Bugged City-States

[The Boz]

City States in my last two games don't work. Both use the newest version of Thal's Balance, 7.4 I believe. I get 0 Food and Culture, and Military units arrive every 9,999 turns. At first I thought it was a scaling thing, so I just kept giving the CS money, hoping we'd both grow until I see some results, but I've lately contacted a Militaristic CS which announces it'll give me a unit in 9,999 turns. Approximately.

 

[yaun]

Nevermind. I had not deleted the previous version of TBC. Therefor this report could be just a conflict.

 

[The Boz]

After a couple of reloads, the CSs started to perform, I can finally see their bonuses in the city food/culture mouseovers, and I recently started getting military units, about one every ~50 turns (marathon game, BTW). But the mouseover texts still don't list the bonus on the CS screen itself, and the Militaristic ones still say they're giving out a unit in 9,999 or 9,996 turns.

 

[Thalassicus]

It's just a display thing. Most of the citystate display is done in the c++ part of the game we don't have access to yet as modders. The actual effects should work:

Maritime gives era * (2 friend | 3 allied) distributed among our cities.

Cultural gives 5 + era * (2 friend | 3 allied) distributed among our cities.

Militaristic gives 1 free unit, with era * 10 XP, at the capital, every X turns. X is quicker when we have more militiaristic friends and allies.

 

[Zaldron]

Militaristic gives 1 free unit, with era * 10 XP, at the capital, every X turns. X is quicker when we have more militiaristic friends and allies.

How is "X" computed? Do we have any control over it? In my previous game by the end I was allied with pretty much every CS and the rate of getting units (subjectively) hadn't increased much. It's only one data point so I doubt it's a bug but I like knowing the precise mechanics too.

 

[The Boz]

Thanks for the info. Yeah, I loaded one of my earliest savegame, it appears that they do give out actual bonuses, but in most cases where you'd look, it says the bonuses are 0.

 

[Thalassicus]

@Zaldron
Each allied citystate adds 100% and friend adds 75% to the spawn rate. The base spawn timer is 15 turns (varies by gamespeed). So with 1 ally a unit spawns every 15 / 1 = 15 turns, and with 5 militaristic allies it's once every 15 / 5 = 3 turns.

While answering this question I actually discovered a bug making the turn timer longer than intended when we have multiple allies, and this should be fixed in v7.6.

 

[DragonGreen]

@Zaldron
Each allied citystate adds 100% and friend adds 75% to the spawn rate. The base spawn timer is 15 turns (varies by gamespeed). So with 1 ally a unit spawns every 15 / 1 = 15 turns, and with 5 militaristic allies it's once every 15 / 5 = 3 turns.

Hi Thal!

I think 75% for a friendly CS is a bit overpowered since I can have many friendly CS very easy (don't need to compete with other major civs) compared to the allied one, especially in the late game. Or let me say: Apart from the allied state of the CS in a war against another major civ it's very less important having CS as an ally, because the friendly bonus is high enough, especially when I am going to have many friendly CS.

Because of that I would suggest a 50% spawn rate bonus?

 

[Zaldron]

Hi Thal!

I think 75% for a friendly CS is a bit overpowered since I can have many friendly CS very easy (don't need to compete with other major civs) compared to the allied one, especially in the late game. Or let me say: Apart from the allied state of the CS in a war against another major civ it's very less important having CS as an ally, because the friendly bonus is high enough, especially when I am going to have many friendly CS.

Because of that I would suggest a 50% spawn rate bonus?

I'm pretty sure Thal specifically set this to 75% so that certain quests that give friendly will actually result in getting a unit before the friendship ran out. At lower levels you could get temporary friendship and wind up with no unit at all. I believe his argument was that the resources and increased spawn rate of being allied still made being an ally a strong upgrade to friendship.

 

[Thalassicus]

Alliance also gives happiness, strategic resources, and prevents all other leaders from allying with that citystate. Friendship only gives the unit rewards. This is why I usually do about a 2:3 or 3:4 ratio between friendship:ally bonuses.

 

[DragonGreen]

Alliance also gives happiness, strategic resources, and prevents all other leaders from allying with that citystate. Friendship only gives the unit rewards. This is why I usually do about a 2:3 or 3:4 ratio between friendship:ally bonuses.

Thanks for the explanation, I didn't recognize the resource bonuses.