Alien encounters

[Bozo Erectus]

Originally posted by Hygro
I never mentioned anything about quantity.
Most of that flat earth stuff is not even evidence but just speculation.

But theres evidence for aliens from another planet coming to Earth? Ok lets see it, what evidence have you got. I hope its good because Id love it if the aliens came, cant wait to hear it.

 

[Hygro]

I didn't say that either, though just because I don't know where to find evidence doesn't mean there isnt any.

 

[Bozo Erectus]

So like Rumsfeld said about the WMDs, the absence of evidence is not evidence of absence? Look if you want to believe in it thats fine, I have no problem with it. But call it what it is, blind faith and not a rational conclusion.

 

[Kryten]

We must remember that there are two different aspects to this discussion about our interest in alien off-world civilizations.

First we have the scientific search.
This is being led by NASA & the European Space Agency in their efforts to detect some form of primitive life on Mars, which would give us an indication of just how common it may be throughout the rest of our galaxy. And, for the same reason, there are plans to send more space probes to investigate the three moons of Jupiter that appear to have large oceans beneath their icy crusts. Also, perhaps in 2010, NASA is planning to launch a deep space telescope that will hopefully be able to directly observe the likelihood of Earth-like planets around nearby stars. Last of all of course, we have the ongoing SETI programs, that are searching for either deliberate radio messages, or for the accidental radio emissions that an alien intelligence is expected to produce as a by-product of their civilization....much as Earth today is radiating radar, television, and radio into space.

On the other hand, we have the UFO believers.
After some 50 years of searching, collecting reports, examining blurry phographs, and studying countless eyewitnesses accounts, we still have not one shred of testable and provable evidence. All we have is the totally unreliable testimony of ‘strange lights in the sky’, or even worse, the claim that some people have made that they have been ‘abducted’....sometimes from the side of their spouses in the middle of the night while they are asleep in the centre of a large city! This lack of evidence many of the true UFO believers like to blame on some sort of ‘world governmental conspiracy’ that is hiding the ‘true’ facts of their belief.
Is it any wonder that many rational people treat such claims same way as they treat ghosts, witchcraft, fairies, bigfoot, the yeti, the Lock Ness Monster, and psychic powers....all of which have also been studied for half a century, some of them for even longer, and for which there is also not a single shred of testable proof apart from unreliable eyewitness accounts and some dubious blurry pictures?

 

[Aphex_Twin]

A Star Trek analogy would fit here:

One episode featured an primitive (to Star Trek standards) civilisation. Theese people had space flight and were already masters of their own Solar system, but lacked the technology that will allow it to really compete with the players of the Galaxy - warp drives. However, even before they achieved space flight, they picked up television and radio broadcasts from Earth. The leaders of that world kept the news to themselves. Slowly, but surely, they started spreading the fashion and ideas of the Earthlings, people learned a new language - English, and started to dress in suits which would be considered elegant by Earth standards. But, information started to leak. In a few decades, people were convinced that theese Earthlings existed, and that they controlled every aspect of their society, from education, trade, to economy. The Global goverment ceised the opportunity and started spreading roumors of their own, as when not everything went smoothly, they could simply blaim it on the Earth "aliens". And the "aliens" knew nothing about the race they have unwittingly "enslaved" .

Something to think about, but not necessarily to buy into...

 

[Hygro]

Originally posted by Kryten
psychic powers....all of which have also been studied for half a century, some of them for even longer, and for which there is also not a single shred of testable proof...

Kryten, here is where you are completely wrong. This is for another discussion so I'll make this real brief: the amount of evidence--credible, repeatable, in double blind tightly controlled lab situations--for certain psychic things such as remote viewing has basically proved it. People are simply refusing to believe it, while others are ridiculing it so that others are afraid to even consider it.

Dumb pothead, the difference between me and Rumsfield is that he's one of the highest people in our nation's military whatnot right now (being secretary of defense), with access to a lot of information. Information that people bring to him, not stuff he goes looking for.

I'm just some kid without any contacts or whatever when it comes to these kinds of things. Nobody is coming to me with intelligence on UFOs or aliens or whatever.

 

[Kryten]

Originally posted by Hygro
Kryten, here is where you are completely wrong. This is for another discussion so I'll make this real brief: the amount of evidence--credible, repeatable, in double blind tightly controlled lab situations--for certain psychic things such as remote viewing has basically proved it. People are simply refusing to believe it, while others are ridiculing it so that others are afraid to even consider it.

The Great Randi has a standing $1,000,000 challenge to anyone who can demonstrate such powers as you mention.
(James Randi, an ex-magician himself, is the sceptical "world's most outspoken investigator of the paranormal")
His site, "The James Randi Educational Foundation", is located at:
http://www.randi.org/ ......

At JREF, we offer a one-million-dollar prize to anyone who can show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event. The prize is in the form of negotiable bonds held in a special investment account.
The JREF does not involve itself in the testing procedure, other than helping to design the protocol and approving the conditions under which a test will take place. All tests are designed with the participation and approval of the applicant. In most cases, the applicant will be asked to perform a relatively simple preliminary test of the claim, which if successful, will be followed by the formal test.
Preliminary tests are usually conducted by associates of the JREF at the site where the applicant lives. Upon success in the preliminary testing process, the "applicant" becomes a "claimant."
At the formal test, in advance, an independent person will be placed in charge of a personal check from James Randi for US$10,000.
In the event that the claimant is successful under the agreed terms and conditions, that check shall be immediately surrendered to the claimant, and within ten days the James Randi Educational Foundation will pay to the claimant the remainder of the reward, for a total of US$1,000,000.
One million dollars in negotiable bonds is held by an investment firm in New York, in the "James Randi Educational Foundation Prize count," as surety for the prize funds.
Validation of this account and its current status may be obtained by contacting the Foundation by telephone, fax, or e-mail.

Please be advised that several claimants have suffered great personal embarrassment after failing these tests. I strongly advise you to conduct proper double-blind tests of any ability you believe you can demonstrate, before attempting to undergo a testing for this prize. This has saved me and many claimants much time and work, by showing that the powers were quite imaginary on the part of the would-be claimant. Please do this, and do not choose to ignore the need for such a precaution.

Here is the actual application:
http://www.randi.org/research/challenge.html

Odd how nobody has succeded in winning this challange.
But you are quite right.....this is a subject for another thread.

 

[Hygro]

How long has that been going on?

 

[Kryten]

I'm not sure exactly how long "The James Randi Educational Foundation" has existed, or for how long the $1,000,000 prize has been on offer, but I seem to remember that it was mentioned at least some 20 years ago when James Randi was debunking Uri Gellar's 'spoon-bending' abilities.

Later Edit: Ah. I remember James Randi saying on a British television show that "he would give a million dollars to anyone who was willing to prove their psychic abilities under full laboratory conditions"....and it wasn't quite 20 years ago, but more like 10.
Anyway, the "James Randi Educational Foundation" has been in operation since 1996, and is still testing applicants today.
(Check the link I posted above for more information)

 

[gael]

I remember hearing about that, hes been going some time.

 

[Shadylookin]

i imagine there are aliens, but probably just single celled organisms. if there are ingelegent aliens they aren't contacting us, if there are aliens that are abducting us(unlikly since they can be explained by waking dreams) they're not that intellegent imo, any human with half a brain that traveled all over the universe to see an alien would at least say hi. besides having a fast car(in this case space vehicle) doesn' make you a genius

 

[Japanrocks12]

I haven't been probed; rather probed people. beware CFCers