3UC/4UC for VP: Project Coordination Thread

[pineappledan]

I think for now just stay with longbowman. If someone wants to make E&D compatible with what we have done there’s 2 options for England:

1. Change the reward from “can build longbowmen” to “get 3 longbowmen with 30 xp each”
2. Change the free new UU to redcoat and alter the event to make it later

What E & D has done does not appear to have been dictated by what made game sense, but by what was available. They re-added UCs not because it was meaningful, but because they were "on-hand", and while I can acknowledge that as a perfectly acceptable design choice, it's not one which has enough effort or care in its construction that it deserves the respect of being tip-toed around in your own creation.

My two cents.

 

[FieryCharizard7]

(v3) of the English 3/4UC mod is now up. The English Longbowmen are given the Agincourt promotion immediately though any unit can earn it after they get Accuracy/Barrage III (though I could change it to after they get Range as Agincourt seeks to balance off that power drop). The CS & RCS for the Longbowman was also tweaked as suggested.

I fixed the image issue as the files were named _064 instead of _64.

The remaining two issues are as follows:

1. The Crown Jewels will not show up as a free artifact even though they have been created and been assigned as a free artifact. If I give a generic single artifact, that works however.
   

   -- this works
   INSERT INTO Buildings     
   (Type,                            BuildingClass,    FreeArtifacts,
   SELECT        'BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER',    BuildingClass,    1,                 
   
   -- this doesn't work
   INSERT INTO Buildings     
               (Type,                            BuildingClass,    FreeArtifacts,
   SELECT        'BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER',    BuildingClass,    'GREAT_WORK_THE_CROWN_JEWELS',

2. The White Tower does not replace the Hermitage as an English UB nor can it be built after constructing a castle. I have copied the relevant code below:
   

   ------------------------------   
   -- Building_ClassesNeededInCity
   ------------------------------       
   INSERT INTO Building_ClassesNeededInCity     
               (BuildingType,                         BuildingClassType)
   VALUES        ('BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER',    'BUILDINGCLASS_CASTLE');   
   --==========================================================================================================================   
   
   --==========================================================================================================================   
   -- CIVILIZATIONS
   --==========================================================================================================================   
   --------------------------------   
   -- Civilization_BuildingClassOverrides
   --------------------------------       
   INSERT INTO Civilization_BuildingClassOverrides
           (CivilizationType,             BuildingClassType,                 BuildingType)
   VALUES    ('CIVILIZATION_ENGLAND',    'BUILDINGCLASS_HERMITAGE',        'BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER');
   --==========================================================================================================================
   --==========================================================================================================================

 

[adan_eslavo]

@FieryCharizard7 Try:

INSERT INTO Buildings
            (Type,                            BuildingClass,    FreeArtifacts,
VALUES       ('BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER',    BuildingClass,    'GREAT_WORK_THE_CROWN_JEWELS');

But I suppose that problem is different. If you say that integer value (1) is working then text value won't work and you need another column to make this work. Probably value 1 means: yes you have artifact that is described in column xxx. You need to change that column. I cant tell you what because from phone i have no access to SQLiteSpy which is my basic tool for such things. You only need to load vp open debug.db and look to assyrian library where it has value for its artifact saved.

Similar things you have with specialist:
SpecialistCount = 2
SpecialistType = 'SPECIALIST_MERCHANT'.

Also good thing is enable logging (google helps much) and check with notepad database.log. It contains error for SQLs.


Did you check if there's BUILDINGCLASS_HERMITAGE? Sometimes names for classes are not so obvious. F.e. for National Monument class is defined as BUILDINGCLASS_NATIONAL_EPIC and for council is BUILDINGCLASS_GROVE.

Also if you have ANY mistake in code the whole SQL won't load and it won't shows in main menu nor in loading screen nor in game.

 

[pineappledan]

Your buildingclassoverride is completely correct w.r.t. spelling, etc. BUILDINGCLASS_HERMITAGE is right as well.

