A thread for small ideas

[Opera]

Master Siegesmith. Possibly other Master buildings, if I can generate enough ideas.

I will do something along those lines for the Ngomele... Equipment buildings, GPs builders, etc. For Melee, Archer, ... and especially for Arcane units Don't know about the Sieges, though. Haven't yet thought of them....

 

[deadliver]

I pop my first great sage within about 30 or so turns at the earliest.

What if the Amurites and other magic users could build adepts without KotE?

edit: OK so at most turn 47

 

[Valkrionn]

I will do something along those lines for the Ngomele... Equipment buildings, GPs builders, etc. For Melee, Archer, ... and especially for Arcane units Don't know about the Sieges, though. Haven't yet thought of them....

I'd like one for Arcane as well, but I haven't been able to think of enough decent ideas so far. Although really, the siegesmith is mostly because of other changes I'm working on. Think you might be the only one who knows what I'm planning haha.

I pop my first great sage within about 30 or so turns at the earliest.

What if the Amurites and other magic users could build adepts without KotE?

Hmm.... I think I'm going to allow a weak version of the adept without KotE. I should be able to easily set up a PromotionAllows effect promo, granting it access to just the palace mana types.

 

[deadliver]

Hmm.... I think I'm going to allow a weak version of the adept without KotE. I should be able to easily set up a PromotionAllows effect promo, granting it access to just the palace mana types.

Amurite: the puny-caster would have access to metamagic, dispel magic would be useful!

Sheiam: this time it would be death mana (i guess fire is useful for both too).

How else would they be different from adepts?

 

[Valkrionn]

Really, they wouldn't, aside from being weaker and limited in spells. They're just there to allow the magic users to prosper before getting KotE.

 

[Milaga]

Master Siegesmith.

Ah ha! I figured it was either the cows or that.

What if the Amurites and other magic users could build adepts without KotE?

That's was my thought exactly. I think the problem is that Adepts don't come early enough AND they are weak and useless anyway.

Let Amurites get S2 Adepts at Mysticism. At KotE the strength increases to 3. Then half the tech requirements for Sorcery and the four spell types. This should let them get mages much closer to the time when Axemen appear.

 

[ICanHasName?]

The lack of usefulness of level I spells (especially of the Amurites mana) is part of it too. No matter how many adepts they have casting blaze, its just not going to matter unless it gives a combat buff or direct damage or something.

 

[civ_king]

you might be surprised how useful a floating eye is, I think the Amurite scout should have Metamagic I, It is ungodly on Erebus Maps

 

[Opera]

I'd like one for Arcane as well, but I haven't been able to think of enough decent ideas so far. Although really, the siegesmith is mostly because of other changes I'm working on. Think you might be the only one who knows what I'm planning haha.

Haha, yeah, I get it now. It all makes sense!

 

[bhorrar]

Maybe the Amurites should get a civ trait "magic users" and be able to build adepts twice as quickly, and get KOTE at a reduced rate. This may possibly help get them their specialty while not getting too over the top...but I still think that they should get some more magic...

 

[deadliver]

I agree that all civs in general need more spells Bhorrar but I really have no ideas to contribute to new spells beyond any elemental sphere combat spell I should not be more powerful than a skeleton raised by Death I.

Also the Amurites may be the bomb when it comes to magic lorewise they are not the only magic users of some skill: the Sheiam, the Balseraphs, the Kahdi, the Elves just to name a couple. the Amurite's magic culture is represented by their worldspell, govannon (though I still think units should be able to learn magic on their own), their UU.

Perhaps instead of just having a puny-caster which upgrades later into an adept. Why not have a minor magic using line of recon units? They already have the chanter...

 

[Vermicious Knid]

I just thought of another use for the new tier 1 weak adept.


Allow it to be sacrificed for a small number of beakers. Can reflect apprentices participating in risky research.

 

[stupidnewbie]

A while back, I explored a pyre of the random reward system, and got a fine kit or something and the body I promotion on my svartalfar scout. It wasn't the first time I'd gotten the non-prize out of an epic lair, but it was the only time I'd gotten a spell out of it. That should probably be more common to help offset the cost of not getting a golden age or great person.

