Anyone for SW:TOR?

[Disgustipated]

That's not dumbing down. Making the game into a single player game is dumbing down imho. The game should encourage multiplayer behaviour (it's one of the M's in MMO). Playing flashpoints is more complex than the single player aspect of the game. How else our we going to learn our roles? Granted the roles seem pretty easy right now. But I have yet to get any real practice tanking. It's frustrating. I've done the heroic areas of each planet, but the only flash point I have done (for real) is Esseles which you can't really tank anyways (no real tanking skills until 14 and 16)

 

[Thrawn]

How does a LFG dumb things down? It's certainly more convenient, but I fail to see how it dumbs anything down.

 

[Disgustipated]

I certainly don't want to turn the game into a WOW clone, that's for sure. I don't want to give that impression. One thing I hate about WOW now is the pets everyone has. It seems everyone has to run around with a stupid pet, even in dungeons. And with the new expansion they want to have pets fighting each other. That's the dumbest thing I ever heard. It's like they are trying to market the game to 5 year olds. I think I have seen a couple of pets with SWTOR, maybe they got them with a special edition, but thankfully not everyone has one.

So what are all your thoughts on flying mounts. My brother was talking about them, but I told him I didn't think they were possible. I don't think the game is true 3D. I can't think of a single bioware game that was actual 3D. And the world isn't a big contiguous world like in WOW (although that isn't true contiguous). It's not too big a deal for me. I just wish you didn't have to pay hefty taxi services to get between zones, and could use your own personal speeder.

Quick Question: I finally started to learn the auction house (galactic trade network), but I still don't know how to compare an item I'm putting up for sale with what's already in auction. For instance, in WOW you could shift click the item in the search part of the AH to find like items in the AH. This was useful so you could price your goods accordingly. So far I've been pricing my goods fairly close to the recommended selling price. But I think I could get a lot more out of them because they are selling very well. Almost all of my items sold. So how do I compare what I'm putting up with what's already on the market? The search fields for searching for items is not very useful for me.

 

[Akka]

That's not dumbing down. Making the game into a single player game is dumbing down imho.

Which is precisely what a LFG tool do.
No LFG tool means you actually have to INTERACT with people (ask about people interested, discuss, form a group, look for others, etc.) rather than just click a button and appears in an instance and play in bot-mode.
I thought that WoW had illustrated this point strikingly enough.

 

[Disgustipated]

But if the people aren't there because server populations are too low, what are you to do? I admit I could find groups in the evenings, but I can't play evenings anymore, I can only play during the day time, or early morning hours (like 3AM). It's impossible to find a group to do an instance with. I admit I can find groups for the heroic areas, but it seems like no one wants to run flash points, and I don't understand why. It's like they only want to play a single player game.

I'm sorry, but I'm not buying it. This game simply is not made for people who work the night shift. I'm pissed right now. 2 days in a row they are applying a patch. WTH. It's like they don't want people to play their game unless they work day shift.

I hate god damn patches!!!!! I want to play the game I paid for right now. I think they should refund us the money for the time the servers are unavailable.

Anyways, I have used the general chat (both on the planet and in the republic fleet) to look for groups, but no one responded. I can't force people to run an instance with me. I think the demographics of the game may be a problem. All of Bioware's games are single player games, and I think a lot of people playing this game just don't want to group up. The reason why Wow's lfg works even during the off hours is it goes across several servers. You are bound to find someone willing to run the same instance even during the off hours just due to the sheer number of people playing.

 

[Thrawn]

Which is precisely what a LFG tool do.
No LFG tool means you actually have to INTERACT with people (ask about people interested, discuss, form a group, look for others, etc.) rather than just click a button and appears in an instance and play in bot-mode.
I thought that WoW had illustrated this point strikingly enough.

Depending on the difficulty of content the group is doing, there may be zero need to interact with the rest of your group outside forming it as well. Even then, the interaction may simply be one person going "Looking for more to do some group thing, need XXX", with others simply responding with they'll go. And then the group would end up in bot-mode anyway.

The most common complaint I hear about LFG isn't dumbing down(which I don't believe it does), is that it removed part of the community aspect in exchange for convenience. On high population servers you can probably do without it, but it'd be far harder to do group content on low population servers.

 

[Akka]

But if the people aren't there because server populations are too low, what are you to do? I admit I could find groups in the evenings, but I can't play evenings anymore, I can only play during the day time, or early morning hours (like 3AM). It's impossible to find a group to do an instance with. I admit I can find groups for the heroic areas, but it seems like no one wants to run flash points, and I don't understand why. It's like they only want to play a single player game.

Guess which system is to blame for that ?
Wonder from which game most players come from ?

Depending on the difficulty of content the group is doing, there may be zero need to interact with the rest of your group outside forming it as well. Even then, the interaction may simply be one person going "Looking for more to do some group thing, need XXX", with others simply responding with they'll go. And then the group would end up in bot-mode anyway.

