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A Greece Game

Discussion in 'Gameplay Guides' started by Fresol, Jul 1, 2015.

  1. Fresol

    Fresol Angry Halfling in Green

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    If you don't like early rushes(I don't either), then maybe Epic or Marathon speed is better suited for you. I personally don't like prolonged games so I'm staying on Normal speed.

    About Cyprus: are you going to let it coexist with Sur?
     
  2. citis

    citis Chieftain

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    Inevitably, it is required for the goal.
     
  3. Fresol

    Fresol Angry Halfling in Green

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    That's true, I forgot. But then how do you cope with expansion instability? You must have settled Korinthos too. So what other core city do you settle? When?
     
  4. citis

    citis Chieftain

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    I settle Byzantion at some point. I usually settle it late, but it is true it should be settled relatively early.
     
  5. calad

    calad Chieftain

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    Well that was fast.
     
  6. Eric Cartmenez

    Eric Cartmenez Chieftain

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    Thanks Fresol, great gameplay, still I don't understand why Niwt-Rst went independent in my Regent game ... I can't reproduce it for 100% sure, but I got Athens and Epidamnos in my core, sending 3 hoplites to Egypt right away, conquered it, and lost the next turn :(
     
  7. Fresol

    Fresol Angry Halfling in Green

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    That shouldn't happen within the first 20 turns of your game(during this period you are free of stability checks). City secession happens when your expansion stability is too low -- usually from overextension. In Ancient era your core population cannot support much peripheral population(from non-core cities), so do the conquering quickly and enter Classical era soon.
     
  8. Fresol

    Fresol Angry Halfling in Green

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    I just want to inform everyone that I have finished a Tamils game (Regent/Normal as always) and will post it in the next few days. Any further suggestions on which civ to play?

    I actually tried Paragon/Normal for a few civs(China, Arabia). The conclusion has been that I don't have enough time and stamina for this kind of challenge right now. So I'll stick to the easier Regent games, which might be just as good since people who want to play Paragon games probably don't need to read my guides. :lol:
     
  9. calad

    calad Chieftain

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    You finnish games faster than I can open them :D

    How about Mongols?
     
  10. Fresol

    Fresol Angry Halfling in Green

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    I feel Mongolia is too easy, just like Vikings. They have a superior army and don't care scrap abou research or anything else.
     
  11. calad

    calad Chieftain

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    Then how about Mali... the most disliked civ existing!
     
  12. citis

    citis Chieftain

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    How about Colombia? There is only one game posted ever. The 3rd goal seems at least difficult.

    Arabia should be difficult, in latest revisions.

    I don't know about Canada, but it seems easy or balanced.

    All others are pretty done. (Or not :confused:)
     
  13. ales_

    ales_ Heir

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    Canada was also done at least once, see the UHV thread.
    Argentina, Colombia, Brazil are the only civs that weren't done yet in 1.12. America probably was (hasn't fully updated the thread yet). They were all done in 1.11 though.
     
  14. Fresol

    Fresol Angry Halfling in Green

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    My purpose of posting these games is not to fill the list for the UHV thread or anything like that. I want to share games that you are interested in reading, for whatever reasons you have. More views and comments make me more motivated in continuing the series. :)

    Or would you like to see URV victories like Arabia Catholicism victory? :lol: It could take longer time but it sounds interesting.
     
  15. Novicenoble

    Novicenoble Chieftain

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    Vote for the Turkic Secular victory!
     
  16. calad

    calad Chieftain

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    I think Latin American civs would be really intresting. Nobody rarely plays them.
     
  17. citis

    citis Chieftain

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    Have in mind, game changes and not all challenge posts describe their strategy.

    Arabia game has completely changed. Their UP, gold production and stability potential are nerfed. An Arabia game in svn980 has nothing to do with what is posted in the thread.

    India has changed too. However, I consider the changes won't nerf the game.

    The Colombia post is in v1.11 is about a different game de facto and says nothing about its strategy. When I played them, it seemed to me that 3rd goal is almost undoable.

    I haven't played Canada, thus I can't say how difficult they are.

    I have played Argentina, Brazil and America in 1.11, and they are doable. Especially in SVN 980 that AI research rate is normal until human spawn. Argentine UHV has changed, but it seems still doable.
     
  18. Tigranes

    Tigranes Armenian

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    Things surely improved since 2015 :goodjob:. I did exact same thing, same cities, early Egypt rush (they only had Militia), never got any stability problems, kept Diaspolis entire game which was the birthplace of many great people, including early Great Engineer which is useful for Parthenon. At some point after conquests in Persia my expansion stability was contributing extra +1 because of some "Recent Expansion" (still don't know how it works)! Note, that you don't have to capture Jerusalem now and to control Persia you need to have more cities then them in that region, you don't even need to collapse them! So overall very enjoyable game and my second largest to date score:

    Civ4ScreenShot0132.JPG Civ4ScreenShot0133.JPG
     
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  19. Fresol

    Fresol Angry Halfling in Green

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    I usually attach GGs to siege weapons for greater mobility.
     
