.01 - Guerrillas!

dot · Aug 4, 2007

Well, you all know how the RNG tends to spoil your odds. Like 99% Scientist and 0% Artist ... And what do you get? Hell, yes, an artist. I'd like to keep my genepools clean. Especially those that yield Great Engineers - since they are rare anyways. If we decide to go for the Great Wall or the Mids I'd like to make that City the Engineer City.

That means this city will only build wonders that add to GE Points (The Great Wall, The Mids, The Hanging Gardens, The Hagia Sophia, The Three Gorges Dam).
As far as national wonders are concerned it would be Ironworks and West Point. So the GE City would be a Military producer in the late game. Maybe add a Military Academy if possible.

I just like Engineers. I find them really handy when in need to rush a wonder.

So far. Any comments?

dot · Aug 4, 2007

bobrath said:
Yes, this is a skip until I end my sojurn in the wonderful faderland (?). I'd love to jump in, but packing and getting ready will take far more of my time this weekend then I have to offer.

Dot, any suggested phrases or ideas I should have as I fly into Frankfurt and work about 20 minutes away?

GreyFox said:
Ein weiteres Bier

Vaterland?

"Ein weiteres Bier" is pretty important! Prost!
So where are you working if you're allowed and willing to tell (PM if you prefer). Heidelberg is always worth a short trip. Depending on whether you're N, E, S or W of Frankfurt travelling time might vary from 45 minutes to 90 minutes. And don't visit the castle. Every tourist runs there. :suicide: If you'd like to have a good view over the town and the castle too, take the "Philosophenweg". Way better! But did you have anything special on your mind when asking?
I've been thinking about coming up to Frankfurt, but that's 4 hours by train one way. So that is not doable during the week. Sorry.

| ... Back on topic ... |

GreyFox said:
With coper in our BFC, that means we can stick to our original plans of settling the northwest as Crotazzo proposed.

We should forget abt the barracks (the barbs are giving us the needed XPs), and perhaps build us the monument (reduce 750 pop by 7 turns) or even the monastery. After that a settler so that we can sneak out as soon as an opening present itself.

Settling Northwest might be ok. It depends on how fast we can get the stone hooked up.
Forgetting about the barracks: OK with me for some time.
Forgetting about the dun: No!

But I don't want to go the heavy Axeman route for two reasons.

As I've already said before ... Guerrilla Archers are really powerful on a highlands map. And we are charismatic, too! So Guerrilla Crossbows with Drill can give hell to almost any pre-gunpowder unit.
I'd rather like to see us build Gallic Swordsmen as soon as we're ready. They start with Guerrilla I from scratch. That could possibly give us Macemen with retreat odds of 30%.

As I've stated earlier (post #1) I'd like to test out the use of the UU and the UB in this game. So please Gentlemen, let's stick with it. Even if it means that we lose.

:cheers:

I've got it. Will play somewhen tonight and bring us back to an even number.

dot · Aug 4, 2007

One More Thing (TM):

Crotazzo, when you're posting pictures please scale them down to forum size. There's an option in photobucket adn imageshack to do so. So we don't have to scroll to see the full picture. Many thanx!

dot · Aug 5, 2007

Bibracte, Celtia, 1330 BC

Hello everybody. Turns played to turn 90. Here's the report.

>> Basics

Our last two Scouts died to a warrior and an archer.
We've lost an archer to an archer.
I missed out on a worker on turn 2 of my set because I didn't send him to work after BW was in. >> Please let's never fortify GP's or workers!
I've built Archer > Worker whipped > Archer > Monastry (chop rushed).

We're still alive and overall doing quite fine. Now here's some pics and thoughts.

>> Automated Citizens

On turn two I realized that the citizen automation has been on. I don't really trust the AI to do that properly. So I'd like to see automation and emphasize :food:

,

or

dicussed before being done. And if they are turned on I'd say let's mention this in our reports. What do you think about this?