Difficulty also plays a role, but a tiny. When doing the low-level instances in WoW, we talked.
Talking suddendly disappeared when the LFG tool appeared. It didn't came back when "harder" instances appeared at the end of WotLK - people just left and re-queued after a wipe.
It's not just a coincidence.

The most common complaint I hear about LFG isn't dumbing down(which I don't believe it does), is that it removed part of the community aspect in exchange for convenience. On high population servers you can probably do without it, but it'd be far harder to do group content on low population servers.

Removing a part of a game in exchange for convenience IS dumbing down...
So it seems we just disagree on a semantic point

And "harder to group" is something I can live with better than having the social aspect removed in favour of an auto-grouping system.

 

[Thrawn]

And "harder to group" is something I can live with better than having the social aspect removed in favour of an auto-grouping system.

Yeah I feel the other way. Being a not very social person I've never really cared for the so called social aspects of MMOs.

 

[Disgustipated]

I always figured if you want social join a guild. So far I've had little social interaction in the groups I've been in for heroic areas, so I'd say forcing people to interact to group up isn't really working. No one talks after the group is formed anyways. Usually I get a hello or hey, that's about it. And then thanks at the end. Guilds are best for social interaction. Although I have been in some guilds where no one says a word.

 

[Akka]

Yeah I feel the other way. Being a not very social person I've never really cared for the so called social aspects of MMOs.

WTH are you playing a MMO then, which entire difference with a single player is precisely in the social aspect ?

 

[Thrawn]

dunno. I started playing WoW with some internet friends, through them got my first taste of raiding, went looking for a guild that more fit my schedule given that I was playing with americans at the time, and just kind of went from there. I guess it would be more accurate to say that outside my guild, I don't really interact(much less socialise) with anyone at all, nor do I really care about anyone outside my guild. There's even members of my guild I don't really care too much for, I mean we have one guy who physically says lol, and adds it to the end of nearly every sentence.

Outside raiding, I don't really login a whole lot, mess around on alts occasionally but I can never usually bring myself to do much with them. From what I saw in the beta, I can quite easily see myself quite easily just playing ToR as a single player game, playing through each of the classes stories, and not really touching the endgame much. Now if only I could afford to get it.

Once I go back to my studies later this year I won't have time for raiding or even alot of time for games anyway.

 

[Quackers]

I echo your comment on galatic trade network pricing disgustipated. At the moment I'm adding like 50% to the automated price and I have no idea what the same item is selling for elsewhere.

I don't know how LFG tool is dumbing down. All it does is remove the monotamy of standing around in Stormwind and typing /2 LF5M LBRS Need 1 tank, 2 healers and 2 DPS. Which was the case in vanilla where it took AGES to find a group. The difficulty remains the same. I think a reasonable criticism of it is that players never go beyond there home cities so Azeroth is freaking empty, and that there is less server community spirit then there was in Vanilla.

Now LFR is definitely dumbing down, the raids are made so easy it's very, very difficult to fail. Typically the boss fight has like 1 or 2 mechanics in it and thats all you have to pay attention too.

 

[Leoreth]

I've started with SWTOR a week ago, and it has absorbed almost every evening since then.

The game itself didn't thrill me that much before I bought it. But I quit WoW last year because it really started to annoy me with the powergaming requirement in the community, and my circle of guildmates/friends I held out for for so long has slowly been dissolving. I mainly returned to SWTOR because these people all started flocking to it, so I did too. I was pleasantly surprised. For all the snarky "when in doubt, copy WoW" comments it gets, to me SWTOR is almost an anti-WoW. The story oriented nature, even in group environments, is really a lot more satisfying than WoW's grindfest. Of course, I'm only level 24 right now, so I'll have to wait how the atmosphere is when everyone is at the level cap.

Things that annoy me currently:
- too many skills / insufficient interface to arrange them
- I often involuntarily click on my companion when I want to loot something or start a dialog
- outleveling the quests is not much fun for someone like me who can't turn down or ignore a quest
- WoW comfort features are missed, like displaying usable quest items next to the quest display, linking quests in the chat interface, or moving your character while typing in the chat interface (worst one)

 

[Disgustipated]

I hate MMO's. Grrr. After waiting over 10 minutes for a elite boss spawn for a quest, some Empire Stealthed Assassin tags him first. I'm so pissed right now. This is the first planet I have seen Empire players. And they are pissing me off already. It sucks that we seem to share this quest. So I'm typing this post as I wait another 10+ minutes.

And I'm also pissed I can't get a couple heroic quests done. I too, am a quest whore, and have to do every one I find. I can't turn one down. I have outleveled every area since Coruscant.

So what is you alls favorite planet so far? I'm only level 31, so I haven't seen too much. But Nar Shadaa is my favorite so far followed by Tatooinne. Both planets I chose because they resemble the area where I grew up. Nar Shadaa is like Las Vegas on steroids, and Tattoine is desert similar to the desert I live in. I like Tattooine because it's wide open. Too many planets so far have been crowded cities. Nar Shadaa was a crowded city, but visually it was pretty cool.

 

[Disgustipated]

Turns out there were two boss mobs with the same name. One for Empire, and one for Republic. Strange.

