A Different Moral Question About Abortion

[Skwink]

In the interest of this scenario, abortion is legal and will always be legal. Drop that argument at the door.​

One night, a husband and wife have unprotected sex. The wife gets pregnant and is is perfectly healthy. The couple is excited for their first child, and 2 months later the Husband is away on a week long business trip.

Now, on her own, the wife starts doubting her desire to raise a child, and while her husband is away she gets a quick abortion, without consulting him. Her reasoning being that it's her body, she can do what she likes with it.

The Husband gets back, and finds out the wife had an abortion without consulting him, he really wanted a child. He's very mad, saying it was 50% his child too, and that she had no right to abort it, at least without consulting him.

Is the wife in right or the wrong here?​

 

[Arwon]

It's generally not a great idea to do major things without consulting a long term partner. You wouldn't buy a car without them either.

 

[civver_764]

You could say that people are simply too attached to their potential offspring. I see this as a cultural issue.

 

[Glassfan]

In the interest of this scenario, abortion is legal and will always be legal. Drop that argument at the door.​

You don't have to yell.

 

[ace99]

Courts have rejected that a man may have any say over if the wife or other partner gets an abortion or not.

If the man wants to have the fetus implanted and deliver the baby himself go for it. Until then, shut up.

On the flip side I'm of the opinion that the progenitor should not be entirely without legal recourse. Some feminists and "men's rights" advocate that a man should be able to get a "legal" abortion, for a baby he doesn't want but the woman does, and thereby terminate his legal responsibilities to the child. I think that has some merit but I'm not sure how much. Sounds like the topic of a future law review article.

 

[Glassfan]

It's generally not a great idea to do major things without consulting a long term partner. You wouldn't buy a car without them either.

This.

Courts have rejected that a man may have any say over if the wife or other partner gets an abortion or not.

This too.

If my wife had done such a thing - even though perfectly legal, it would have become obvious that we do not share the same values, especially shared-responsibility and trust. A divorce would seem likely.

 

[Thedrin]

ace99:
Courts have rejected that a man may have any say over if the wife or other partner gets an abortion or not.

Glassfan:
This too.

It may be legal but - and due to the specific scenario outlined by the OP I say this without revealing my opinion on the morality of abortion - it would also be immoral.

A husband and wife plan to move out of their first apartment and into a house. They've picked a house, viewed it, and agreed a price with the owners. They've gotten approval from the bank for a 25 year mortgage. They've started making plans on how they're going to decorate it and use each of the rooms.

They haven't yet signed any contracts.

The husband decides that he does not want the house and spends a large part of their money on a vintage motorbike. They will not be able to afford the house for another couple of years. He did this without informing his wife.

My issue isn't with the abortion, or at least I don't need to talk about the morality of abortion to describe the OP's scenario as immoral. My issue is that one partner in a long term relationship made an important decision that will have a significant affect on both of their lives without consulting the other.

I obviously don't think that the scenario I've outlined is equivalent to the OP's scenario, and so don't rank the actions of the guilty party in each scenario as equally immoral. Except the bit about the motorbike. That's just ridiculous. If the husband really doesn't want to buy a house yet, he should let his wife know and let her have her say. If the wife really doesn't want to have the child then the husband (in a scenario where abortion is legal) should not be able to force her to, but she should inform him of her desires and let him have his say. This does not mean that she has to or should change her mind.

 

[Tee Kay]

If my wife had done such a thing - even though perfectly legal, it would have become obvious that we do not share the same values, especially shared-responsibility and trust. A divorce would seem likely.

Eeyup.

 

[Synobun]

Eeyup.

Echoing this. I don't think I could look at my spouse the same way ever again if she aborted our unborn child. I don't care if other people get abortions, but on a personal level... I want to have that child if it came from my testicles, so to say.

 

[rugbyLEAGUEfan]

You wouldn't buy a car without them either.

Au contraire. I've driven many a wedge between that little relationship I can assure you

 

[Borachio]

The issue of making an important decision without consulting a partner does not bode well for the long term health of the relationship.

There's also the broader issue of whether it's actually true that the woman has total and absolute sovereignty over her body. Or indeed whether anyone does with regard to any action whatsoever.

An important distinction made in Utilitarianism (IIRC from decades ago) was that between "self-regarding" actions which affect only the individual concerned, and "other-regarding" actions which affect others.

It turns out, on careful examination, that the "self-regarding" category is entirely empty.

Leaving aside the husband who is plainly affected by the woman's decision to have an abortion, there are also the woman's blood relatives, her friends and acquaintances, the medical staff employed, and at least the wider society, plus the, possible, future child and its possible descendants. (And others I haven't thought of)

All of these may be positively or negatively affected by the woman's decision.

So, anyway, perhaps I should just have said that there is no simple answer to the question.

 

[Core Imposter]

If I were the husband I'd assume that the baby wasn't mine in the first place and I would ask her to leave. I don't believe in divorce so I'd wait till she procurred one. I would pray for her and thank God we'd had no other children to complicate this any further.

 

[Disgustipated]

In the interest of this scenario, abortion is legal and will always be legal. Drop that argument at the door.​

One night, a husband and wife have unprotected sex. The wife gets pregnant and is is perfectly healthy. The couple is excited for their first child, and 2 months later the Husband is away on a week long business trip.

Now, on her own, the wife starts doubting her desire to raise a child, and while her husband is away she gets a quick abortion, without consulting him. Her reasoning being that it's her body, she can do what she likes with it.

The Husband gets back, and finds out the wife had an abortion without consulting him, he really wanted a child. He's very mad, saying it was 50% his child too, and that she had no right to abort it, at least without consulting him.

Is the wife in right or the wrong here?​

Dump the ho, and find another. Yes it's her body and she has a right to do what she wants, just don't expect us to be happy about it, and "support" you. Your ass will be going out the door for doing something like that.

 

[sophie]

Yeah, mirroring the thoughts of everybody else.

I certainly wouldn't be ok with a woman who just "nipped down to the doctor and had a quick abortion". I may not believe a fetus is a human life but I still don't think an abortion is a decision one should make lightly or spur of the moment.

That being said it is her body, and she has the right to do as she would with it. Just as I have no ultimate decisionmaking on whether or not she decides to hitchhike through Germany, I also ultimately have no say on whether or not she gets an abortion (from a decisionmaking standpoint, I can definitely voice my intense disagreement).

Now in the instance of a minor getting an abortion, that I think is a different matter entirely.

 

[Disgustipated]

Why does it make a difference if it's a minor? It's still their body, and they should be able to have an abortion without their parents approval.

 

[Borachio]

Should a minor be able to get a tattoo without their parents approval?

You know, like one consisting of rank expletives tattooed across their entire face?

To say minors should have complete control over their own existence is just a tad unrealistic, imo.

 

[Synobun]

Should a minor be able to get a tattoo without their parents approval?

You know, like one consisting of rank expletives tattooed across their entire face?

To say minors should have complete control over their own existence is just a tad unrealistic, imo.

I would approve of minors having control of decisions such as this if they can write a fully literate persuasive essay detailing why they want to do what they want to do what they'll do for their parents to inevitably earn the right to make these decisions.

My children are going to hate me. Age 5. "Daddy, daddy, can I have some ice cream?"

"WRITE ME AN ESSAY EXPLAINING WHY, CHILD."

I can't wait.

 

[holy king]

it's a dick move that is pretty damn high on the dick move scale.

is being a dick immoral?

 

[Borachio]

No. I don't think it's immoral.

Dick move is dick move. Seems to be sufficient classification, imo.

 

[holy king]

well, kant would kind of disagree there and call it unethical, but what do i know..