Beneath the Jade Moon (pre-NES)

[Angst]

The name of the heartland imperial continent escapes me, but can I settle on the coastal south river banks in the western part? I'll paint something in paint now.

edit: paint'd

House Name: House Jaysiri
Sigil / Words: The sigil is two locked hands as if confirming a trade, or greeting. "Sun Leaves, Rises Again"
Lord: Juniri, 52 years, married to Maynima, aged 19
Family: Juniri first had children with the woman Jadani, who was discovered to follow the False Stone a while ago and was ordered executed through a number of trials. Her children, Jon (m), Kauvsar (m) and Tiria (f) were judged as having no affliation with the false emperor, and Juniri himself was also spared. He then married Maynima three years ago, with whom he has had no children with yet. As Jon, Kauvsar and Tiria are born from a follower of the False Stone, they have issues with legitimacy for controlling the House in the situation of Juniri's death. Juniri's brother, Pevnar (48) is technically the closest heir, but he is widely known to be sterile. The whole affair was really messy, and it seems as if it has not been finished yet, especially with a number of usurpers in the warrior class who feels the well-treatment of merchants is despicable in the eyes of the cultural traditions.
Ancestors: This, however, I have issues describing in detail. The reason why I'm so late about things...
Holdings: This too.
History: And this too. But I assume Jaysiri has traditionally engaged more in the merchant's trade and naval affairs, which gave them power through imports of foodstuffs from the region to the Emperor in the east.
Sources of Income: Jaysiri is exceptional in the respect of their treatment of the despised merchant class: Most of them have genuinely profitable laws held to support them and are even, at times, treated with blessings of spirits. Jaysiri almost exclusively benefits on its position as a river mouth, transporting salt and foodstuffs from the region to the heartlands.
Location: I have no pin as a point, but see the above area, please. Feel free to place cities along the coast and river banks.

 

[Starlife]

All right, lj. That's a good start. I like the family tensions you've created.

 

[Devercia]

To what degree are we newcomers treated compared to the principle players?

I am thinking of taking the spot North of the Pale City, but I might change. I still have not read everything so lore might push me elsewhere.

 

[Seon]

House Name: House Renatii in name only.

Heraldry: Currently an upturned sword.

Motto: We fight so we can live in peace.

Current Family Head: Tynios the Forgelord

Family: Lots of people and nobody at the same time.

Ancestors: Nobody in the house or outside gives a ****.

Holdings: Renirith: Tiny little city on top of the mountains where most of the iron works happen

Denire: Tiny little city where most of the farming happens.

Castle Taernith

Castle Tolis (set up by the Denim Renatii during their flight)

Countless little farming villages down south, mostly owned by the Amur Renatii, as the Cala Renatii are often totally nomadic. Grows spices and trades through the river.

Semi-nomadic tribes: somewhere down south where the majority of population is involved in lifestock growing. Due to the traditional inheritance laws stating that only the eldest inherit the lifestock, majority of the tribes are soldiers and guards that defend against the wolves, thieves, foreigners, Aulesiris, and random Esurk raiders that appear every now and then.



Family Names:
Cala Renatii (the southernmost tribe of the Renatii. Typically spends most of their days guarding sheeps and killing other House Renatii member)

Denim Renatii (Current ruler of the fragmented Renatii nobles, holding court in the city of Renirith. Conquered Renirith from the former ruler by flipping side to the Second Emperor. Also holds the city of Denirith. The House also boasts foundation of the Shulensi Order, although most of the priesthood has been supplanted by the Amur Renatii at this point.)

Amur Renatii (one of the southern tribes. Spends most of its days shepherding and growing spices utilized by the herbalist priests. Amur priests are respected throughout the Renatii lands for their knowledge)

Lareti Renatii (owns the mines and desperately hopes that nobody comes and destroys them)

Felin Renati (destroyed)

And dozens of other minor nobles who nobody cares about, all sharing the name of House Renatii. Note that the validity of majority of the names that claim the Renatii family blood is dubious. Only the Denim Renatii and the Felin Renatii are confirmed as having kept the bloodline pure)


History: The history and knowledge of the Foundation of the House is cloudy at best, considering the fact that most members of the House are illiterate.

