An appropriate baptism gift from an atheist Godparent?

[warpus]

Background: My family is Polish catholic, living in Canada. They aren't really that religious, but my parents regularly attend mass, and my sister, who recently gave birth to my parents' first grandchild, has been attending mass more frequently lately as well.

I stopped going to church when I was 16. It didn't really cause much of a crapstorm, but my parents weren't pleased at first at all. They eventually accepted me leaving the church, but every once in a while try to get me to go to mass, and I obviously attend all the family-oriented religious celebrations like Christmas and Easter.

My sister got married a couple years ago and recently gave birth to my parents' first grandchild, a huge deal for all of us. I am excited beyond belief! My sister and her husband have been taking the child through all the regular catholic rituals and what not, and it has surprised me a bit, because my life is now fully devoid of organized religion, except for those family gatherings at Christmas and Easter, which in practice aren't very religious either.

I think they just want everything to be "proper", but they know about and respect my agnosticism and atheism, so now I'm in a situation where I need to give a good gift that doesn't offend but isn't religious either.. but is appropriate as well, coming from a Godparent.

I'm the Godfather, and traditionally that means a certain type of gift - usually religious. What kind of gift can I give that isn't religious but is appropriate? I have looked at a couple engraved necklace type things, but initially I wanted to get a book, or a couple books, to encourage my niece to eventually read.. But that doesn't seem like a very traditional or appropriate gift.. or would it be?

I feel a special bond between me and the niece and want the gift to be meaningful.. and getting something religious feels like it would be a farce. Everyone in the family knows my stance, so getting a Bible or a cross or whatever just wouldn't feel.. right. It'd feel fake. I want to give something that means something to me and can mean something to my niece when she grows up.

There are a lot of religious people on here and also a bunch of people who grew up in very secular societies that pay lip service to religion, so maybe y'all can help me out a bit. I want to give something that everyone involved will appreciate, that might even pay lip service to the faith, but will not compromise any of my beliefs either, or lack of them - I want this gift to be honest. I want it to be me.

How do I reconcile this apparent paradox?

 

[Azale]

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/s/classic-book?store=allproducts&keyword=classic+book

These are all awesome, full of well drawn illustrations, and look classy on a shelf.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Is there anything Polish you can get your neice like traditional outfits (they may want to take pictures of your neice in a traditional costume - if those exist idk) or items?

 

[peter grimes]

Yeah, I was going to suggest a book of Slavic folk tales.

 

[warpus]

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/s/classic-book?store=allproducts&keyword=classic+book

These are all awesome, full of well drawn illustrations, and look classy on a shelf.

Those look awesome!

I just had a long conversation with my mom and other sister and the sense I'm getting is that I should get something that means something to me. And I read quite a bit... and I could write something on the first page, a message for her to read once she's old enough.

But on the other hand, it seems a bit weird to give a gift that she'll be only able to enjoy once she's much older? Cause.. I'd want to probably get a set of classics, Alice in Wonderland, stuff like that.. and not really kids books you can read in kindergarten or whatever.

It looks like I will be heading to that giant bookstore that's in the area on Tuesday though

I also found out that my sister spent $300 on a golden cross necklace type thing, so the standards are very high! My mom says that in Poland giving money is common, so I could include some as well.

 

[civ_king]

Background: My family is Polish catholic, living in Canada. They aren't really that religious, but my parents regularly attend mass, and my sister, who recently gave birth to my parents' first grandchild, has been attending mass more frequently lately as well.

I stopped going to church when I was 16. It didn't really cause much of a crapstorm, but my parents weren't pleased at first at all. They eventually accepted me leaving the church, but every once in a while try to get me to go to mass, and I obviously attend all the family-oriented religious celebrations like Christmas and Easter.

My sister got married a couple years ago and recently gave birth to my parents' first grandchild, a huge deal for all of us. I am excited beyond belief! My sister and her husband have been taking the child through all the regular catholic rituals and what not, and it has surprised me a bit, because my life is now fully devoid of organized religion, except for those family gatherings at Christmas and Easter, which in practice aren't very religious either.

I think they just want everything to be "proper", but they know about and respect my agnosticism and atheism, so now I'm in a situation where I need to give a good gift that doesn't offend but isn't religious either.. but is appropriate as well, coming from a Godparent.

