AG5 - Honorable Space Race

AG5
IHT: I do a preflight. Things look good.
T1: Alex demands Lit. He's on the other side of the continent, so I tell him to shove it. He declares. Suwon: Warrior-> Warrior. Hittes build Hanging Gardens. Liz is Middle Ages.
T2: Chonju: Worker->Worker. Sariwon: Worker->Worker.
T3: Seoul: Settler->Library. Haeju: Warrior->Warrior
T4: Taejon: Worker->Worker.
T5: Wonsan: Horseman->Worker Kaesong: Worker-> Worker. The Mayans build the Great Lighthouse. Taegu and Chinje founded on red dots in dotmap.
T6: Cascade is dead. Licoln establishes an embasy in the capitol.
T7: Pusan: Rax->Archer. Suwon: Warrior->Library (we REALLY need infrastructre)
T8: Grr... Liz declares on us thanks to Alex the Assinine. Well, honorable tactics do say we can now attack both of them, but I'm going to (and I urge the next player to as well) find a peaceful end to this (perhaps lit? TGLb due in 5) On a good note, Iron is connected and I upgrade our first warrior to a sword in Pusan.
T9:
T10: Seoul: Archer->Sword. Wonsan: Worker->Worker. Kaesong: Worker->Worker. Americans start TGLb... We have 3 turns left on it. I trade it to Alex for Peace. England still wont talk. China won't give anything of value, so I withold from trading it.

NOTES: The two curraghs are going on a suicide mission. There is a settler in the western part of the continet that needs a space to settle down. Watch out for the English. TGLb due in 3.

SaaM

The Save
 
Originally posted by Stuck_As_a_Mac
T1: Alex demands Lit. He's on the other side of the continent, so I tell him to shove it. He declares........... Americans start TGLb... We have 3 turns left on it. I trade it to Alex for Peace.
Click to expand...
We're we getting attacked? I see no mention of any fighting. Why would you give away our monopoly? Perhaps no cash around. You could of, though I saw no mention of AI cash available, sold it to upgrade all our warriors. Then let Alex try to land. Englang is a different story though. I would wait for her first 2-3, warrior swords, get China after her for Lit, and let them duke it out. Now she may get China involved on us. With Lit broken we have to "hope" an AI dogpile does not happen. This could have been controlled.
No critism intended, and perhaps my points are not valid. I was not sitting in your chair. Just pointing out a different recourse for future reference. I do think getting a Chinese buffer with perhaps even America in it would be better than giving away our monopoly and strengthening the AI.

:QUOTE - NOTES: The two curraghs are going on a suicide mission. END QUOTE

Microbe is right. You have to review honor rules.
 
@barb: we lost our monopoly with Abe starting work on TGLb.

And I brokered peace w/ Alex because he entered the middle ages prior to any other civ in the continent. He could buy off abe (still ancient) easily and China without that much dificulty. Liz is a different story. She might not have the brokering abilites to grab other people.

and suicide missions aren't honorable?...
learn something new every day.
 
Stuck, please read the honorable rules here: RBCiv Honorable Rules

EDIT: SaaM: You scared me there for a minute, but the curragh are nicely sailing over the coast tiles :)

Tensed situation! We are at war with the nieghbours and not prepared. You had a difficult call when Greece demanded Lit. I think you did the best thing you could do :)

ROSTER:
Aggie-------------> up
Microbe-----------> on holiday until april 11th
Barbslinger ------> on deck
Melifluous
CarlosMM -------> on holiday from april 3rd until april 13th
Stuck as a Mac--> just played

Got it. I will probably play and post on monday, seeing that we have a small group next week.
 
I guess Monday is now. Things were too interesting :)

IHT: Things are looking quite OK, but being at war while we have warriors only is bad. I switch Seoul and Pusan to horses. Chonju is switched to library.

IT: An English settler pair is trying to get away, a warrior threatens Nampo'o.

Turn 1 (310 BC) Horse whipped in Pusan, Library whipped in Paegam. Sword has to cross the river to kill the warrior of the settler pair. And wins. Now the warrior from Paegam can go to Nampo'o to defend the city. That English warrior has to cross a river, but it could be lucky!

I build an embassy in China for 57 gold. They are going 90% science and have three entertainers :lol:
I also build an embassy in Athens, for 98 gold. They do 80% science and have very happy people with two lux and the MoM.

Good news: England is at war with China and won't be sending many troops to us. They are also at war with the Americans.

IT: The English warrior stays on the same place. Pusan: horse->horse. Peagam: library->barracks. Sariwon: worker->library.

Turn 2 (290 BC) I start irrigating towards Wonsan and Chonju.

IT: England comes with a sword and a warrior, but they will need three turns to reach us.

AG5-TGL.JPG


Pyongyang: TGL->library. Ulsan: library->granary (prebuild for market), Inch'on: barracks->horse

Turn 3 (270 BC) I send a horse and archer north. England now comes with a SoD!!

IT: The Great Library gives us Mystisicm, Mathematics, Map Making, Polytheism, Currency, Monarchy, Construction. Engineering is the free tech.

Taejon: worker->library.

Turn 4 (250 BC) The English SoD is a sword a 4 warrior :lol: Tokch'on founded in the tundra, starts warrior.