I suspect that whatever is not allowing the building to appear is somewhere else in your code. It could be a simple missed semi-colon somewhere. If there's any errors in the SQL, especially upstream of the buildingclassoverride, then it's quite likely that none of it will work

EDIT: Looks like you might have a spelling error:

Defense - 'Defense+1000'
GlobalEspionageModifier - 'GlobalEspionageModifier-25'
National PopRequired - 'NationalPopRequired-round(.95*NationalPopRequired)'

Those should probably be just regular numbers

 

[adan_eslavo]

Nope. I code it the same way and it works. Im not only sure about that 'round(.95*' part. I never used that.

 

[pineappledan]

Even the national pop required one? that looks like a circular reference to me

 

[adan_eslavo]

I personally would do or normal NationalPopRequired or make it -5 or some other integer. 0.95 is not worth coding.

@FieryCharizard7 I use _064, _080 notation to make proper sorting files in modbuddy . You probably overwrited one of my files don't you? :]

I finished Dhanuraashi yesterday. For flag I borrowed one from Nubia mod. It will fit well. This unit is culture monstrosity. Today I will do Qila probably and maybe try Baan Chang.

 

[pineappledan]

We'll have to see if it needs tweaking when it's in-game. My personal experience is that archers need to be very good, since they are so quickly outclassed by horsemen.

 

[Hinin]

I've done two playtests yesterday, one with Sweden, and one with the Celts. Some storytelling to say.

Spoiler Sweden :

Same parameters as always (communitas, difficulty 6, epic, huge map)
- I had a rough beginning, starting on toundra with a limited number of deers, and so I commited myself fully to early Authority expansion/warmongering, and Sweden didn't disappoint : the +20 % CS when attacking does wonders in the early game, and I've been able to bully Mongolia mercilessly (I've settled next to the Mongolian capital, next to a natural wonder which would have been under GKhan control if I didn't capture or killed all things leaving his territory) and found a religion (I took the toundra pantheon) with the food/GApoints founder belief to allow my capital to grow despite its poor position.
- After growing very fast and very powerful, I began to stabilize my economy and build some infrastructures. This is where the Bastu arrived : my capital, placed on a river, became in one turn a scientific powerhouse (my science increased by 25 %) and, because I placed most of my cities on tiles with fresh water, I have been able to see the effects of the UB. I'll do my report on it after
- Because I controlled all the interesting spots in my region (an isthmus linked it to the one controlled by France), France (to the East) and Poland (to the North-West), attacked me, but I've been able to use my generals and the offensive power of my troops to destroy any landing force. The Medieval era passed rather quickly, and then arrived the Hakkapeliitta, with which I surprised and destroyed the still Medieval French forces. The combination of Tercio, Cannon and Hakkapeliitta proves to be polyvalent and quite devastating with a GGeneral (I took Paris, which was one of the biggest cities on the map, without much effort, and then vassalized Napoleon).
- After that, I rested my economy a bit and started allying CS around me in prevision of the congress (Poland, France and the Celts hated me) while also fortifying my continent in case of Polish invasion. I was a little (but not too much) behind in term of policies, but was cruising through the technological tree (Bastu + university = blue toundra forests ). The arrival of the Skola made my technological superiority even greater and allowed me to benefit from a hugh culture boost, and the Carolean crushed the Polish cavalry when I attacked Poland (snif alan) : I puppeted the good cities, burned the rest and vassalized Casimir. After that, my domination was only a question of time, so I decided to begin another game.

So, my thoughts on Sweden :
- I love how straightforward this civilization is : no bonus to food, production, faith or gold (or minor ones), only science, a little bit of culture, and maximum military power. The Bastu is really in line with this concept, and makes the Swedish starting bias valuable. I know that you want to maybe suppress the fresh water requirement for it, and, because I think that beside the science on toundra the bonus of the UB are not overwhelming, I would agree with that.
- As I said, the arrival of the Hakkapeliitta at Gunpowder creates a menacing army for Sweden. If you are able to quickly upgrade your army and attack, this is one hell of a power spike (I had an Hakkapeliitta level 5 stacked with a GG having more than 70 CS when attacking a wounded unit in open terrain), but your economy must be ready for that (so the early game, where only your UA helps you, is crucial). => I think that Sweden is a civilization that rewards you greatly for alternating between sudden and devastating assaults and periods of consolidation (to compensate the lack of economical bonus) : Si vis bellum, para pacem.
- The combination of the Carolean and the Skola provides a final and very strong boost to your usual bonus, military and science (Autocracy is just around the corner, and with it Sweden is destined to become a terrifying military power, if you have the economical means to sustain your forces once again).