>> Promotions

As the pic shows the Guerrilla III promotion is pretty useless unless we've chopped quite some of the forests as marked in the 2nd picture. So I was wrong there. For now. See under >> current production.

>> Religion

Judaism has been founded. Four turns later there's a revolution. So someone has two religions already. :eek:

>> Research

I ~~sticked~~ stuck with The Wheel. After that I picked masonry to unlock the dun, the Great Wall and the Mids. It's due in three. After masonry I'd say agriculture to get some Müsli. The alternative would be to pick up Poly >> Mono, revolt to OR and get the bonus for buildings. That will definitely come in handy for the GE wonders. So maybe it's rather that? Or one after the other? Please post your opinions, folks.

>> Current Production

On my last turn the monastry was built. So I picked an archer which would take four turns. But I think that we might as well wait with any more archers until the dun is built. Maybe a barracks would be nice after all? Or a missionary? I think that as soon as the dun is available we should go for it. Simply because we could have archers with four promotions @ 8XP. Please state what you think about it, gentlemen. Thanks in advance.

>> Foreign Affairs

Here is Ragnar

And HC and Nappy are really gonna like each other! I think if one get's Hindu or Juda we should help it that the other holds Buddhism. :evil:

>> Scowler, here's some info!

I've automated the worker west of Bibracte to built a road onto the Copper. He will finish the road on the turn after you've hit enter. Let the 2nd worker in Bibracte wait until the road is finished and then move him onto the copper to start mining! I don't doubt that you would've done that anyway but I just wanted to point it out.

>> About GE City

I've noticed something about dot or GE City. It is set on a rather long river. So if Ragnar is going to settle at one of the wells of the river and is picking up buddhism we might be able to train and hold our very own freak on a leash.

Feel free to delete the BFC I've drawn onto the map as soon as GE City is settled.

Greetings from a demilitarized world!

dot · Aug 5, 2007

Dot == Witnessed the death of three of our units and of uncounted barbs.
Scowler == UP!
Bobrath == Skipped because of duty in the Vaterland.
GreyFox == On deck.
Crotazzo == :coffee:

GreyFox · Aug 5, 2007

I was never one who used city automation ... the only button I ever click on the city governor screen is "Avoid Growth".

While having a GE city is nice and all that, I think it's way overboard to discuss about it right now. Let's focus on getting our settling party out first. Speaking on concentrating on GE wonders all the way to 3GD and Ironworks at this stage is like counting your chicken before the egg from which the great-grandparent of their mama hen came from is even laid.

I would go monotheism, although not very useful with one city only. But it allows faster religion spread.

Production wise I would build anything, and switch to another worker after growth.

Crotazzo · Aug 5, 2007

IMO we shouldn't whait too long to aim for the walls, and i dont think that our second city would make a good ironworks city in the future..
I really think we should build the wonders in our capital, because the second city doesnt have much wood to chop, and luckly we will get one 100% great engeneer before we can give good use to the shrine. Eitherway Bibracte will always have bad gene pools, as we probably need to hire some scientist there plus the shrine.
We will probably have better results concentrating all GP's in our capital, as many cities in this kind of map wont have the necesary food to compete in getting a GP.
I liek to have my genepools clean too, specially for GEs, but in this case we might loose both wonders if we aim for that.

bobrath · Aug 6, 2007

(writing from Bad Soden in Germany).

While its a "nice to have" to have clean gene pools - I don't see that GEs will be a game breaker or maker.

More important at this stage (as others have stated) will be to get our economy started (and secured). Along with that will be encouraging the religious spread.

Looks good though all.

Scowler · Aug 6, 2007

Sorry, but I probably won't be able to get to this today (I'll post a pickup if I can after all). If you don't mind waiting until tomorrow then I'll most likely play then; otherwise the next player should feel free to collect the save.