I'm the Godfather, and traditionally that means a certain type of gift - usually religious. What kind of gift can I give that isn't religious but is appropriate? I have looked at a couple engraved necklace type things, but initially I wanted to get a book, or a couple books, to encourage my niece to eventually read.. But that doesn't seem like a very traditional or appropriate gift.. or would it be?

I feel a special bond between me and the niece and want the gift to be meaningful.. and getting something religious feels like it would be a farce. Everyone in the family knows my stance, so getting a Bible or a cross or whatever just wouldn't feel.. right. It'd feel fake. I want to give something that means something to me and can mean something to my niece when she grows up.

There are a lot of religious people on here and also a bunch of people who grew up in very secular societies that pay lip service to religion, so maybe y'all can help me out a bit. I want to give something that everyone involved will appreciate, that might even pay lip service to the faith, but will not compromise any of my beliefs either, or lack of them - I want this gift to be honest. I want it to be me.

How do I reconcile this apparent paradox?

You have to be a practicing Catholic to be a Godparent...

 

[Old Hippy]

well as god parent a savings account as a start for colledge education shows that you take the role seriously and its non religous (which i thought was the primary role of godparents?) it depends how the family treats $ gifts tho... i used mine for a deposit on my first house as it was topped up (also by various relations) over the years.

 

[warpus]

Is there anything Polish you can get your neice like traditional outfits (they may want to take pictures of your neice in a traditional costume - if those exist idk) or items?

Interesting idea, but it wouldn't really be me. Plus I only have a week to do this (Yeah, I know, I totally forgot about this!) so I don't think I would have time to figure out where to get something like that and get it shipped in. Interesting idea but I'm not feeling it!

Yeah, I was going to suggest a book of Slavic folk tales.

I wonder what I'll find in that big bookstore (Chapters) that I now think I definitely will head to on Tuesday after work. I've been thinking more traditional classics, like Alice in Wonderland.. Non Polish stuff.. But a Slavic angle might be worth looking into. I think I will just walk around the bookstore until something worthy jumps out at me.

I'm thinking the book angle will make a good gift now. I'm not sure what else would! But keep the suggestions coming, and thanks

 

[warpus]

You have to be a practicing Catholic to be a Godparent...

I won't tell God if you don't

well as god parent a savings account as a start for colledge education shows that you take the role seriously and its non religous (which i thought was the primary role of godparents?) it depends how the family treats $ gifts tho... i used mine for a deposit on my first house as it was topped up (also by various relations) over the years.

$ baptism gifts are apparently very common in Poland, so this would probably be very well received, at least by the Polish side of the family. My sister gave me the honour of being Godfather even though I'm not religious, because.. well.. Heck.. It's a cultural artifact as much as it is religious. I feel honoured to have been asked.

I wonder how one would go about starting such a savings account though? Something I would have to coordinate with the parents maybe? Hmm..

 

[Old Hippy]

its harder now days, I had a booklet,(and was encouraged to add to it, it was in my godfathers/mine joint names) a plastic card is not quite the same

 

[warpus]

I might give a nice leatherbound book set and some cash and ask them to put it in her education fund or something. Then they can figure out the logistics. Win/win!

 

[hobbsyoyo]

You can get a traditional Polish gift without actually coming from Poland. The money is a great example of this - a traditional gift that isn't actually Polish. Ask your folks what kind of gifts are typical for Polish baptisms.

 

[warpus]

Called my mom, she says in Poland most people gave jewellery or money.

My other sister (the godmother) is giving a $300 golden cross thingy.. Setting the bar high!

edit: And perhaps this didn't really warrant a thread, but with such a religions/not religious/secular/etc. crossection of people here, it seemed like the perfect place to ask.

I have a very good idea of what I'm doing now in terms of the gift, so for the rest of the thread we can discuss the logic behind an atheist being godfather.. if anyone's interested. Thanks for all who helped! Some of you may be invited to the baptism.

 

[classical_hero]

Why not get something modern, like maybe a tablet or something, so that when the child gets old enough (s)he can use it to play with and when (s)he gets older (s)he can use it to learn from. obviously at an early age (s)he wouldn't be able to use it.

This is coming from a protestant where we don't do any of this and find it to be a superstition. baptism is for believers.