Now, the Celts. Because we've talked about the GMerchant spawn rate of this civ but I had never tested it fully before, it was normal that I tried one day or another...

Spoiler The Celts :

Communitas, difficulty 6, epic, huge map
Because my starting position was full or resources and I wanted to take something original as a pantheon, I decided to play agressive Tradition with the Goddess of Sovereignty (+2 culture per city, +1 pr and go to improved resources, +5 GA points to CHalls).
- To protect my inland capital, I decided to agressively create a circle of protecting cities around it. I needed to take the best spots possible to not make these cities hinder my development, and so I used my Pictish warriors to wage war against neighboring civs in the early game (Babylon, Byzantium, Ethiopia) and prevent them from settling near me. Once again, the unlocking of the PWarrior at Mining was crucial, since it allowed me to attack Babylon and weaken its economy before it gets the Kibitium (I'm using a version without the "Captured workers" promotion, so the Babylonian settlers and workers helped me greatly).
- Normally, a Tradition player has little to no bonus to production in the non-capital cities. However, that was not the case for me thanks to my pantheon, which allowed me to produce and invest in necessary early buildings (+ more culture is neat in the early game). The first GMerchant arrived some time after I get Trade, and I placed my first oppidum two tiles away from my capital to maximize the adjacency benefits (with stone works, the oppidum and the pantheon, I had 8 production Quarries).
- The Scythed chariot was very useful against the Kibitium (you pass before it, attack, then retreat behind a PW), complements the PWarrior quite nicely (the first being strong in open terrain and the second in rough terrain) and helped me protecting my developping belt of cities against a particularly angry Authority Babylon.
- When I got my religion, I went food/GApoints for founder, mandir/mosquee, zealotry. Then, I went Tradition/Artistry (to maximize the effects of my pantheon and not have a counter-synergy with my way of using GMerchants, since Fealty incentivize you to send them in CS)/Industry (to produce as much GM as possible). I was swiming in culture, gold, faith and production, but lacked science, and I discovered afterwards that there was an out-of-control Hiawatha on the other continent (more than one era before everyone else, with as much policies as me, a dominant position in the world congress and an overwhelming military power), so I concentrated myself exclusively on producing GMerchants to see => At the end of the Industrial era, I got 16 GMerchants (I bought 5 of them with faith) and a fortified circular kingdom with a polyvalent and powerful economy.
- If I wanted to go all-out, I could have used my production to make a good Autocracy and try a domination victory, but the Iroquois were too far in the tech tree (reaching Atomic era), so I decided to stop here.

- Once again, I love the Celts for the options they offer (it was the first time I was going for Tradition Celts, and I didn't regret it) : the main advantage of the Oppidum (beside its defensive aspect, which I didn't see much during this game, but I think can be very useful in more agressive and wide playstile) is that it benefits those playing tall a lot, and so increases the Celtic polyvalence. The number of GMerchants seem fine to me (for I went all-out on creating them, so a less focused player will have a decent number on them) and the Oppidum really is a fine addition. The SChariot, as I said, synergizes well with the PWarrior and feels powerful but fragile (so they are good in conjonction with infantry, as they were in real life) : it can be a frightening unit in the good hands.

Thank you for creating these UCs. We need to have more point of views on them, but I think that, for the two civs I tested, they are good enough for now.

 

[adan_eslavo]

@FieryCharizard7 Try to modify this as follows:

INSERT INTO Buildings
            (Type,                            BuildingClass,    FreeArtifacts,     FreeGreatWork,                    GoldMaintenance, Cost, FaithCost,    EnhancedYieldTech, TechEnhancedTourism, AllowsRangeStrike, Defense,            ExtraCityHitPoints, TrainedFreePromotion,    CitySupplyFlat,    DefenseHappinessChange, GreatPeopleRateModifier,    GreatWorkSlotType,                GreatWorkCount,        FreshWater, FreeStartEra, Happiness, NeverCapture, PrereqTech,         ArtDefineTag, GreatPeopleRateChange,    SpecialistType, SpecialistCount, MinAreaSize, ConquestProb, HurryCostModifier,    GlobalEspionageModifier,    NationalPopRequired,                                NumCityCostMod,    NukeImmune,    Help,                                            ThemingBonusHelp,                             Description,                            Civilopedia,                                        Strategy,                                            IconAtlas,                        PortraitIndex)
SELECT        'BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER',    BuildingClass,    1,                 FreeGreatWork,    GoldMaintenance, Cost, FaithCost,    EnhancedYieldTech, TechEnhancedTourism, AllowsRangeStrike, Defense+1000,    ExtraCityHitPoints, TrainedFreePromotion,    CitySupplyFlat,    DefenseHappinessChange,    GreatPeopleRateModifier,    'GREAT_WORK_SLOT_ART_ARTIFACT',    3,                    FreshWater, FreeStartEra, Happiness, NeverCapture, 'TECH_BANKING',     ArtDefineTag, GreatPeopleRateChange,    SpecialistType, SpecialistCount, MinAreaSize, ConquestProb, HurryCostModifier,    GlobalEspionageModifier-25,    NationalPopRequired-round(.95*NationalPopRequired),    NumCityCostMod,    NukeImmune,    'TXT_KEY_BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER_HELP',    'TXT_KEY_WHITE_TOWER_THEMING_BONUS_HELP',     'TXT_KEY_BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER', 'TXT_KEY_BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER_TEXT',        'TXT_KEY_BUILDING_ENGLAND_WHITE_TOWER_STRATEGY',    'BUILDING_WHITE_TOWER',    0
FROM Buildings WHERE Type = 'BUILDING_HERMITAGE';

Burial Tomb which also gives artifact has FreeGreatWork field empty.

For artifact you should use artifact class 'ARTIFACT_CROWN' instead of 'ARTIFACT_SARCOPHAGUS' used in Egypt.

Sarcofagus has its own artifact class defined in other table.

I tried to find where burial tomb has definded what artifact to choose but in vain.

 

[FieryCharizard7]

I personally would do or normal NationalPopRequired or make it -5 or some other integer. 0.95 is not worth coding.

@FieryCharizard7 I use _064, _080 notation to make proper sorting files in modbuddy . You probably overwrited one of my files don't you? :]

Haha guilty as charged! I’ll make these changes and reupload as well. I did the *.95 to reduce the pop needed for the tower as it is unlocked techs earlier; it’ll be changed probably to a -3 or -4 as the usual requirement is 44 pop.

 

[De_Genius]

I am having some problems regarding how to implement the "+3% GPP per exported/imported resource" modifier on the Waag. I have been looking at the Austrian and Dutch traits, but they have not helped me a lot.
Do any of you have a good idea how to make this ? We could always make it a flat modifier, but I would like to incorporate some dynamical gameplay to make it more exciting.

Anyone have a good idea how to crack this ? If not, I am forced to go with a flat modifier, unless we can find something better to replace it with.

 

[Hinin]

I just looked at the Goedendag ingame. Because the unit isn't finished, I know that some problem will be resolved, but I'll talk about the unit anyway.
- The flag of the unit doesn't correspond to the weapon it wields : I would suggest using the flag of the Goedendag from the Flanders (Robert III) by LastSword. The Goedendag formation is well represented in this one.
- The 3d model of the unit is the one of the spearman
- The flag of the unit is the one of the spearman when in strategic map and the flail one in normal view.
- The unit doesn't benefit from it's own promotion and doesn't have the "+50 % CS against mounted units", so, when alone, it only has 16 CS (worse than a Swordman). I would suggest increasing the strength of its promotion and giving the Goedendag a way to fight when alone (they were club wielding infantry after all : they could handle a fight quite well against armored opponents and were feared by French knights => they should be only a little less powerful in one on one combat than Maori warriors)

For the Waag, you can use the picture found in mikeburnfire's 3/4 UC mod.

I wish you a good week !

 

[adan_eslavo]

Anyone have a good idea how to crack this ? If not, I am forced to go with a flat modifier, unless we can find something better to replace it with.

If you are able to get number of imported and exported resources you can do this: Sum all resources up. Round it to integer. Then for next step you need to create dummy building (look into my mod to Sachem's Council f.e.) with +3%GPP. Scan every city for Waag and then add as many buildings as the sum you had in previous point with function pCapital:SetNumRealBuilding(GameInfoTypes.BUILDING_IROQUOIS_DUMMYHAPPINESS, iHappiness). Do this every turn starts with GameEvent.PlayerDoTurn.Add() event. Cheers.

