C-IV GOTM 09 Results & Congratulations

[Dumpfbacke]

The victories:
32 Spaceship (Fastest: 1819AD godotnut, Slowest: 1944AD Dumpfbacke)

Thanks for pointing that out . Would love to give a smart comment but hardly remember the game. But I'm sure I'll be a candidate for the slowest whatever-win on GOTM 10 and 11 as well as I just HAVE TO build all these wonders and religions, no matter how useless . Sigh...

 

[Airny]

This was my first GOTM and that's a long time ago.
I couldn't get rid of the barbs and they got my capital.
I'm surprised almost noone else transmitted such an ending.
I guess they were just ashamed and didn't submit or restarted.
I can't wait to get the next results.

 

[azzaman333]

This was my first GOTM and that's a long time ago.
I couldn't get rid of the barbs and they got my capital.
I'm surprised almost noone else transmitted such an ending.
I guess they were just ashamed and didn't submit or restarted.
I can't wait to get the next results.

Actually, thats exactly what the barbs did to me in this game after I had founded Hinduism

 

[warren peace]

I think warren peace gets the 'most ironic name award', in the circumstances

I miscalculated the Barbarians at this level and expanded too soon. I hope to better next time

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Actually, I was conquered in 670BC (by my mates the barbarians )

Oooops sorry, read the wrong line off the spreadsheet. I fixed it now.

 

[AU_Armageddon]

You have to win to get the cow.

That seems pointlessly arbitrary. The award only says Highest Base Score.

Whinging cos I remember the game well and felt like I had pulled it off, earning that base score fair and square. Was going for Time...going for cow (2050 vs 1938) but lost and took it and submitted it as fair game. Was laughable as there was one turns difference in it, but that's how it goes - going for the cow anyway with a 112 year disadvantage. Fair enough penalty.

But to be perfectly honest, if I thought for a second it would be arbitrarily dismissed, I wouldn't have bothered submitting the loss and woulda reloaded, changing that turn to (automatically) take the domination inside that turn instead and get the stupid cow. 5 second difference in a 22 hour game with the only change that matters being whether or not it 'counts' officially.




Taking my frickin cow and going home

 

[bshumbera]

But... on the other hand, reloading would have been against the rules.

 

[ffifield]

I was looking at the global rankings and amongst those who've submitted every game I'm in the bottom five players.

 

[Murky]

I had a pretty good start on this GoTM. Just never got around to finishing it.

Congrats to the winners.

 

[Redbad]

Congrats to Kuningas, who was the only non-medal-winner to break 90% in the combined rankings!

There's something funny with your link, Dave.
When I click it I'm in position 14. But when I then choose speed or score, get a screenrefresh, choose combined again and a screen refresh I'm in position 4.

Any idea what's the matter?

 

[AlanH]

You're 4th in the cumulative combined rankings but you were 14th in the latest game rankings - GOTM 9 only.

[edit] I'll get it right eventually

 

[Harok]

Congrats to the winners and thanks to the staff for their time and efforts.

 

[da_Vinci]

Thlypsis played Adventurer class - no awards.

You have to win to get the cow.

Confused by adventurer class getting no awards, since it appears that zbgay (olive shield), Lord British (teal shield), and AndrewN (blue shield) all have final scores in blue font, meaning adventurer class.

Clarification, please?

dV

Addendum/edit: Similar finding in other GOTMs, that shields can go to adventurer.

So is it Medals = higherst, second and third Jason Scores;

Awards = fastest victory by type and highest base score victory;

and the shields and ambulances are something other than "awards"? Maybe we should call these the "Dubies", as they are dubious distinctions at best.

So is it that adventurer can get Dubies, but not medals or awards?

And is a Jason score different from the game's "normalized score"?

dV

 

[AlanH]

So is it that adventurer can get Dubies, but not medals or awards?

