AG10 - OCC Conquest (Emperor)

[microbe]

Preturn: We are doing really good I think. No change. We still have 10-turn MPP left.

(1)1772AD: move stack. It seems Tikal is heavily defended according to previous turnlog, so I'm moving to the mountain between Tikal and Lagartero, and we can attack both cities from there.

(2)1774AD: stack in place.

(3)1776AD: We lose 3 cavs and raze Lagartero, which is defended by 4 infantry. We capture 4 slave workers and 3 artillery.

I wouldn't call Maya a non-threat and they have a lot of units in France territory. That's good.

IBT Tikal is bombarded by French bombers!

(4)1778AD: Maya pillaged a France's iron. There are lots of infantry in Tikal, so I'll pillage around it and let it starve before we declare. It would probably will be the next war.

(5)1780AD: We renew ivory by 2gpt+5g.

(6)1782AD: Bombard more tiles around Tikal. Now it only has 2 irrigated tiles untouched.

WW is 20% and lux has to be up to 10%.

(7)1784AD: Somehow there are only 5 infantry in Tikal and I'm able to redline all of them, but I dont attack. I hope the French bombers will kill them instead for us in the inter-turn.

IBT we caught Maya's spy.

(8)1786AD: There are only 4 infantry inside now. More reinforcement comes so I attack. This time RNG is in favor of us and we raze it by only one loss.

It's gonna hurt:

We have just enough gold for an immediate steal on Maya and we get Combustion.

Maya has Flight.

IBT We have Sanitation. I start on ironclads.

(9)1788AD: move stacks toward Copan.

IBT France asks for Sanitation for TM, I pay 8g instead.

(10)1790AD: I plant a spy on France. It has 13 tanks, 10 bombers and 79 infantry. Maya has 124 infantry.

Our oil deal expired and I didn't renew. We need to pay 11gpt for it and we can do it after we get Flight.

We should be able to strike Copan in the next couple of turns. We should keep hurting Maya so we can get more discount on the tech. Flight would be very good to have!

 

[microbe]

I think the next step is to get Flight and build lots of bombers. Both Fance and Maya have spare oil so we can go to war with anyone.

Maya agrees to pay some 1400g for peace, or trade Flight for Sanitation+24gpt. If we get 1400g, we can try immediate steal on France and get Mass Production, but it might be very risky since if we fail we'd have problem getting Flight. Just an option to discuss.

 

[Foresight]

LURK

Wow, I looked at the start of this a long time ago and laughed at you guys for even trying this. Now, I am laughing at myself for thinking why couldn't you. Good job guys.

DE-LURK

 

[Aggie]

Good work!! We have a long long way to go still, but the Maya already lost 70 infantry. I like the sound of flight. We could use about 20 bombers to kill redlined defenders in cities. I have a feeling that it would be better to wait for such a stack before trying to take out the French. Otoh the Maya shouldn't get a lot weaker than France. We need to keep their strength more or less balanced. I will have a look at the save in a few hours. But I won't be able to play very soon, because I am up in other SG's as well.

EDIT: When I said that the Maya aren't a threat I meant that France is the top dog now. The Maya can be controlled with help of the French, but the French are not easily controlled with the help of the Maya. So I am worried about the French (tanks and bombers) and not worried about the Maya (no fast units). But as soon as one of them is gaining too much, that civ will be the big threat of course.

ROSTER (15 turns in peace time, 10 turns when at war):
Aggie----------up
6thgentexan--on deck
betazed------out until further notice
Greebley-----holiday from July 24th to August 8th
homeyg
Microbe

 

[Aggie]

microbe, did you post the right save? I think not

 

[microbe]

Sorry, corrected!

 

[Aggie]

IHT: Looking at the options I decide not to trade yet.... But... looking again I see that we have 15 turns of a deal left. I decide to go ahead and buy flight. I first cancel all deals, including the MPP. We get flight, oil, Iron, furs, spices for Incense, Sanitation and 35 gpt. I switch our city to Bombers.

I think that this should be our last deal with the French for a while. We can't afford to make them stronger than they already are. But we needed Flight, because bombers will be crucial vs the same French (along with Panzers).

Turn 1 (1792 AD) Artillery fails to redline the 4 infantry in Copan, but we have fresh forces joining the stack.

Berlin: bomber->airport.

Turn 2 (1794 AD) Artillery and bomber fail to redline 5 infantry.
I mobilize, only to find out (what I knew already) that planes aren't built faster. So we can get 96 spt at max, 4 less than needed for bombers every turns

IT: Airport->bomber.

Turn 3 (1796 AD) Again no luck with the defenders of Copan.

Turn 4 (1798 AD) Again no luck

IT: bomber->bomber.

Turn 5 (1800 AD) The Maya only have 79 infantry left. Finally redlined defense in Copan, and a bomber destroys the civil defense! With the loss of 1 cav we raze the city. We capture two artillery.

IT: Our horse/saltpeter deal with France ends. We don't need it.

Turn 6 (1802 AD) Troop movement towards Yaxchilan. Which will take a while. France has 10 TOWs!!