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  20. Autumn Leaf

    Autumn Leaf Since 1992

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    Interesting strategy settling Corinth instead of Athens. I can see why you do that, but I like to settle Kyrene in Egypt (which I immediately rename Alexandria). Corinth cramps the Kyrene site and tries to steal its fish. If my Galley can reach the Bosphorus in one move I will wait a turn before settling Athenai and try to make Byzantion my capital, otherwise I just make Athenai on the spot and move my capital to Byzantion later (after completing the UHV).

    FWIW my prefered sites in the Greek core are Athenai, Epidamnos, Byzantion, Halikarnassos and Knossos.That gives 5 cities in the core, 4 of them with excellent population and production, and even Knossos eventually grows big enough to help Stability for massive empires. Knossos flips to Arabia, but I evacuate it beforehand and 10 tuns later send a couple of Hoplites on a Galley to retake it. Halikarnassos flips to the Turks, but again it's just a case of evacuate beforehand, agree to the flip, wait 10 turns, then reconquer with an overwhelming army from Byzantion (which by the time the Turks arrive should be your capital).

    Greek Core.jpg

    The reason I settle Kyrene instead of 1E (the real Alexandreia site) is that Arabia's flipzone includes the Alexandreia site. Kyrene is one tile outside the flipzone. When I first capture Egypt I generally raze all the crappy AI cities except Diospolis Megale itself - it's just too expensive otherwise. Immediately before Arabia spawns, I withdraw all my Egyptian military to walled Kyrene, turning it into a massively overgarrisoned fortress that laughs at Camel Archers. Ten turns later I DoW (if Arabia hasn't already DoW'd me) and use that garrison to storm Egypt and recapture that corner of my empire in about 3 moves. Since the AI likes to settle Diospolis Megale one square further south than I would, Kyrene has unfettered access to Fish, Wheat, Dye and Cotton. With a Cottage on Siwa it turns into a very nice city by mid-game, despite missing out on the Marble (which Diospolis Megale works). For historical reasons I try to build both the Lighthouse and the Great Library (thankfully no longer UHV buildings) in my "Alexandria" :egypt:.

    I'm currently playing a Marathon game (Regent level, not my usual Monarch; this is a recreational game), trying to make Greece into a world-spanning mega-empire, and by chance the game gave me a very similar start to yours (including two Huluganni) except that my Galley was in the Aegean not the Gulf. Settling Athenai on the spot gave my Galley access to the Gulf for a shorter run up to Epidamnos. I then ferried three Hoplites and one Warrior to Egypt on the Galley, meanwhile the two Huluganni went on a suicide run to harass China, capturing Babylon and Afrosiab en route (had to raze Afrosiab because early Stability; after achieving my UHV I rebuilt Marakanda 1W of the site as a northern fortress to hinder barbs and Mongols).

    The Huluganni caught China napping, with just one Warrior in Chang'an and another standing on the forest hill north of the city :lol:. My Huluganni had gained a lot of experience and had lost little health from sacking cities and killing barbarians on the way. One killed the Forest Warrior on Turn 171 and the other razed Chang'an on Turn 172. I would have liked to keep it but such a large city so far away would have destroyed my Stability and my economy. I had to settle for eliminating China as a rival (and pillaging its territory for pocket money). So, by 20 turns into a Marathon game game I had eliminated Babylon, Egypt and China, leaving just friendly Harappa (I have both Harappa and Polynesia enabled for the AI). Once the 20 turn grace period ended, the overexpansion and city razing penalties tipped me into Unstable briefly until my core population grew, but since then my empire has never looked back.

    Having AI Harappa in a Greek game is interesting. They're very friendly and often have useful techs they will trade to you, they hinder early India, but then they suddenly collapse and all their cities crumble to rubble around 775 BC! My cities Alexandreia Arachoton and Alexandreia tes Indias (founded well after the UHV) benefited from improvements the Harappans left behind.

    The Greek UHV doesn't get easier on Marathon versus Normal speed. The issue is that you need all that early plunder from razing cities and pillaging AI improvements to finance a deficit budget to keep your research rate at or near 100%, but in a Marathon game that money must stretch three times as far. In a nutshell, it will run out well short of the UHV, forcing you to drop your research rate to avoid bankrupcy. If the tax rate hits 100% (easy to do if you have too many cities) you're probably screwed. The Romans will eat you up while your cities strike. Diospolis Megale and Babylon are all you need prior to 330 BC since the territorial UHV specifies you need to control Egypt, Bablyon, Phoenicia and Persia in 330 BC. Taking e.g. Tyros or Hierusalem too early merely costs you research money. You may have no choice if Persia declares war on you, otherwise bide your time.

    Low research (short of bankrupcy) doesn't stop you controlling all the UHV territories and building all the UHV Wonders (you only need to get as far as Metal Casting and Aesthetics to complete the Wonders UHV), but if your research flags and you don't harass or eliminate China and Rome then they can easily discover one of the three UHV techs before you. Fortunately no rival spawns with any of the UHV techs until the Japanese in 530 AD, so if you can hinder your rivals enough and stay stable, you can probably make it. That's the real secret to the Greek UHV - keep your enemies weak, keep no unecessary cities, and be patient. There's plenty of time after 250 BC to become an unstoppable colossus.
     
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