I just want to say this game is difficult. A lot of people are saying it's easier than WOW. Although I think it is the top raiders saying this. I doubt raiding will be as tough as WOW raiding (before it is nerfed), but some of these heroics areas are getting difficult. Every single one of us was above the level of the quest (25), and I walk in there as a tank, and I die within 15 seconds. And I'm 7 levels above the mobs. You'd never have this problem in WOW. I can't imagine how difficult that quest would be at the appropriate level of 25. The quest name is Search and Rescue by the way. It turned out we needed some CC, and we needed an off tank. Despite all my gear being blue and orange, I couldn't take on all the mobs at once. And I'm level 32! I'm not complaining, but I just think a lot of people are too hard on this game saying it's easier than WOW.

Another thing that makes it more difficult from a Guardian perspective is the sheer number of useful abilities I have when tanking. My hand really can only reach over to the 6 key, and then I use keys like R, f, and v (for kick- but v is hard to stretch to). Targetting enemies seems more difficult than WOW too. And I have to manual use the mouse to click on some abilities because there just are too many. My brother was telling me how easy this game was, so I wasn't worried about tanking. But despite having the appropriate talents, I feel like I'm taking too much damage.

 

[MobBoss]

I dont think this game is too difficult. As a Sith Mrauder, I've actually solo'd some of the Heroic 4s with my healer companion. Yes, its hard to do even with a significant level advantage (Green mobs), and its also dependent on the quest - some are possible, some arent.

Anyway, that being said, this games been fairly easy so far. Almost too easy. And i'm at level 40 right now. I am enjoying the main quest line and find it compelling. But since I too am a 'quest whore' and try to do every quest that will give me xp (green or higher) I usually find myself much higher level than the quests I am doing. Ah well.

 

[Disgustipated]

I'm not saying it's too hard, but I do find it strange I can't solo this content while other people can. I don't have a healer companion yet, however. So my health tends to drop fast. Sometimes I wonder if this shield generator in my off-hand is working right. It's supposed to be automatic right? Because I can't find any way to activate it. I have some talents to help with damage mitigation, but I still feel I take too much damage.

edit: I want to try this guy's tanking build and strat. It seems like it will mesh well with my play style. Right now I don't have the talent to less riposte cost, and I really want that talent. So I will respec. I am a riposte whore, and this build utilizes that. I'm also a force sweep whore. http://blackrabbit2999.blogspot.com/2011/12/swtor-guardian-tanking-guide.html

 

[Leoreth]

I know shield generators only from my tank companion, and from how it looks like it's just the technology equivalent to plain shields in fantasy, i.e. passive armor and stat boosts.

 

[Akka]

I just want to say this game is difficult. A lot of people are saying it's easier than WOW. Although I think it is the top raiders saying this. I doubt raiding will be as tough as WOW raiding (before it is nerfed), but some of these heroics areas are getting difficult.

The game is not easier than WoW when it comes to leveling (thank God). It's actually quite harder than today WoW, and probably on par with Vanilla WoW. It's not difficult either, though.

I don't have any idea how easy/hard it is for raiding, but I've heard it's not hard for good players.

Another thing that makes it more difficult from a Guardian perspective is the sheer number of useful abilities I have when tanking. My hand really can only reach over to the 6 key, and then I use keys like R, f, and v (for kick- but v is hard to stretch to). Targetting enemies seems more difficult than WOW too. And I have to manual use the mouse to click on some abilities because there just are too many. My brother was telling me how easy this game was, so I wasn't worried about tanking. But despite having the appropriate talents, I feel like I'm taking too much damage.

You've got a keyboard, not a joypad, use it !
Use combination key, they can easily multiply the number of keys available.

A setting that works for me : the usual ZQSD (or WASD for you QWERTY guys) for moving.
Then the abilities I use most and which requires the most reactivity are put on 1, 2, 3, 4, C, F, E and Q and end up on the main quickslot bar.
For the secondary quickslot bar I use Shift + the same keys, and for the left quickslot bar I use Ctrl + the same keys. Both are for for abilities I use often, but which need less reactivity.
Then I use Alt + the usual keys for the right bar and the abilities I use sometimes and want to have on shortkey.
In WoW I used Alt Gr + the usual keys for the last bar, in SWTOR I use them for the four companion abilities available on his/her own pannel (rarely need to use all of them, so I don't need to expand his/her bar onto mines).

For the abilities I don't use often and which requires no reactivity (like "back to the fleet" or so), I use the gaps on the bar (only 8 quick keys, so 4 slots available on each) and mouseclick them.

This amount to 32 shortkeys, which is plenty enough for SWTOR. I can't imagine how you managed in WoW if you had only 6 keys, even with the 32 I started to feel cramped when I still played it

 

[Disgustipated]

As a healer I usually only had like 4 heals. My shaman healer I rarely used more than the 4 heals plus my oh **** macro (nature's swiftness + GHW) and cleanse. And Earth Shield of course. Healing is so easy in wow, except bad groups of course. It's a very laid back job compared to tanking. Tanking is high stress for me.