Consciousness: what it is, where it comes from, do machines can have it and why do we care?

[Birdjaguar]

I was referring to this



How does thinking about it in this manner help us. I am thinking about which things get which rights, but "helps us understand who and what we are" is good as well.

I looked for me saying that but missed it. "Us" was probably a poor word choice.

If the goal is to define "rights" for critters, then granting consciousness to all living things changes the discussion from "What is consciousness?" which is difficult to answer, to "what characteristics in animals do we value sufficiently to grant them rights?" I think that those are perhaps simpler to answer. In addition, by granting consciousness to all things first, the nature of the decision changes from "Who gets consciousness rights?" to "Who should not get rights?"


"helps us understand who and what we are" is good as well." If existence (OK, living things if you must) are all phases? of the same consciousness continuum, then we do have a common connection to everything around us. Humanity's evolution has another dimension to it beyond Darwin. How we look at ourselves may change.

 

[Birdjaguar]

I consider consciousness a vital component contributing to our survival and dominance as a species through the ages, perhaps the most vital. Us debating the meaning of it all and whatever, is a side-effect of having consciousness at this level. I don't think it wasn't intended for harboring such thoughts and doubts, that's just a 'happy accident' that has benefitted us in ways not directly related to our survival.

OK, how far down (up? back?) the tree of life you say it extends?

 

[EvaDK]

OK, how far down (up? back?) the tree of life you say it extends?

Consciousness? Don't know, but probably since basic brain structures emerged. If the brain evolved as an organ that was only required for upholding basic life functions and processing sensory inputs and instincts, it could/should be significantly smaller, less complex and require less energy.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Consciousness? Don't know, but probably since basic brain structures emerged. If the brain evolved as an organ that was only required for upholding basic life functions and processing sensory inputs and instincts, it could/should be significantly smaller, less complex and require less energy.

That is pretty far back then.

 

[EvaDK]

That is pretty far back then.

We could always ask Joe Biden or Donald Trump; they look like they were in kindergarten during the Mesozoic era.

 

[Birdjaguar]

We could always ask Joe Biden or Donald Trump; they look like they were in kindergarten during the Mesozoic era.

[Looks in the mirror....]

 

[Samson]

Diverse explanations or theories of consciousness are arrayed on a roughly physicalist-to-nonphysicalist landscape of essences and mechanisms. Categories: Materialism Theories (philosophical, neurobiological, electromagnetic field, computational and informational, homeostatic and affective, embodied and enactive, relational, representational, language, phylogenetic evolution); Non-Reductive Physicalism; Quantum Theories; Integrated Information Theory; Panpsychisms; Monisms; Dualisms; Idealisms; Anomalous and Altered States Theories; Challenge Theories.

There are many subcategories, especially for Materialism Theories. Each explanation is self-described by its adherents, critique is minimal and only for clarification, and there is no attempt to adjudicate among theories. The implications of consciousness explanations or theories are assessed with respect to four questions: meaning/purpose/value (if any); AI consciousness; virtual immortality; and survival beyond death. A Landscape of Consciousness, I suggest, offers perspective.

 

[Birdjaguar]

What a great link!

 

[amadeus]

Every one of those theories was authored by a human.

Go us!

Still batting 1.000.

Kickass.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Tests for consciousness in humans and beyond​

Highlights​

Developing validated tests for consciousness (C-tests) applicable to many different systems is a key challenge for consciousness science. We suggest a framework for doing so, highlighting fundamental challenges with respect to validation.
We propose a four-dimensional space within which potential C-tests can be positioned.
We suggest that a promising strategy is to focus on non-trivial human cases (infants, fetuses, disorders of consciousness) and then progress toward nonhuman systems (animals, artificial intelligence, neural organoids).
C-tests can inform and shape our understanding of consciousness and our evaluation of theories of consciousness.

Abstract​

Which systems/organisms are conscious? New tests for consciousness (‘C-tests’) are urgently needed. There is persisting uncertainty about when consciousness arises in human development, when it is lost due to neurological disorders and brain injury, and how it is distributed in nonhuman species. This need is amplified by recent and rapid developments in artificial intelligence (AI), neural organoids, and xenobot technology. Although a number of C-tests have been proposed in recent years, most are of limited use, and currently we have no C-tests for many of the populations for which they are most critical. Here, we identify challenges facing any attempt to develop C-tests, propose a multidimensional classification of such tests, and identify strategies that might be used to validate them.

https://www.cell.com/trends/cognitive-sciences/fulltext/S1364-6613(24)00010-X?_returnURL=https%3A%2F%2Flinkinghub.elsevier.com%2Fretrieve%2Fpii%2FS136466132400010X%3Fshowall%3Dtrue

 

[Samson]

That has an interesting way of classifying the tests at least.

Examples of proposed tests for consciousness

The scope of tests for consciousness

 

[Birdjaguar]

Find out how our minds and bodies are inextricably linked​

Instant Expert: Consciousness and the mind-body connection

Saturday 26 April 2025, 10am - 5pm | Congress Centre, 28 Great Russell Street, London, WC1B 3LS

Find out how our minds and bodies are inextricably linked

Join six world-leading experts to discover how our minds and bodies are inextricably linked, and how leading-edge neuroscience is revealing what this means for our future health and wellbeing.

www.newscientist.com

This might be interesting, but I'll be in Italy.

 

[spyke-civ4]

if brain imaging shows that some one specific thing is going on in my brain every time i am aware that i am conscious, is it philosophically unsatifactory to believe that that one thing is a neural correlate of consciousness?
sorry about the simplistic question, but this field is mystifying to me.

 

[Birdjaguar]

if brain imaging shows that some one specific thing is going on in my brain every time i am aware that i am conscious, is it philosophically unsatifactory to believe that that one thing is a neural correlate of consciousness?
sorry about the simplistic question, but this field is mystifying to me.

The question might be if one part is found to be active, is it the cause/source or just a place where consciousness shows up in a physical form?

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