America gives us 14 gpt and 247 gold for Engineering. Our curragh has finally arived in the NE. No way to get to the other side. Greece has Feudalism while China has Republic, but they are at war.

IT: China and England sign peace. Wonsan: worker->market. Nampo'o: barracks->spear. Keasong: worker->library, Chinje: worker->library.
England is next to Nampo'o now. three other untis follow.

Turn 5 (230 BC) England wants to talk!! They even want to pay for peace. But first I try to win a battle or two:

AG5-englishwar.JPG


Horse kills sword, horse kills warrior, archer kills warrior. Peace with England gives us 9 gold. They have no more. I now establish an embassy in England for 73 gold. London lies in the desert. Close to marshes. Poor Lizzy :(

I spot coast on the north side of our continent:

AG5-landbridge.JPG


Therefore I switch to a galley in Seoul. We MUST make contact with the other continent because of our Great Library. Those people are advanced.

IT: TGL gives us Feudalism. Taegu: warrior->worker.

Turn 6 (210 BC) Galley goes north.

IT: TGL gives us Republic. Hyansang: FP->market.

Turn 7 (190 BC) We revolt and draw 6 turns of anarchy.

Turn 8 (170 BC) Anarchy.

IT: Maya and Greece sign a MA vs China. So at least two nations have knowledge of the other continent. This means that we can meet them as well WITHOUT suicide galley!

Turn 9 (150 BC) Correction :eek: The Maya are our neighbours:

AG5-150BC_Maya.JPG


Turn 10 (130 BC) I continue playing until we are Republic.

Turn 11, 12 (110, 90 BC) Anarchy

IT: China and Greece sign peace. We are a Republic.

Turn 13 (70 BC) We want to meet the Maya. So I switched Taegu to a galley, ready next turn.

I give China 5 gpt and gems for Incense. England gives dyes for 16 gpt.

We need marketplaces, aquaducts, libraries, but also horsemen. The troops are best placed in the border-cities near China and England. We also want troops spread around the empire, to fight of troops that might sneak on us. Our culture is quite high, but I think the those border-cities may need a temple as well.

We have 899 gold and make 46 gpt. I vote to go 100% printing press once we learn Theology from someone. It would also be nice to grab the science wonders, but that is far away in the future. Also: once the TGL is obsolete, we should make full use of our Scientific trait!

Next turn we have a galley to meet the Maya. Please also investigate the (probably) other continent (in the north).

We have a lot of workers, but small towns on the fringes of our empire can build even more of them. We need them for rails and to merge them into cities once we have hospitals.

Golden Age: We built the Great Library, now we only need a commercial wonder to trigger the GA. This can be Smith, Magellan, the UN, the Internet.
We would like to get Smith, UN AND Internet, so that's no issue I guess :) Smith would be on a nice moment, just before we have to start building factories, coal plant and the ToE. We naturally also can trigger a GA with or Hwach'a.

70 BC save
 
Loooks like England was blowing smoke! I certainly like the Smiths for GA for the very same reasons. We will leave them in the dust after that I feel. We should moderately prepare for a Chinese sneak that we can then honorably take their territory to plant an FP. Please give us a leader. 2 cores of that sort would rock. I'll have a look and hopefully play tomorrow though my current plans are to work AM and then go to a party for NCAA semi-final games. We'll see when I get home. I won't play bombed. Nice work again and things are looking good.
 
Originally posted by Stuck_As_a_Mac
and suicide missions aren't honorable?...
learn something new every day.
Click to expand...

I feel compelled to add that the inferior programming abilities of Firaxis have indeed made suicide missions a very debateable thing: on the one hand, lowered sinking rate is part of the seafaring trait, on the other hand the AIs never undertake them.

so, is throwing half your trait away necessary to be honorable if you have a seafaring civ?

or is it just fair compensation for the human that the all-knowing AIs do not do suicide mission?`After all no Ai plays honorably ever.......

edit: spelling
 
@CarlosMM: This variant game has two limitations for us:

-We must be honorable
-We must win by Space Race

The fact that a galley has less chances to sink for a Seafaring civ is wasted for the AI anyway: they don't do suicide galleys. So that part of the trait was only interesting for the humans to start with.

But all of that doesn't matter for this variant. We are restricted in many ways, not only the suicide galleys. We may NOT declare war and grab land for instance, or we have to leave the territory of an AI when they want us to go. Even bigger issues I'd say.

I have (and will have) other games where warfare will be the number one factor. This game just is different.
 
Originally posted by Aggie
@CarlosMM: This variant game has two limitations for us:

-We must be honorable
-We must win by Space Race

The fact that a galley has less chances to sink for a Seafaring civ is wasted for the AI anyway: they don't do suicide galleys. So that part of the trait was only interesting for the humans to start with.
Click to expand...
did you read my post? :hmm:

But all of that doesn't matter for this variant.
Click to expand...
and I was not addressing this specific game but more reflecting on the honorable rule on this topic in general ;)
 
@CarlosMM: Sorry, I started the sentence differently but somehow I repeated a part of your post.

The honorable rule says that a captain of a ship won't risk the lives of his crew and therefore always should land in save waters. The rules are not about adjusting your your play to that of the AI. It is about keeping promises and ... well just being honorable.
 
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