What is known, however, is the fact that they were endorsed by the Emperor and encountered a storm within a few month of setting out. Shipwrecked and without a way to inform the Emperor where they had drifted ashore… and in fact without knowledge of where the **** they were anyways, they attempted to settle on the first river they found and set up farming. Problem was that the lands that they found was barren and the plants they brought from the Jade City were unsuitable for growth there. The plants that seemed edible located by foraging efforts were often bitter and poisonous. Hundreds of Aulesiri died.

At this point, some men who managed to identify some edible plants or even domesticated them were held in high, even religious, regard by many of the survivors of the expedition. Soon, some men began to declare that these men had divine connection to god-spirit Shulensi and the Shulensi Order was founded.

However, foraged plants and those that they managed to grow were not enough for the settlers, who numbered in thousands, to survive. Aside from a couple of hundred men and women who decided to settle in the river (the site of which became the city of Denirith), the rest scattered out into the wilderness to find other means of sustaining themselves.

These they found in the local population. Although most of the nobles and men were slaughtered by the unexpectedly harsh resistance of the local population, some succeeded in slaughtering the local tribes of natives and stealing their livestock. These men and women adapted the semi-nomadic lifestyle of the local tribes.

Many more would simply die of exhaustion and starvation in the wilds.

However, the mistake that the founders of House Renatii made at this moment: the fact that they had sent out their own family members as the leaders of the expedition, would haunt them for centuries to come. All the semi-nomadic tribes shared the Renatii name.

The problem showed itself when the House Renatii survivors were rediscovered by the Imperial Expedition of 942. The Imperial expedition allowed the House of Renatii to set up Denire as a true city in Aulesiri format. They also helped them build the city of Renirith and the castle of Taernith. The Shulensi Order was accepted by the Emperor as member of the orthodox.

Before, the position as the Head of Renatii Family was seen as a mere formality whose only power was to call an annual family meeting. Suddenly, the position was much more powerful. This jealousy and envious feeling towards the Denim Renatii branch of the family exploded when the Felin Renatii branch suddenly laid claim to the city of Renirith.

It was during this civil war that the Esurk tribe struck.

Although the Shulensi Order hurriedly tried to order the cessation of conflict between the family members, it was far too late. The Esurk raiders, noticing large holes made to the defensive structure of Denire made during the civil war, poured into the city and sacked it.

The priesthood fled and came under the protection of the Amur Renatii, who were fleeing north away from the Esurk along with the Cala Renatii. Denim Renatii soon made Tolis up north, which would be their seat of power for years to come before.

The Felin Renatii soon gained control of the city of Renirith and declared itself as a rightful head of the Family and called all family members to form a host. With majority of the family responding the call, they managed to repulse the Esurk raiders away and chase them down south until the then head of Felin Renatii, Lord Garth, was struck in the eye with an arrow fired by an Esurk archer.

The host fell apart immediately after the battle without a proper leader and the families returned to their semi-nomadic lifestyle.

Felin Renatii remained the head of the household, although their control over the rest of the family members would be tumultuous at best.

Although the Cala Renatii and the Amur Renatii had obtained iron weapons and armor, their Esurk enemies were often much more powerful and fierce. It was not until the discovery of Felweed by the Shulesi Order that the defenders had an advantage over the Esurk invaders.

The historians state that during one summer, a host of Cala Renatii and Amur Renatii gathered to face one of the largest incursion of Esurk enemies. The commanders of the combined Renatii army ordered Felweed to be burnt before the battle in order to “give courage to the men.”

Historians also record that the Cala Renatii and Amur Renatii soldiers, in that battle, attacked with such ferocity that even the Esurk army was intimidated and taken aback. The Renatii soldiers hacked and slashed without regard to their personal health and did things that even the Imperial Historians refused to record to fallen Esurk corpses.

Perhaps due to the fact that the soldiers were utterly uncontrollable and the generals equally out of their minds, the Renatii army lost the battle. Esurk army fled back south. Future Renatii general would learn to refine their use of Felweed. It was not until the Imperial expeditions that the hold over their territories would be cemented.

Then the Pale Brother wars came. House Renatii became infamous due to the fact that they were the only ones that sided with the deposed the Emperor and continued to fight in his name until the moment that they heard that the Jade City had fallen.

It was the Denim Renatii, due to their position up north in the territory, that first heard the word. They immediately had the messenger that was proclaiming the news to the world killed and sent their own messengers down south to the Cala and Amur Renatii. The three conspired to depose the Felin Renatii from their seat of power in Renirith.

The Shulensi order declared that the new Emperor was the Truest and the Holiest descendent all along and proceeded to denounce Felin Renatii’s claim on Renirith, questioning the legitimacy of the then leader of the Household. The Felin Renatii’s attempts to defend their realm failed against the horde of Cala and Amur Renatii’s experienced nomadic warriors.

The leaders of the conspiracy placed the House Denim back in charge of Renirith and welcomed the new Imperial army. They slaughtered the House Felin Renatii’s bloodline. Then they returned home because by the gods, the sheeps require much attention to grow. The Cala Renatii and the Amur Renatii expected the House Denim to be easy pushover until the moment that the House Denim rebuilt Denire and welcomed their own chapter of the Order Shulensi.

 

[Starlife]

Wait, so Seon, disregard your past info? And who the hell is Saint Shulensi? We have saints here? We're Catholic? Eeeek. How about I just write your profile up? I think I know what kind of house you want to play as.

EDIT: And the family and ancestors sections appear to be blatant displays of laziness.

To what degree are we newcomers treated compared to the principle players?

I am thinking of taking the spot North of the Pale City, but I might change. I still have not read everything so lore might push me elsewhere.

Welcome to the NES! It doesn't depend on whether or not you are a newcomer or an oldtimer. Anyone is welcome here. I just ask that you read the OP and fit your house somehow within that backstory, with information relevant to our current time (1370 A.R.). It's not really about quantity of information, but quality and conciseness, giving myself and fellow players a good idea of what kind of house you want to play as and what that house's current status is in our realm.

The spot north of the Pale City would indeed be interesting, but you're welcome to plop yourself down wherever you'd like, if indeed your reading of the OP takes you elsewhere.

The way to get on my side personally with this NES, is posting your information within a suitable timeframe. Since you are new to the thread, I'll give you time, of course, but others have left their info stagnant for a few weeks now -- and yet others expressed interest, but have since flaked out.

 

[Seon]

Yeah disregard it.

As for the ancestors/retainer section, you contacted me just today way after the deadline when I was busy working on something else so that's what you get.

As for the saint...

Shulensi is the god-spirit of warfare and protection, yet this spirit was not appointed as such until well after the migrations and the death of Luseysi. For a long while, he was a god-spirit of pointed exploration.

Yeah. So maybe I forgot that he was a god-spirit instead of prophet/saints.

Could've sworn that it was the other way around though.

 

[Starlife]

I seem to recall pages of posts featuring discussions between myself and The Strategos about how, while the term "saint" is technically correct, it annoyingly brings uncharacteristic Catholic terminology into a culture that is decidedly not Catholic.

Even prophet would be inaccurate. The only prophet would be Luseysi himself. Shulensi was (probably) never a real person.

 

[Seon]

I seem to recall pages of posts featuring discussions between myself and The Strategos about how, while the term "saint" is technically correct, it annoyingly brings uncharacteristic Catholic terminology into a culture that is decidedly not Catholic.

Technically the word Saint have its roots from latin word to denote men and women who had received the highest religious aspirations, not merely Catholic or Christian, but sure yeah boss.

 

[Luckymoose]

Technically the word Saint have its roots from latin word to denote men and women who had received the highest religious aspirations, not merely Catholic or Christian, but sure yeah boss.

Mmhmmm.

 

[Starlife]

Technically the word Saint have its roots for latin word to denote men and women who had received the highest religious aspirations, not merely Catholic or Christian, but sure yeah boss.