Scowler · Aug 8, 2007

An additional comment about automation: dot mentioned that his worker was building a road leading to the copper. That's fine. What I didn't realise at first is that he actually meant continue autoroading onto the copper tile itself. This is sub-optimal (in my opinion): our priority should be to get the mine producing hammers ASAP and having one worker building a road instead delays this by at least a turn. In addition, our suggested build orders include a dun, a settler, and a worker - none of which require copper - so it is not critical that the copper be immediately connected. The workers could also do some chopping first - and that is how I set things up. As of the end of my turnset the copper is still unconnected, but this should not be left much longer, as barb axemen will no doubt soon be abroad.

An archer was already set up so I let him finish, allowing the city to grow. Then I started a worker and chopped him, followed by a settler who will be ready in 5 turns. Techwise, I chose the path towards Monotheism.

I swapped around a couple of the archers to take better advantage of their promotions. I sent one of the unpromoted archers onto the new city site to start fortifying ready for the settler. However, this could be moved back to help with barbs, pick up promotions, etc., as desired:

Something that the autolog doesn't show:

Or, as one well-known forum member might express it: :gripe:

Time for Plan B (whatever that may be . . . )

Immediate goals are probably to get the new city founded, defended and connected, and build a dun and some more units. Do we also want to re-evaluate our tech path with the loss of the GW?

Spoiler autolog :

Final comment for the dot: is your turn counter set correctly? My first turn was apparently turn 89 and your previous turnset was 1 turn out as well. I played up to my turn 100 which is 1000 BC and therefore seems correct.

GreyFox · Aug 8, 2007

Too bad abt the walls. It was really a long shot anyway. If one Civ had the stones or industrious trait, it will be gone.

Who's up?

Crotazzo · Aug 9, 2007

well.. no early wonder for us...
IMO our research path should head directly to writing, maybe we can aim for the hanging gardens..
The fact is that we need reaserch asap, all AIs have 2 or 3 cities, so they are overteching us

dot · Aug 9, 2007

GreyFox said:
Who's up?

You!

Edit: Because bob is still on autoskip. But he might well grab it after you if he wants to. /Edit

I'm not sure whether or not me might need to rethink our techpath / strategy. If I don't post anything about it within the next three hours --- just grab it!

GreyFox · Aug 9, 2007

Opps ... sorry!!! Didn't realize I'm up. Got it.

GreyFox · Aug 9, 2007

Too engrossed in engaging the barbies ... lost track and played 15 turns instead. Sorry about that.

Anyway, short term objective achieved:

Noticed that I swapped the tech to agriculture. We have a wheats field sitting there doing nothing, Monotheism is still 20 turns away. So getting the agriculture first would be better, plus we could use one more farm in Vienne.

Anyway, as predicted by Scowler (or some would replace the word "predicted" with "jinxed"), Mattel Inc released the latest barbie, now outfitted with an axe instead of bows and arrows.

Our archers prevailed (but one lucky shot from a barb archer killed one of ours :aargh:

), and the good news it is possible to promote one of them to guerrilla 3. I leave it to the next player to decide whether to pursue it (don't see why not).

There are, as usual, barbs activities when you open up the save.

One in the north, I expected it go for the city, but it instead moved to the plains, apparently attracted by the worker who is roading towards the stones. I have an axe covering him now.

Speaking of stones, do we want to continue pursuing the Pyramids? If not, no point in spending precious worker turns connecting the stones.

The other two barbs are in the south, still 2 turns away to be causing any danger.

>>> The Save (775BC) <<<

Spoiler :

dot · Aug 10, 2007

dot said:
...
[...] And I'd appreciate to see all our turn reports ending with such a picture post card with the save. Do you agree?
...

Would you mind putting a postcard at the end of your report, GreyFox? With the save linked within the postcard? Just for aesthetics.

