why would that be a bug? There is this diplomatic modifier that varies based on your government, and sometimes it may weigh higher than in the previous games, based on the civ's agenda, I think. So even though I agree that this is a rather high value, I do not think that would be a bug.

 

[Victoria]

I've got -21 diplomacy rating from that "different government". Can someone tell me if it is a bug or what? I'm playing on TSL earth, epic speed, immortal level.

I do not know if it is a bug but I am certainly seeing it in the modern age +.

I suspect the modifier is similar or the same as the tourism one. 21 is a jolly lot of anger to contend with, thats a whole war of warmonger points if you war carefully.

Personally at this stage I Would suggest its not.... Was it facism vs merchant republic?

 

[Tacgnol]

I'm just loading a game where I'm playing as Cyrus. While I was waiting for the game to load, it occurred to me that his wrist guards look like he has strapped a couple of iphones or samsung galaxy devices to his wrists : )

LOL that's one of those things you cannot un-see

I've got -21 diplomacy rating from that "different government". Can someone tell me if it is a bug or what? I'm playing on TSL earth, epic speed, immortal level.

The Ideologue agenda I believe.

It's really frustrating. The AI seems to have no strategy with their government, they swap around a lot and they seem to prefer Fascism (don't think I've ever seen one use Communism) so going for a CV and using Democracy, you are stuck having them hate you with nothing you can do about it. It's one of the most obnoxious agendas, probably the worst of the secondary ones, occasionally they'll switch to your government for a few dozen turns and you'll get an arbitrary diplomacy bonus but once they switch again they hate you so much any deals you've made will just fade away.

 

[gettingfat]

I do not know if it is a bug but I am certainly seeing it in the modern age +.

I suspect the modifier is similar or the same as the tourism one. 21 is a jolly lot of anger to contend with, thats a whole war of warmonger points if you war carefully.

Personally at this stage I Would suggest its not.... Was it facism vs democracy?

It's not modern age. I switched from monarchy to theocracy, then very quickly Poland and Greek (Pericles) both turned from friendly to unfriendly. Alex was better and still had -17.

Even -17 is insane considering favorable trade and same religion only give something around +5. So I worked hard to play a peaceful game and just one negative modifier ruined everything?

 

[Victoria]

The secondary agenda does seem to rule the nest and ideologue is just crazy. Certainly a civ to avoid.
I am seeing catherines real benefit is seeing these agenda's early to forge the right bonds.

 

[upi00r]

It's not modern age. I switched from monarchy to theocracy, then very quickly Poland and Greek (Pericles) both turned from friendly to unfriendly. Alex was better and still had -17.

Even -17 is insane considering favorable trade and same religion only give something around +5. So I worked hard to play a peaceful game and just one negative modifier ruined everything?

Relations with Poland as Persia:
+5 embassy
+18 ally
+9 declared friend
-15 different governments
+2 friendly meeting
+8 for faith generation
-6 they dislike your approach to governing

And what the hell is 'they dislike your approach to governing'? Cuz it seems like these two are related but what exactly it is? At least they changed they gov type to the one I had (twice) so we were allies almost all the time from the middle of the game till the end when others were angry at me like forever...

 

[Victoria]

They are the same, idealogue is just stupid, it seems to roughly triple the different government as well as give the standard -6 ... seems just stupidly OTT and does break diplomacy beng fun a bit

You just have to accept that an ideologue will be a pain and is best just to cope with as best as you can, every other civ dislikes them as well so denouncing them helps with other civs. I do hope they fix this stupidity as most secondary agendas swing +/- 6 while this one effectively swings roughly +12 to -25

Not sure why others were angry at you @upi00r , unlikely anything to do with this modifier unless its because you chose to be mates with a mad person... That makes you crazy or desparate.

 

[upi00r]

I guess it was because some of them allied with Cleo and I took all her cities except one... Though it was early game and she was complaining how weak and pathetic I was so I showed her she was wrong. But sometimes it's even more stupid. A few turns after I had a peace deal with Russia Peter became friendly...

Also sometimes 'they dislike your approach to governing' modifier goes with 'different governments' modifier and sometimes there is only 'different governments' modifier... Don't get it.
BTW: do penalty for spying on someone and modifier for kept or broken promises are decreased over time (or go away)?

Also it seems there is no warmongering penalty for relations with a civ that lost a city to you. And there is no difference if you are a friend with a civ or they hate you - you get the same warmongering penalty. Only matters if a civ is a friend (higher penalty) or hates (lower penalty) the civ you are at war with.

 

[Victoria]

Every civ has a primary and a secondary agenda. The approach to governing modifier only happens with the idealogue secondary agenda which only one or two civs will have. (Ranmdom generation at start) There is a similar one with government happiness.

So the promise ones decrease typically 1 point every 15 but often they are tied to a 30 turn promise so only decrease when done. Broken ones degrade immediately 1/15. They have differing values for different promises. One interesting thing with broken promises are they are an immediate reason for a formal war.