First of all: emphasis on "latin". Second of all, I don't think you read my post. How about we go through this, step by step, so you can understand:

I seem to recall pages of posts featuring discussions between myself and The Strategos...

This section of my post above indicates about how the very discussion you and I are having has been had, and with someone far more knowledgeable about the subject.

...about how, while the term "saint" is technically correct...

This section of my post indicates precisely what you just mentioned when you said, "Technically the word Saint have its roots for latin word to denote men and women who had received the highest religious aspirations, not merely Catholic or Christian". See how that works?

...it annoyingly brings uncharacteristic Catholic terminology into a culture that is decidedly not Catholic.

And the end of my post indicates how, despite the fact it is technically correct (which, actually, it isn't -- which I'll elaborate on below), that nomenclature brings to mind Catholicism in a medieval setting, something we are trying to avoid.

Now, to elaborate on how, actually, those figures would not be "saints", let me say this:

Your post reads:

denote men and women who had received the highest religious aspirations

As mentioned in my previous post, as well, if you had read and understood it correctly:

Shulensi was (probably) never a real person.

As such, thinking of these figures as saints is grossly inaccurate, no matter which way you look at it. They were never living, or perhaps may sometimes be based on a real person, but not a clear representation of a real person at all (unlike, say, saints, who have historical basis and were indeed real people). As mentioned in my "Faith" post, there could be a division between how shrines are dedicated: shrines to the god-spirits, and shrines to other, lesser spirits, who actually were real people, but who are enshrined due to this realm's culture of ancestor worship or "guiding figure" worship. If you are going to compare anyone to a saint, it would be them, and not Shulensi -- but even then, those lesser enshrined spirits who were real individuals are typically localized spirits, and not realm-wide subjects of worship or admiration. And... I could still pinpoint a dozen reasons how they are far different from what you consider to be a saint.

 

[Seon]

Mmhmmm.

I was going to post something about the Orthodox Church and other religions that use similiar terms to Saint, but than I'm too busy so this is what you get instead.

Spoiler :

Besides, if you note, I've already changed the term used in my history.

 

[Seon]

First of all: emphasis on "latin". Second of all, I don't think you read my post. How about we go through this, step by step, so you can understand:



This section of my post above indicates about how the very discussion you and I are having has been had, and with someone far more knowledgeable about the subject.



This section of my post indicates precisely what you just mentioned when you said, "Technically the word Saint have its roots for latin word to denote men and women who had received the highest religious aspirations, not merely Catholic or Christian". See how that works?



And the end of my post indicates how, despite the fact it is technically correct (which, actually, it isn't -- which I'll elaborate on below), that nomenclature brings to mind Catholicism in a medieval setting, something we are trying to avoid.

Now, to elaborate on how, actually, those figures would not be "saints", let me say this:

Your post reads:



As mentioned in my previous post, as well, if you had read and understood it correctly:



As such, thinking of these figures as saints is grossly inaccurate, no matter which way you look at it. They were never living, or perhaps may sometimes be based on a real person, but not a clear representation of a real person at all (unlike, say, saints, who have historical basis and were indeed real people). As mentioned in my "Faith" post, there could be a division between how shrines are dedicated: shrines to the god-spirits, and shrines to other, lesser spirits, who actually were real people, but who are enshrined due to this realm's culture of ancestor worship or "guiding figure" worship. If you are going to compare anyone to a saint, it would be them, and not Shulensi -- but even then, those lesser enshrined spirits who were real individuals are typically localized spirits, and not realm-wide subjects of worship or admiration. And... I could still pinpoint a dozen reasons how they are far different from what you consider to be a saint.

So, uh.

Basically, after you argue that my term of using the word "Saint" is technically correct, you argue that it's not in the same post.

After I edited my history to remove reference to the word "Saint"

After I admitted that I may have misused the term saint here.

After you edited in a sentence that contradicted your original post... in your original post.

I do not understand what you are trying to get at here.


Actually, I don't think you read my posts clearly and I think your internal logic needs some straightening out so let me expound upon it further.

