Beuraucracy: commerce v. production

[eluciv]

I'm wondering if anyone uses this civic primarily for the hammer bonus?

I had always taken it as a given to make my capital the "science city" - what with the commerce bonus and all. Hammers were a nice side-effect. However, participation in a previous thread got me thinking about this. I've always been blinded by the commerce side of this civic, but it seems to me that you could do some damage with it if your capital was your main center of production/wonder city.

I would have a hard time thinking the hammer multiplier could gain you more than the commerce multiplier (hence the reason I usaully cottage spam the capital). I'm looking for someone to show me otherwise.

 

[axident]

I'm wondering if anyone uses this civic primarily for the hammer bonus?

I had always taken it as a given to make my capital the "science city" - what with the commerce bonus and all. Hammers were a nice side-effect. However, participation in a previous thread got me thinking about this. I've always been blinded by the commerce side of this civic, but it seems to me that you could do some damage with it if your capital was your main center of production/wonder city.

I would have a hard time thinking the hammer multiplier could gain you more than the commerce multiplier (hence the reason I usaully cottage spam the capital). I'm looking for someone to show me otherwise.

I love the hammer bonus. My capital usually has Oxford, National Epic, and as many Wonders as I can build in it, my favorites being Great Library, Statue of Liberty, and the Pyramids. Some hammer-producting tiles, some farms around the capital, and Representation from the Pyramids, along with Bureaucracy = Super Science/Wonderville. More wonders = more GPP. More GPP = more great people. More great people = more settled specialists (with +3 beakers each) or lightbulbs or trade missions or great works. I'll even settle my first Great General in my capital city sometimes since it has/will have Oxford, a Science Academy, and usually at least one monastery in it, so that +3 beakers is more like +10 after my science-boosting buildings have their way with it. (I don't do this if I already have a city that I've pegged as a good Heroic Epic city. But sometimes my first few non-capital cities just don't have the super-high long-term production potential that I'm looking for.) And I know many more generals will come later on, when I have a Heroic Epic city established. Throw in Parthenon for added fun.

P.S. They used to have Philo/Industrious as a leader combo, but thanks to stuff like the above happening, they took it out.

 

[Mowque]

i always use it for the hammer bonus

 

[eluciv]

I wonder if there's a correlation between primarily builder vs. warmonger as to what bonus they want to exploit from the civic?? Maybe I should rephrase and tell me what your preferred path to victory is and what you focus on with beurocracy.

 

[OTAKUjbski]

I wonder if there's a correlation between primarily builder vs. warmonger as to what bonus they want to exploit from the civic?? Maybe I should rephrase and tell me what your preferred path to victory is and what you focus on with beurocracy.

I played around with this a few games ago when I discovered the power of Bureaucracy in an Ironworks/HE city.

The benefit gained by Bureaucracy really comes down to what type of economy you're running.

If your empire is filled with Towns (CE), then the amount of gained in your Wall Street Capital is going to be a wash compared to the amount your losing by leaving Free Speech (+2 * however many Towns you have).

However, if you're basing your economy on Farm-supplied Specialists (FE/SE), then you're essentially looking at either an overall gain or little/no change overall.

In the game I played with this on, my Wall Street city was producing 456 (at 100% gold slider) of my empire's 1608 .

After switching to Bureaucracy, my Wall Street capital was cranking out 552 of my empires lower 1470 .

Overall, I had a net loss of 138 ! The amount of production gained wasn't worth it, since my Wall Street had almost no real production to speak of.

On the other hand, if you're using Bureaucracy for the + bonus, you'll find yourself easily forgetting about the ~100+ you lost in the transition: