Brainstorming Thread - One-Trick-Pony Techs

[Vokarya]

Okay, I just realised that Steel requires Thermodynamics, and not the other way, which is strange, since historicly the knowledge of Steel is earlier than Thermodynamics.
I think it would worth flipping the two and than move Ironworks.

The Steel tech is really shorthand for the Bessemer process (patented 1856), allowing steel to be used on a wide scale for construction and engineering purposes. Yes, steel is known long before that, but only on a small scale, and I am not about to create separate techs for "crucible steel" or "mass-produced steel" or "Bessemer process" and just do one simple Steel tech.

 

[<Nexus>]

Alright, than a different idea:

What if converting Thermodynamics from a tech into a project, that allows Cement Mill for everyone (for the creator a free CM in the capitol + a settled Great Engineer and/or Great Scientist in the capitol )?

 

[Vokarya]

Alright, than a different idea:

What if converting Thermodynamics from a tech into a project, that allows Cement Mill for everyone (for the creator a free CM in the capitol + a settled Great Engineer and/or Great Scientist in the capitol )?

Thermodynamics is too broad to be a project. Projects are usually much more focused and involve some kind of building work (even if the final result isn't a building). Theory of Evolution, Human Genome Project, and Theory of Everything are the exceptions, but I'm willing to leave them be.

 

[<Nexus>]

Give some bonus to steam ships?

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Give some bonus to steam ships?

The only bonus I can think of is +1 movement but we already have enough movements bonuses I think. Unless we can take away the one from Optics and replace it with something else, but I'm not sure it's a good thing.

 

[<Nexus>]

The only bonus I can think of is +1 movement but we already have enough movements bonuses I think. Unless we can take away the one from Optics and replace it with something else, but I'm not sure it's a good thing.

A more simple solution is to drop all steam ships speed by 1 and regaining it with Thermodynamics.
I know it is a rather virtual solution, but Vokarya could finally get his so wanted 2 tricks on the tech.
Otherwise I have no more ideas.

 

[nionios]

IMHO, Optics should give +1 visibility, not +1 movement.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

IMHO, Optics should give +1 visibility, not +1 movement.

I thought about it too but it's a bit too strong, I fear, and there's another promotion for that.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

A more simple solution is to drop all steam ships speed by 1 and regaining it with Thermodynamics.
I know it is a rather virtual solution, but Vokarya could finally get his so wanted 2 tricks on the tech.
Otherwise I have no more ideas.

A bit odd, I don't feel very comfortable with this solution although I've thought about it myself. But I'm out of ideas as well. Let's see what Vokarya thinks about it.

 

[Vokarya]

Adjusting the move of steam ships is not going to work. First, without making a new XML tag, speed bonuses have to be handed out at the domain level (land, sea, air). We already have 4 separate +1 water move bonuses (Weather Lore, Compass, Navigation, Refrigeration; Optics is +1 sight over water, not +1 water move) and we don't need any more (in fact, I can see cutting two of them). I don't think we need to make new tags for an effect that we're only going to be use once.

Second, the only units where you would see a difference between pre-Thermo and post-Thermo speed are the Steamer and possibly the Ironclad. All other steamships require at least Steel which also requires Thermodynamics. A bonus that you always have should be folded into the main stats; otherwise, the base stats (especially from the Civilopedia) are inaccurate.

I think I'm going to just move the Ironworks to Thermodynamics.

 

[<Nexus>]

I think I'm going to just move the Ironworks to Thermodynamics.

But than you should also interchange the two thecs, so Thermodynamics require Steel and not the other way. A building providing a resource not yet discovered is a very bad solution.

 

[dbkblk]

@Vokarya: I've found that there is a pink icon in the tech research screen when hovering the future techs paths (at the left of the screen).

 

[Vokarya]

But than you should also interchange the two thecs, so Thermodynamics require Steel and not the other way. A building providing a resource not yet discovered is a very bad solution.

Not necessarily. Everything in the early Industrial era that has a metal requirement is Iron OR Steel, so an early Steel resource isn't going to break anything. It isn't until the late Industrial that the rules shift to "must have Steel".

I also don't place that much emphasis on tech requirements for manufactured resources. What really matters is the tech requirement for the building that produces the resource.

 

[Vokarya]

@Vokarya: I've found that there is a pink icon in the tech research screen when hovering the future techs paths (at the left of the screen).

The problem is the space in the filename of the icon for Ceremonial Burial. Some places in the game can handle spaces in icon filenames and some can't. I had that problem a while ago with East India Company. I won't be able to fix it right away, but I'll get to it at some point.

 

[<Nexus>]

One last idea:
Move Mining Inc. Corporation here. IMO thermodynamics has enough to do with mining to fit here and Explosives still has enough tricks.
What you say?

 

[Vokarya]

One last idea:
Move Mining Inc. Corporation here. IMO thermodynamics has enough to do with mining to fit here and Explosives still has enough tricks.
What you say?

I actually really like Mining Inc where it is. I think Explosives should be the primary technology for any Industrial-Era mining content (new stuff or bonuses to existing).

 

[<Nexus>]

Than maybe it's better to leave thermodynamics as it is, isn't it?

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

I think Vokarya's idea is good. I don't mind a single resource to pop up a bit earlier than expected, especially since steel was there in different forms as Vokarya has explained.

 

[Vokarya]

I did some thinking about buildings to get Organic Cities above the 2-trick threshold. I did some planning of ideas -- I am away from my current modding computer right now, so I can't really do artworks at the moment. I would like to know if you think these are viable.

Citycreche
This is an upgrade of the Industrial Park. It continues the chain of buildings started with the Carpenter.

• Cost 800
• Replaces Industrial Park
• +50% building production (over +30% from Industrial Park)
• 2 Engineer slots, 1 free Engineer (same as Industrial Park)
• No unhealth (so effectively +2 health if city did have Industrial Park)

Waste Digester
This is Sogroon's idea for an organic sewer system. I think this is a pretty good name.

• Cost 500
• Replaces Sewer System, Water Treatment Plant
• +2 health (copied from Water Treatment Plant)
• +0.4 health per citizen (Sewer System is +0.15, Water Treatment Plant is +0.15, so total +0.3 per citizen; this is effectively +0.1 health per citizen)
• No maintenance or espionage penalty (cancels Sewer System's +10% maintenance and -20% espionage defense and Water Treatment Plant's +10% maintenance)

With both of these and keeping the +1 food from improvements in the Cottage line, we could also drop the +2 health from Organic Cities. I'd like to save innate health/happiness bonuses for Future Tech (I consider Future Tech untouchable), and the only remaining health bonuses from techs are +1 each from Genetics, Gene Manipulation, and Replacement Organs. Unfortunately, Genetics and Replacement Organs are each only 2 tricks including the +1 health, so we can't lose those yet.

 

[<Nexus>]

I think Vokarya's idea is good. I don't mind a single resource to pop up a bit earlier than expected, especially since steel was there in different forms as Vokarya has explained.

Okay, than I will have to adopt my viewpoint.

Organic cities :
I agree with all.

I have an idea for genetics or gene manipulation. I will post it later.