First of all: emphasis on "latin". Second of all, I don't think you read my post. How about we go through this, step by step, so you can understand:

Technically speaking, you edited in the last sentence after I read it. Let me comment on this step by step procedure.

This section of my post above indicates about how the very discussion you and I are having has been had, and with someone far more knowledgeable about the subject.

I do not ever remember there being a discussion, espescially since...

Yeah. So maybe I forgot that he was a god-spirit instead of prophet/saints.

I already admitted that I forgot that he was a god-spirit.

This section of my post indicates precisely what you just mentioned when you said, "Technically the word Saint have its roots for latin word to denote men and women who had received the highest religious aspirations, not merely Catholic or Christian". See how that works?

Good to see that we are in agreement here.

And the end of my post indicates how, despite the fact it is technically correct (which, actually, it isn't -- which I'll elaborate on below), that nomenclature brings to mind Catholicism in a medieval setting, something we are trying to avoid.

I heard that God Emperor was very popular in Japan and Egypt. Your point being?

Also you say it's correct and then it's not. Considering the fact that this could all have been easily been avoided if you just said "Shulensi is not a saint" instead of

"Shulensi is technically a saint but he's not technically not actually a saint."

I can only guess that your mind works in another plane of existence than this one.

Now, to elaborate on how, actually, those figures would not be "saints", let me say this:

...about how, while the term "saint" is technically correct...

Lolwut.

Your post reads:

As mentioned in my previous post, as well, if you had read and understood it correctly:

Yeah. So maybe I forgot that he was a god-spirit instead of prophet/saints.

As such, thinking of these figures as saints is grossly inaccurate, no matter which way you look at it. They were never living, or perhaps may sometimes be based on a real person, but not a clear representation of a real person at all (unlike, say, saints, who have historical basis and were indeed real people). As mentioned in my "Faith" post, there could be a division between how shrines are dedicated: shrines to the god-spirits, and shrines to other, lesser spirits, who actually were real people, but who are enshrined due to this realm's culture of ancestor worship or "guiding figure" worship. If you are going to compare anyone to a saint, it would be them, and not Shulensi -- but even then, those lesser enshrined spirits who were real individuals are typically localized spirits, and not realm-wide subjects of worship or admiration. And... I could still pinpoint a dozen reasons how they are far different from what you consider to be a saint.

I seem to recall pages of posts featuring discussions between myself and The Strategos about how, while the term "saint" is technically correct, it annoyingly brings uncharacteristic Catholic terminology into a culture that is decidedly not Catholic.

Even prophet would be inaccurate. The only prophet would be Luseysi himself. Shulensi was (probably) never a real person.

I'm just going to assume that this was a last minute arbitrary decision made by you.

If it wasn't, I can only make the conclusion that logic in this world is shaped like this:

Spoiler :

 

[Devercia]

The way to get on my side personally with this NES, is posting your information within a suitable timeframe. Since you are new to the thread, I'll give you time, of course, but others have left their info stagnant for a few weeks now -- and yet others expressed interest, but have since flaked out.

Absolutely. Having run a couple of NESs and RPGs, its the casual well wishers that ruin them. Casual enough to reserve what they can't administer, and well intentioned enough to make you think otherwise.

Anyway, I'm working on it now.

 

[Starlife]

Seon: It was not arbitrary at all. It was well-thought out, and the faith of the realm has been detailed as such for weeks now. And you're still missing the point. Shrines are either devoted to god-spirits, or to people who really existed but are now revered (which would be local spirits). 1. and 2. Shulensi is nothing that could be considered a saint, or anything close to a saint. Yet there are figures within our realm that could be considered saints (if you stretched reality a bit), but even so, such nomenclature denotes Catholic or Judeo-Christian culture in a medieval setting, which we want to avoid. Therefore, my saying "technically, while saint is correct...", I am referring to those local spirits. When speaking of Shulensi, I am saying that "saint" is actually incorrect altogether. Hence my words: "despite the fact it is technically correct (which, actually, it isn't -- which I'll elaborate on below)". That means the situation is more complicated than saying, "Yes, they could be, I guess, but not really," or "No, they're definitely not", because in one sense, you could refer to a lesser spirit as a saint (if you wanted to edit that to not be Shulensi, but rather a localized spirit [even then, please don't use "saint", because it still doesn't make sense; though makes more sense than if you use it for Shulensi], but in another sense, it is incorrect altogether). Do you see how that works?

And I didn't edit anything.

I do not understand what you are trying to get at here.

You rarely do.

 

[Seon]

Seon: It was not arbitrary at all. It was well-thought out, and the faith of the realm has been detailed as such for weeks now. And you're still missing the point.

Am I?

1. and 2. Shulensi is nothing that could be considered a saint, or anything close to a saint

.

Therefore, my saying "technically, while saint is correct...", I am referring to those local spirits.

But yet the discussion started out talking about Shulensi and Shulensi in particular, not the local spirits.

Actually, there was no discussion because I acknowledged that Shulensi was a god-spirit instead of a saint.

When speaking of Shulensi, I am saying that "saint" is actually incorrect altogether. Hence my words: "despite the fact it is technically correct (which, actually, it isn't -- which I'll elaborate on below)".

I don't see that as being incorrect altogether.

I just see stupidity in that sentence.

That means the situation is more complicated than saying, "Yes, they could be, I guess, but not really," or "No, they're definitely not"

1. and 2. Shulensi is nothing that could be considered a saint, or anything close to a saint

.

You keep contradicting yourself in the same post.

because in one sense, you could refer to a lesser spirit as a saint (if you wanted to edit that to not be Shulensi, but rather a localized spirit [even then, please don't use "saint", because it still doesn't make sense; though makes more sense than if you use it for Shulensi], but in another sense, it is incorrect altogether). Do you see how that works?

Besides, if you note, I've already changed the term used in my history.

You rarely do.

 

[Luckymoose]

I was going to post something about the Orthodox Church and other religions that use similiar terms to Saint, but than I'm too busy so this is what you get instead.

Just pointing out that you're still being notRoman.

 

[Seon]

Just pointing out that you're still being notRoman.

Oh shut it you

 

[Starlife]

I see no contradiction in my post. You keep saying I'm editing stuff, when I'm not, and you keep saying I'm contradicting myself, which I'm not. The "No, they're definitely not", and the contrast formed in that sentence indicate a more complicated spiritual aesthetic than what you seem to have in mind for our realm.

But yet the discussion started out talking about Shulensi and Shulensi in particular, not the local spirits.

Um, no. The discussion about me saying "saint is technically correct" was in reference to a discussion I had with The Strategos, in which we were talking about figures who more resemble the lesser, local spirits which I have (to this point) adequately described -- a point you seemed to miss either due to a lack of reading this thread, or negligence altogether (similar to how you created a notRome in a setting and world and region that bears little resemblance to the Roman Empire -- all because you were playing Rome: Total War or whatever).

 

[Seon]

I see no contradiction in my post. You keep saying I'm editing stuff, when I'm not, and you keep saying I'm contradicting myself, which I'm not. The "No, they're definitely not", and the contrast formed in that sentence indicate a more complicated spiritual aesthetic than what you seem to have in mind for our realm.

That means the situation is more complicated than saying, "Yes, they could be, I guess, but not really," or "No, they're definitely not"

1. and 2. Shulensi is nothing that could be considered a saint, or anything close to a saint

These two sentences cannot both be true, that is a contradiction. If you think that "Shulensi is nothing that could be considered saint" does not mean that "Shulensi is defnitely not a saint," you must explain that further.

Um, no. The discussion about me saying "saint is technically correct" was in reference to a discussion I had with The Strategos, in which we were talking about figures who more resemble the lesser, local spirits which I have (to this point) adequately described

Which is moot because I didn't mention any local spirits. That meant that I could only assume that you were talking about Shulensi.

 

[Seon]

In addition, cursory glance through the thread revealed exactly 1 post by strategos, his House Idea post.

Thusly I must assume that you are confusing this thread with #nes.