And it has been a whooping fast got it and play. So, thanks for that. :thumbsup:

Scowler said:
Final comment for the dot: is your turn counter set correctly? My first turn was apparently turn 89 and your previous turnset was 1 turn out as well. I played up to my turn 100 which is 1000 BC and therefore seems correct.

Well, I ended on my last turn, which I thought would need to be uneven. So you just have to hit enter to play your first turn. But if we play it the other way round - which is making some sense to me now - :cool:

.

GreyFox said:
Too engrossed in engaging the barbies ... lost track and played 15 turns instead. Sorry about that.

That's ok. So bob or crotazzo could play 15 too, to get us even again.

Speaking of stones, do we want to continue pursuing the Pyramids? If not, no point in spending precious worker turns connecting the stones. [...]

Crotazzo said:
well.. no early wonder for us...
IMO our research path should head directly to writing, maybe we can aim for the hanging gardens..
The fact is that we need reaserch asap, all AIs have 2 or 3 cities, so they are overteching us

Ja, that's the question. IMHO the mids are nice because of the three extra :science:

per specialist from early representation. But our problem is, that we don't have enough food to supply a lot of specialists any time soon. So, there's only three decent reasons, that I could see:

Culture.
GE points.
Denying the mids to others.

A) I'm not sure whether or not we'd be better off to go for infrastructure and military build-up instead.
B) The stone is still helpful for the duns and possibly for the HG. Crotazzo, I think your point is, that they not only add to the GE pool but that they'll allow a decent pop boost if we settle a couple of cities just before completion. Did I get that right? If we'd like to try that we'd need the stone anyways and then we should give the mids a try, too.
C) I'm pretty sure that we should settle dot sooner rather than later. It could be a nice commerce city. And - imho - we need that rather urgently.

I'd like to have some replies/input on A), B) and C) before the next turnset is played, folks!

:thanx:

GreyFox · Aug 10, 2007

Didn't notice the "postcard" requirement ... will do it next time.

(A) It's definitely more military, with a few infrastructure build here and then.

(B) I don't care either way. I can play with the mids and can pay without the mids.

(C) Sorry, no idea where blue dot is

Crotazzo · Aug 10, 2007

A) We need a few more military to expand propertly... after rushing a few axeman the raging barbs seem to settle down and stop attacking.
B) If we aim for the mids we will probably want to run an SE, i think our capital can make a great GPP producer. Blue dot will do good for a commerce city. I dont know about AI production times, but if we want the mids we will have to rush it right now. The gardens will really help in this kind of map, as we dont have many food resources in our planned cities.
C) Blue dot is a great spot, no doubt about it. When we expand we will have economic dificulties, thats why i think we should tech straight to writing and trade the remaining ones (monotheism will help a lot for the myds though).
We probably need to get some cottages here and there.

What's most important right now is deciding if we want the myds or not. We can think of a plan after that.

dot · Aug 11, 2007

Since bob didn't call in >> You're up for 15, Crotazzo.

So I'd say, yes, go on with the military build up, but put an emphasis on archers in cities with duns.

In other words, get that stone, try for the mids (in the new founded city ?) else go for military.
Techwise I'd say stick with mono for now. The +25% :hammers:

will be very welcome. :yup:

But that's just my thoughts. So they obviously can and must be vetoed if need be.

Enjoy playing!

Roster:

dot == On deck
Scowler == Under deck
bobrath == Not yet on board
GreyFox == Just off of duty!
Crotazzo == UP!

Crotazzo · Aug 11, 2007

great... will play tomorrow morning (around 16hrs from now)

Feedback for our plans are welcome till then.

.01 - Guerrillas!

crossing the i's

crossing the i's

crossing the i's

crossing the i's

crossing the i's

Make it so ...

Chieftain

Emperor

Mr. Understatement

Mr. Understatement

Make it so ...

Chieftain

crossing the i's

Make it so ...

Make it so ...

crossing the i's

Make it so ...

Chieftain

crossing the i's

Chieftain

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