There is a -18 for "you occupy one of their cities" and after some checking for @nzcamel it does not appear to degrade at all. However there is a way around it. You attack civ A and take 4 cities including the capital, you give 2 back to lower you warmongering points, keep the capital and give a city that is close to your army to your next target. You then declare a formal/joint/ casus war against civ B (surprise war warmongering points are your own stupid fault) and take the city you gave to them back and liberate it back to civ A. The -18 disaapears and instead you get a +20 for liberating one of their cities and you get +5 with every other civ for liberating a city (not stackable). Yiu then rinse and repeat the same process until every civ you have attavked but you last has +25 instead of -18.

DO NOT raze any city, this replaces the -18 with a -20 you cannot remove and does not seem to degrade.

As warmonger points degrade 1/2 turns from the moment the war starts they soon disappear so sometimes declaring war early can get rid of them early and as long as you do not raise cities and ideally loot their ground and get cities in peace deals and give back ones you took apart from the capital everyone will be your ally by the end of the game. A peaceful world with you in charge.

For the peaceful players out there, it is fine to retaliate as long as you accept that ghandi will hate you with -8 for the rest of the game (you can couteract with positives) and that you will get some short term warmongering unless you take and keep a city. You are better to raise their lands and ask for the city in a peace deal. Each mine give you +25 science, a shame in some ways they do not build more of them.

@upi00r allies seem to get a little less warmongering points but I have not tested this well get. However if you fight a jointvwar with someone they will not consider warmonger points against you.

 

[nzcamel]

I'm just loading a game where I'm playing as Cyrus. While I was waiting for the game to load, it occurred to me that his wrist guards look like he has strapped a couple of iphones or samsung galaxy devices to his wrists : )

And that symbol all over his gown looks like a stripped back Macedonian sun

I guess it was because some of them allied with Cleo and I took all her cities except one... Though it was early game and she was complaining how weak and pathetic I was so I showed her she was wrong. But sometimes it's even more stupid. A few turns after I had a peace deal with Russia Peter became friendly...

That'll do it. Your example puts the game in a great light

There is a -18 for "you occupy one of their cities" and after some checking for @nzcamel it does not appear to degrade at all.

Is there any difference that you have found between a ceded city and a non ceded city?

 

[upi00r]

There is a -18 for "you occupy one of their cities" and after some checking for @nzcamel it does not appear to degrade at all. However there is a way around it. You attack civ A and take 4 cities including the capital, you give 2 back to lower you warmongering points, keep the capital and give a city that is close to your army to your next target. You then declare a formal/joint/ casus war against civ B (surprise war warmongering points are your own stupid fault) and take the city you gave to them back and liberate it back to civ A. The -18 disaapears and instead you get a +20 for liberating one of their cities and you get +5 with every other civ for liberating a city (not stackable). Yiu then rinse and repeat the same process until every civ you have attavked but you last has +25 instead of -18.

DO NOT raze any city, this replaces the -18 with a -20 you cannot remove and does not seem to degrade.

As warmonger points degrade 1/2 turns from the moment the war starts they soon disappear so sometimes declaring war early can get rid of them early and as long as you do not raise cities and ideally loot their ground and get cities in peace deals and give back ones you took apart from the capital everyone will be your ally by the end of the game. A peaceful world with you in charge.

For the peaceful players out there, it is fine to retaliate as long as you accept that ghandi will hate you with -8 for the rest of the game (you can couteract with positives) and that you will get some short term warmongering unless you take and keep a city. You are better to raise their lands and ask for the city in a peace deal. Each mine give you +25 science, a shame in some ways they do not build more of them.

I mostly know that but it's kinda lame so I prefer not to use it. I don't get the mine thing though. How exactly does it work?

@upi00r allies seem to get a little less warmongering points but I have not tested this well get. However if you fight a jointvwar with someone they will not consider warmonger points against you.

Not for me. Both an ally and a 'hater' of mine got the same value. The difference was there for allies and 'haters' of the civ I was at war.

 

[Victoria]

Good to know @upi00r its a bugger working out all the warmonger stuff, anyone know if its been done already? And yes that trick is pretty lame because it is OP but the -18 never degrading is a bit dumb IMO.

@nzcamel I am still looking for a difference but I just find 0, nada, nicht. Its infuriating, there must be surely.

 

[nzcamel]

@nzcamel I am still looking for a difference but I just find 0, nada, nicht. Its infuriating, there must be surely.

 

[Bleser]

I'm a little late to the party but finally got my hands on the patch...from my first game I'm feeling good about it. The AI seems a lot more competent to be honest. I am on King (was on emperor/immortal before) and still way behind most of the AI after 100 turns.

I agree after now starting & finishing a game on this patch that the AI is better at keeping up with science, but from my Immortal game they still have zero priority on building units. The AI will declare war on me and then just never show up... or send one lone cavalry army that I pick off as it runs around aimlessly.

If I bring the fight to them, there is nothing to fight... except encampments and cities, which by the time you get observation balloons and artillery are effectively defenseless.

It's been out about six months and this game is still NOT HARD. Civ has always managed to be hard in the past (seeing that surprise invasion armada show up at your continent in Civ5 was great, and you always had to be prepared for it). Biggest let down so far, even with all of its potential and other areas of strength.

Cheers, and I sincerely hope the ability for this AI to prioritize what it is doing and assemble armies is high on the backlog.