Aabra02: Hammy Builds a House

[scoutsout]

Have we any idea of what victory condition we're aiming for?

With this variant at this level... let's just win.

 

[Bede]

Seems like Bede had us focus on gold in TGOM03, roading or fishing before mining in the early stages. I enjoy MMing so long as I understand what I'm trying to accomplish.

Have we any idea of what victory condition we're aiming for? Seems like when the 1BC idea was just a twinkle in Bede's eye, he suggested domination, and I suppose culture or an SS are possibilities. Would the VC make any difference in roading first for gold (and research) or mining first for shields (and military units), or is our immediate concern just surviving for awhile?

I see nothing that suggests a focus other than food first.

We need to locate the resources in our immediate neighborhood before anything else. So Iron Working and The Wheel are obvious priorities. Research the first at minimum and buy the second as soon as we can. And get explorers on the ground to both make contacts and get us map information.

I would not be averse to building The Colossus for the added commerce and it would give the Babylon something to do which would not add to the maintenance burden after training up explorers and needed workers.

Since population growth is limited due to the shortage of luxuries and we won't be training any settlers I do not agree that a Granary is the best project for the capitol.

 

[scoutsout]

...I do not agree that a Granary is the best project for the capitol.

I agree with you to a point, brother Bede. While I don't think a granary is the best first project for the capitol, I suspect we'll want to peel enough workers along the way that we will want one at some point. We'll need some colonies, and roads to our neighbors future holdings.

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

I have both Excel and Offa's spreadsheet, but I'm unclear how to use them in a game...even tho I've seen screenies of them. Don't you have to start the calculations from the very first turn? I'd like to learn how to do it if someone is willing to give an online lesson. *hint * Seems like Bede had us focus on gold in TGOM03, roading or fishing before mining in the early stages. I enjoy MMing so long as I understand what I'm trying to accomplish.

That time will come.

Have we any idea of what victory condition we're aiming for? Would the VC make any difference in roading first for gold (and research) or mining first for shields (and military units), or is our immediate concern just surviving for awhile?

It is surviving for a while. Whichever VC we go for, we need to build up shields so we can put an army together. We'll need to improve the lands at hand and we'll need to grow population to use the tiles. That said, we'll need the money to support an army and from our position, imho, this makes a good case for an early colossus. If we go Colossus, build shields up ASAP. Otherwise, we'll need the gold but I'm in the mine first camp: more shields, faster granary, more pop, more gold.

...with sugar frosting on top of our flakes.

I like sugar

Since population growth is limited due to the shortage of luxuries and we won't be training any settlers I do not agree that a Granary is the best project for the capitol.

I'm with scout here: with only one city, the extra citizens either make up for their lux cost in gold or in shields. We won't lose gold from size 1 towns shedding their cash into useless happy gas with but one city. I like to build a bunch of workers (5,6+) fast with a granary in OCC and join them at a later time when we have worked enough tiles. This also makes a case for the MoM, but I'm not sure how everyone feels about the general plan - my mind is set on making a big OCC city, catching up with the neighbors and making a military when our economy is supported by enough infra not to go broke. At size 12, assuming 1 BG from chopped forests, we'll do 24spt without food deficit: 3 turn knights.

Either way, gambling wonders or gambling early conquests, we're in for a gamble.

Reading myself, I might be on the over-comfortable side of the OCC idea ... but it has worked before and there's no reason OCC (for a while) wouldn't work now There was an AWOCC emperor game a while back where we made it to RP before getting squished by a runaway

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

I went ahead and played, every option is open at this point - the game strategy will start to matter at this point right here.

Pre-Turn:
Looking good, science kept at min.

T1.
Mine BG1

Bonecrusher is out there and wants a good stroll. He goes North in the jungle, next will take West.

T2.
More coast up North.

T3.
Cultural expansion, work the sugar.

T5.
Skullsplitter is out and wants some barb roast.

T6.
We make a friend!

Then it goes quiet until:

T10.
Just in time to talk about it:

So there we are.

The sheet is missing entries after the worker: if we pull a worker out at that point, we can make up the 10 shields by chopping.

Spoiler Spreadsheet :

We are at 3000 BC, everything after this turn is in italics, to the left.

I think it shows rather well that both temple (new worker doesn't chop) and granary (new worker chops) are good calls here, both fit our agenda and everything, but I'm for the worker-chop-granary option, temple after.