 

[warpus]

Why not get something modern, like maybe a tablet or something, so that when the child gets old enough (s)he can use it to play with and when (s)he gets older (s)he can use it to learn from. obviously at an early age (s)he wouldn't be able to use it.

This is coming from a protestant where we don't do any of this and find it to be a superstition. baptism is for believers.

The thing with a tablet is that technology moves along so fast that by the time she could use it, it would likely be out of date.

The one thing to understand about all this is that in Poland religion and culture go hand in hand. A lot of our cultural traditions are religious in nature, such as Easter, Christmas, or whatever. A lot of our cultural identity is wrapped up in catholicism, for various historical reasons.

It makes it at times rather difficult for an atheist to participate in Polish society... but I'm doing my best, without being too much of a hypocrite. I won't go to church for example, usually, because to me it is insulting to all the people there who actually believe. They dont know that I don't - but standing there for 1 hour and pretending that I believe seems insulting to me. I'd only enter a church under honest pretenses. I was there to bless food for easter (Another Polish tradition) for example, but only because I wanted to be there for my niece's first Easter photo shoot, with the basket and all.

I don't think my sister is going to be raising her daughter very religiously.. but.. things like first communion and confirmation are going to be interesting times for me for sure. I speak my mind, but during times like those I want to be respectful. I'm also supposed to be a spiritual guide for my niece now, as her Godfather - so I guess in my case that means respectfully nudging her away from organized religion. Paradoxes all around..

 

[capslock]

My sister gave me the honour of being Godfather even though I'm not religious, because.. well.. Heck.. It's a cultural artifact as much as it is religious. I feel honoured to have been asked.

So, just give a traditional "religious" gift then. After all, it has cultural meaning as much as religious. You want to participate in the religious ceremony, but don't want to get too wrapped up in it by giving a specifically non-religious gift? SOunds to me like the dickhead athiest stereotype rearing its head. If you participate, just give a traditional gift, it sounds like they aren't specifically religious anyway.

If you must make a point of being an athiest, do it some other time and place, or don't participate at all.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Those look awesome!

I just had a long conversation with my mom and other sister and the sense I'm getting is that I should get something that means something to me. And I read quite a bit... and I could write something on the first page, a message for her to read once she's old enough.

But on the other hand, it seems a bit weird to give a gift that she'll be only able to enjoy once she's much older? Cause.. I'd want to probably get a set of classics, Alice in Wonderland, stuff like that.. and not really kids books you can read in kindergarten or whatever.

It looks like I will be heading to that giant bookstore that's in the area on Tuesday though

I also found out that my sister spent $300 on a golden cross necklace type thing, so the standards are very high! My mom says that in Poland giving money is common, so I could include some as well.

My suggestion: A couple of books (because the gift of literacy is never a bad thing), a stuffed toy to cuddle with until she's old enough to read, and if you are expected to give money, an education fund would be appropriate.

 

[warpus]

So, just give a traditional "religious" gift then. After all, it has cultural meaning as much as religious. You want to participate in the religious ceremony, but don't want to get too wrapped up in it by giving a specifically non-religious gift? SOunds to me like the dickhead athiest stereotype rearing its head. If you participate, just give a traditional gift, it sounds like they aren't specifically religious anyway.

If you must make a point of being an athiest, do it some other time and place, or don't participate at all.

Listen, I'm being completely honest here in my intentions and wanting to respect the ceremony.

The only person being a dick is you.

 

[Cutlass]

You have to be a practicing Catholic to be a Godparent...

The priest my brother went to refused to perform the baptism until they came up with godparents who are practicing catholics. And so the girl went 4 years not baptized. Maybe some priests just aren't as strict about asking about that sort of thing.

 

[warpus]

One of the purposes of this thread was to get a feel for what's appropriate here. Having talked it over with my mom and other sister, the religious element doesn't appear to be that important, in this instance.

This is really all about my sister, so if it turned out that a religious icon was absolutely necessary, I would bite my tongue and go with it. No way am I creating any sort of scene or even friction in a moment so important to my sister, who I love dearly. I am all in and want to be as respectful as possible.

The bond between me and my niece is a new one but already very important to me too though. I want this gift to mean something to both of us. I want it to be a gesture. This isn't about wanting to be true to my "atheist principles" or any nonsense like that. The gift has to mean something. This is important to me.

Valka, maybe I'll give her the yeti. Wouldn't that be an early derailing of the around the world project part 2