Ok, IMPORTANT questions. Qila transforms food (I made it count base food production for this). Then there are two ways of implementing it:
1. Every city adds yields separately, over city flows sign with yields added. I did this for now. It has one con: with many cities every turn massive amount of sign will pop up.
2. I can sum this number up from all cities and simply add one time with sign in capital. No more lagging problems. It doesn't matter how much cities you have. But you loose flavor and info from each city.

Second thing. I add culture dynamically every turn. There's one con of that. On top you have bar with culture and number of turns needed to fullfill demand for next policy. This counter doesn't count that dynamic culture addition so many times counter will skip few turns every turn. Are you ok with that? If no I will need to find the way with dummy buildings which will be less accurate cause now I have f.e. +1,1 from City 1 and 0,2 from city 2. With dummy buildings I will have only integers.

 

[Hinin]

Ok, IMPORTANT questions. Qila transforms food (I made it count base food production for this). Then there are two ways of implementing it:
1. Every city adds yields separately, over city flows sign with yields added. I did this for now. It has one con: with many cities every turn massive amount of sign will pop up.
2. I can sum this number up from all cities and simply add one time with sign in capital. No more lagging problems. It doesn't matter how much cities you have. But you loose flavor and info from each city.

Second thing. I add culture dynamically every turn. There's one con of that. On top you have bar with culture and number of turns needed to fullfill demand for next policy. This counter doesn't count that dynamic culture addition so many times counter will skip few turns every turn. Are you ok with that? If no I will need to find the way with dummy buildings which will be less accurate cause now I have f.e. +1,1 from City 1 and 0,2 from city 2. With dummy buildings I will have only integers.

From what I can see in the civ presentation page 6, I think you only need to do what the Siege foundry or the Bank do (for them, the conversion is integrated into the city yields) : keep it stealthy, since there are already so much popping up every turn. It is my point of view. Thank you for asking.

 

[pineappledan]

The food from the city itself should be added to the culture of that city, or else it will not contribute to border growth. I agree with hinin that it does not merit a notification at all. The info about the yields is there in the building description. Getting a notification every turn about your culture gain would be needless

I have completed a first attempt for the sachems council and the klepht:

Spoiler :

 

[Hinin]

I have completed a first attempt for the sachems council and the klepht:

To be frank, I quite like the current picture of the Sachem council. Moreover, you may have noticed that, in Civ V, no building picture features human beings, or never at the center of the image (except the Hippodrome, because the action in it is its main interest, and the Mausoleum, but the humans are dead here). I would prefer to see a ameliorated version of the current Sachems council than the picture who just showed.

For the Klepht, when depixelated, this could be a good unit picture (it gives a Zorro vibe ).

Once again, it is only one point of view, and it's not me who did these pictures, but I wanted to give my pov anyway.

 

[adan_eslavo]

And for Sachem's Council after implementing everything is one big brown spot. You cannot differentiate people on it easily.

I modified Qila according to your suggestions. Now it adds culture to city income and it is added towards policy counter and tile gain.

 

[pineappledan]

What about library or constabulary? Those have people dead centre

I thought the sunspot behind the guy’s head made it rather good for contrast. Where/what is that Sachem’s council picture that you used, @adan_eslavo? I couldn’t find it

 

[FoxOfWar]

Playtesting of Spain in-progress, some thoughts. (Playing 50-cities wide in a huge/marathon/king)
-Hacienda is real, real good when going wide(like any UI, to be fair). Gives those freshly-created medieval cities exactly what they need, and really quickens up infrastructure building.
-Doubly good in actually making almost-pure-desert expanding actually pretty enviably easy because you usually only expand desert for resources, and Hacienda needs luxuries... 1-3 very good tiles to work in otherwise unworkable terrain.

-Armada seems good, though I haven't gotten into any naval wars as of yet. But I reckon it's fairly good as-is - unique, different, yet real scary in right environment. That extra exp can and will rack up very nicely if you find yourself in naval conquering around Renaissance, as melee ships tend to 'stand guard' when you bombard an enemy city...