For fear of repeating myself, I see no reason to make an early barrack for units but we should have 2 MP's at home, preferably bowman/spear (to avoid GA, just in case). After we have 2 MP's, maybe another scout, 2-3 more workers, temple and granary (not in that order ) we would start on colossus. This paves the way for us to survive economically and opens the 20K exit door if we need it. Only the opinion of 1 in 6 here, though, and I'll go with the team.

 

[Bede]

Looks like we are at the Crossroads of the World, or at least this continent.

The terrain to the north (towards Arabia) suggests we won't be seeing any Arab towns in our neighborhood anytime soon, and the terrain to the south suggests it will be a long time before the Celts come our way (if they are to the south). Too bad we had to catch who started with Pots and Temples and zoomed to Bronze Working.

Methinks we need another explorer to the east and south of the jungle belt.

 

[gmaharriet]

@BeF, I tried to make my copy of the spreadsheet (which I've never used before) look like yours. Got the 1st 3 moves in fine, but in 3850 I typed in "irrigated wheat"...and where your column, worked tiles 1, says "lak", mine looks blank but has a formula in it.

I can see there is an additional sheet with terrain names and values listed, but "lak" is not one of them. How do I add it and what values would I put in the next 2 columns behind it on the terrain sheet? There is a terrain there called "wheat i" which may be the same thing, but I don't know what to do with it.

Is there a simple explanation in very small words? Thank you.

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

bottom tab "terrain" you need to input a new type of terrain for lake - you can also use grass instead, same food/shield values.

 

[scoutsout]

I think if we want Colossus we should go ahead and build the granary. I doubt we'll accumulate the shields without the population. I'll wait to play this until we've had ample time for discussion... crossroads, etc.

 

[gmaharriet]

Sorry, but this is what I get. On the terrain tab I added "Lak | 2 | 0" in the columns. I guess I'm being dense. (The shadowed section on the first several lines is just because that's all I planned on pasting into MS Paint, and then forgot to do it that way.)

Spoiler :

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

lurker checking in. n to the hill. water the wheat.

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

In the terrain tab, you need to make it 0/0: 0 *excess* food, 0 shields. wheatg is 1/0, wheatg i is 2/0.

Then you need to type in the tile you want each citizen to work, at what turn, press enter. E6: lak ; E7: wheatg ; E9: wheatg i or whatever you name them if they aren't in the bank already (might need to adjust terrain). It will start calculating from there.

20 turns late for that comment Admiral

 

[gmaharriet]

Ah, I think I'm beginning to understand. The person who sent me the spreadsheet was playing an SGOTM, and some things were filled in (like 3 food in the city center...must have been an AGRI civ, huh?).

If you don't mind, I'll just keep copying yours until I start to see how it all fits together. If I come across something else I don't understand, I'll just ask more questions. I think eventually I'll "get it" on my own.

Thank you!!!

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

We'll get together to work on that over msn, that time will come

 

[gmaharriet]

We'll get together to work on that over msn, that time will come

Thanks, Beorn! I think I've got the hang of it now...even how you worked in the forest chop.

I now suspect that the really hard part is doing all the planning ahead to fill in the numbers for worker actions and production.

 

[Whomp]

Contacts.
I think Colossus is huge in a 1CC so I'd like to do it. So gran first or after?

Is it me or is this landmass not showing much lux?

 

[scoutsout]

...Colossus is huge... gran first or after?

I think we'll need the granary in order to build the Colossus. That's my $0.02.

Is it me or is this landmass not showing much lux?

It's you. We can't see the whole landmass yet.

 

[Whomp]

I think we'll need the granary in order to build the Colossus.

I think we should do it.

That's my $0.02. It's you. We can't see the whole landmass yet.

Well at least we can have confidence there's three but where?

What I do know is trying to take the Arabs out is going to be a pain. Lots of jungle and swamps up there. A early war with them wouldn't hurt though.

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

An early war with the Arabs wouldn't yield much either: too far, too costy in worker turns or in troop displacement. I'm curious about where the celts are located though. They popped from our South, could be either way. They can't be far. I'd try to go back around our native mountains and take West afterwards. Hopefully we can get a road pass to our SW or SE towards Alesia without having to cross too many mountains. We know that this is not the case with the arabs though.

 

[scoutsout]

If we reach a consensus on the first project I'll play tonight.

As I understand it we've got a forest chop in progress, with the option of starting another. The current chop will complete after the warrior that's currently queue'd up, so we probably ought to build something besides another military unit (unless we want a spear right away... which I don't think we need that badly...)

If we want a temple, omit the 2nd forest chop; if we want a granary, chop the second forest. @Beorn: is my understanding correct?

FWIW, temples are cheap enough that we could whip one if we wanted... which has me leaning towards the granary.