IT: Bomber->bomber.

Turn 7, 8 (1804, 1806 AD) More troop movement.

IT: Bomber->bomber.

Turn 9 (1808 AD) Yaxchilan is poorly defended. We get all 3 infantry redlined, city size to 11 and we destroy the civil defense. The bombers manage to kill two redlined infantry. Still we lose 3 cavalry to one redlined defender. Finally we raze the city. We get 4 artillery from it.

The Maya have Sanitation, despite being at war with us and France

Turn 10 (1810 AD) Troop movement and random bombing in Maya land...

Things are changing rapidly. France took two cities and razed another. This is the Maya military:

And the French:

We still have 10 turns in a deal with the French though. And I feel we are not ready yet. Ideally we would want 20 bombers and 10 panzers... Or am I wrong? And what to do with the now really weaking Maya? Push on?

The VSS and a map:

 

[Aggie]

I don't know if it is possible, but we could use an army. Which means that we should capture three Mayan cities in one turn (maybe as part of a peace deal). We already have the MGL.

ROSTER (15 turns in peace time, 10 turns when at war):
Aggie
6thgentexan--up
betazed------out until further notice
Greebley------ on deck (holiday from July 24th to August 8th)
homeyg
Microbe

 

[microbe]

We really need panzers.

Maybe we can buy Mass Production and steal MT?

I think we should make peace with Maya. We also need oil from it at some point.

 

[Aggie]

We already have oil and still 10 turns into a trade deal with the French (no obligation to remain at war with the Inca though). We will have 5 more bombers until then. The big issue is the 2 extra techs we need. We can't buy them and have not enough money to steal. The Maya have nothing over us, only 1508 gold and 5 gpt. That would be enough for an immediate steal. But that is very risky on a fascist government (the French).

EDIT: If we would be in the MA fast, we might have fun with our free tech.

 

[microbe]

Can we buy Mass Production via a peace deal with France?

Risky it is, I feel cavs are not up to the job now. Maybe with bombers it's much better, but it often loses to fortified redlined infantry.

Our most problem is actually not offense, but defense. We have fewer infantry than France's tanks. But this problem cannot be solved until we get Computers..

 

[Aggie]

I think that as soon as we have TOWs and Panzers that we are (relatively) safe vs attacks of the French. So I'm afraid that we have to wait for that. Meanwhile France can go for the domination limit. Our biggest threat imho.

I don't see how we can get Mass Production via a peace deal. We will have 200 gold and 47 gpt when we make peace with the Maya, but that is not enough I fear.

We can get 2 cities for peace from the Maya (I don't think we can get 3), so maybe we should go for that after capturing one last city. We then can make an infantry army. This is probably safe in French lands and can go pillaging. The rest of our army should simply defend, with help of the Maya. Downside of that: no extra money from a Maya peacedeal and a weaker Maya tribe.

 

[Greebley]

Will Maya give us anything for peace yet? Anything meaningful that is?


I am a bit worried about continuing vs Maya. We will have to face France alone if we are not careful.

 

[Aggie]

@Greebley: We can get two cities (Quirigia and Piedras Negras) and 500 gold or we can get 1508 gold and 5 gpt. But we should only go for the cities after capturing a 3rd one, to create an amry (infantry probably).

I'm also worried about the Maya strength. This game would be won if the French were only as strong as the Maya.

 

[microbe]

I'd get the army.

We can choose to capture a non-core city to not weaken Maya too much.

I also agree we should wait for panzers.

 

[Aggie]

Yes, waiting for a panzer army might be the best. The only non-core city close to us is one we could get for peace. I'm afraid that we should:

-capture Uxmal (core city)
-get two cities and as much money as possible out of peace
-create an army
-disband the three cities (and probably adjust our hapiness, without changing the min science run)
-get two techs one way or the other
-build a panzer army
-attack France with the help of the Maya

We can't attack in 10 turns anyway, but I doubt that we have two techs by then. I think that it is not a disaster when we have to wait a bit. Stealing is risky when the subject is a Fascist government.

EDIT: It might be good to hinder the French while they are at war with the Maya.

 

[microbe]

We can gift the three cities back to Maya if needed.

10-turn is definitely not enough. Note we also have to build panzers from scratch. 20-30 turns probably. And I hope we can get Computers as free tech or trade for it, so in the end it's a modern age war.

 

[homeyg]

@Greebley: We can get two cities (Quirigia and Piedras Negras) and 500 gold or we can get 1508 gold and 5 gpt. But we should only go for the cities after capturing a 3rd one, to create an amry (infantry probably).

Isn't this game a strict OCC? Or, am I mistaken?

 

[microbe]

Read the rules carefully. It's not a strict OCC.

 

[Aggie]

No, it's not strict OCC. You can find the exact variant rules in the first post. We are not allowed to build settlers, but we can capture cities as long as we disband them at the end of the turn. This means that we can get armies. We did the same in OCC Monarch.

I like the idea of giving back the cities to the Maya.