 

[xienwolf]

You could utilize the <PromotionAllow> tag to grant the Amurite generic units a chance to learn appropriate magical spheres without actually being Adepts. It lets you bypass the UnitCombat check, but not most of the other prereqs (like having that mana source), so by slapping a PromotionAllow EffectPromotion which requires Amurite and an appropriate UnitType or three you can spread the POTENTIAL for various spells through the Amurite ranks, and force the player to acquire appropriate mana and earn a level to actually achieve the capability themselves. Could require removing the link to Channeling I from all the rank 1 spells, but that isn't too hard to manage (or you could make these effect promotions an OR alternative to Channeling I/II/III)

 

[deadliver]

You could utilize the <PromotionAllow> tag to grant the Amurite generic units a chance to learn appropriate magical spheres without actually being Adepts. It lets you bypass the UnitCombat check, but not most of the other prereqs (like having that mana source), so by slapping a PromotionAllow EffectPromotion which requires Amurite and an appropriate UnitType or three you can spread the POTENTIAL for various spells through the Amurite ranks, and force the player to acquire appropriate mana and earn a level to actually achieve the capability themselves. Could require removing the link to Channeling I from all the rank 1 spells, but that isn't too hard to manage (or you could make these effect promotions an OR alternative to Channeling I/II/III)

Okay Xienwolf, let me see if I got that correct, please bear with me. This tag could be switched on to allow a list of amurite units to gain the spells available from the mana you control?

You also think perhaps we'd have to remove the channeling I requirement from rank one spells....if that happened you could have Amurite warriors able to gain Haste (with their body 1 mana) after gaining their first level? If so...

I am still of the opinion that Amurite units should be able to learn at least level 1 spells on their own...but what would Govannon be good for/


Thanks!

 

[Milaga]

I am still of the opinion that Amurite units should be able to learn at least level 1 spells on their own...but what would Govannon be good for/

Why teaching those who know level 1 spells level 2 spells of course. Or saving them from wasting a promotion ...

I'm not sure why this never really crossed my mind as a viable and balanced solution. You're exactly right Deadliver. Why not allow all Amurites melee, archery and recon units to learn rank 1 spells? If an archer wants to learn haste, let them. They will just use up a promotion that would otherwise make them better at their primary function.

This lets Amurites use magic after they earn their first 2 xp, if they so desire. No need for a wimpy pre-adept.

 

[xienwolf]

Haste on a warrior isn't very appropriate. Dancing Blades would seem better, and Haste on Scouts.

So for a scout, you'd have a <PromotionAllow>PROMOTION_BODY1</PromotionAllow>, which means that if you ever get access to Body magic, all of your scouts can promote to Body 1 at their next level up and cast Haste. Warriors would get <PromotionAllow>PROMOTION_CHAOS1</PromotionAllow>, meaning if you get Chaos Mana they can pay a level to gain Dance of Blades for themselves. I would say you ought to link all magic spells to UnitCombat Adept and set things up so that every other unitcombat requires a PromotionAllow flag to get them so that you can expand this beyond rank 1 spells.

This system would let you set up a couple of appropriate spells available to units from the start of the game, or while Govannon is dead. Govannon is able to grant them the spells for free, AND can grant them ones normally not available (like Haste to your warrior).

 

[deadliver]

Why teaching those who know level 1 spells level 2 spells of course. Or saving them from wasting a promotion ...

I'm not sure why this never really crossed my mind as a viable and balanced solution. You're exactly right Deadliver. Why not allow all Amurites melee, archery and recon units to learn rank 1 spells? If an archer wants to learn haste, let them. They will just use up a promotion that would otherwise make them better at their primary function.

This lets Amurites use magic after they earn their first 2 xp, if they so desire. No need for a wimpy pre-adept.

Exactly!Now multiply yourself a million billion times and I am sure someone else will agree with us! (psst I think Xienwolf is coming around, just in case he is get some chloroform and a blackjack).

 

[Vehem]

Exactly!Now multiply yourself a million billion times and I am sure someone else will agree with us! (psst I think Xienwolf is coming around, just in case he is get some chloroform and a blackjack).

Every unit you own wielding Death I?

 

[deadliver]

Every unit you own wielding Death I?

Why not?

1.) Basically the same as having warrens except these extra units cannot be promoted.
2.) Requires necromancy tech for the Amurites anyhow.
3.) And uses a promotion. Make it two promotions if you want. Not like these guys gain potency.