Correct. The lowest scoring shields and the ambulances are the only "prizes" winnable by Adventurer class submissions. Please don't ask me to explain the logic - that's just the way it's always been

FYI there are 21 Adventurer submissions that have won shields, and one with a red ambulance.

And is a Jason score different from the game's "normalized score"?

Any mention of Jason scores is a legacy from Civ3, where it's the normalised score used to reduce the need for milking. If you still see it referring to Civ4 somewhere, please let me know where so that I can expurgate it.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Any mention of Jason scores is a legacy from Civ3, where it's the normalised score used to reduce the need for milking. If you still see it referring to Civ4 somewhere, please let me know where so that I can expurgate it.

You just follow the link Ainwood gives with each set of results to where the symbols are explained. eg. where he says 'Award symbols are listed here' near the start of this thread.

 

[AlanH]

Thx. Fixed. I'm sure it won't be the last remaining breadcrumb from the past .

 

[da_Vinci]

Hi AlanH,

Actually, it makes perfect sense to me that adventurer class is only eligible for the "worst of the best" awards. I am much more likely to be contending for those in the near term then for the "best of the best" awards.

"The fix is in." I like the updated medals and awards page, but I still think we need a name for the shields and ambulances, to distinguish them from awards (the current layout of the headings makes it seem that the S&A are also "awards"). Especially since that group has different rules for who is eligible.

Dubies was one thought, although if we call them shields and 'mbulances, we could call them S&M's (which might be appropriate because they are kind of painful).

Or maybe call them WOB's (Worst Of Best), which is what the shields are. The ambulances are the best and worst of the worst.

Do we need a poll?

dV

 

[civ_steve]

@da_Vinci - The history of the Shield Awards for lowest scoring victory in the different Victory conditions has a much higher calling than you attribute to them by suggesting they be called the Worst of the Best. Before Jason scoring was introduced for Civ3, the only way to get a medal was to milk the game very efficiently. Therefore the top medal positions were usually assigned to a handful of players who were expert milkers - no one else had much of a chance. (Sounds somewhat familiar!) Rather than try to compete for medals, a couple of players suggested trying to achieve the lowest scoring victory for a given victory condition. This takes a lot of skill to avoid losing, achieve the victory and keep the score down, and these players would post the results after the game results were announced. They proved fairly popular, so the GOTM staff incorporated them in the general monthly processing.

So I would challenge the CIV GOTM players to view the Shield Awards in this same manner; rather than a dubious honor bestowed on the lowest scoring game of a given Victory type, why not mix it up a little and every now and then attempt to GAIN that lowest score Shield by keeping your empire as small as possible, your score as low as possible, and still winning the game. This is certainly within everyone's reach, while milking the game for highest score might not be.

 

[da_Vinci]

Rather than try to compete for medals, a couple of players suggested trying to achieve the lowest scoring victory for a given victory condition. This takes a lot of skill to avoid losing, achieve the victory and keep the score down, and these players would post the results after the game results were announced. They proved fairly popular, so the GOTM staff incorporated them in the general monthly processing.

So I would challenge the CIV GOTM players to view the Shield Awards in this same manner; rather than a dubious honor bestowed on the lowest scoring game of a given Victory type, why not mix it up a little and every now and then attempt to GAIN that lowest score Shield by keeping your empire as small as possible, your score as low as possible, and still winning the game. This is certainly within everyone's reach, while milking the game for highest score might not be.

@ civ_steve: Well that is an entirely different way to look at the shields! Thanks for the historical update.

That having been said, do we know empirically that the shields go to those who are actively pursuing that course, rather than going to someone who scored low "by accident"? Perhaps an evaluation of the time of victory for the shield winners would reveal this, although from AlanH's plot (see the scoring thread), it would seem that in general, lower scoring victories will be later victories.

If winning with a minimal empire takes as much skill as you say (and I am not doubting that), then I might question your claim that such an outcome is within everyone's reach.

Also, if the shields are a skill reward rather than a WOB, does that affect the logic of adventurer being eligible for them, while not for the other awards?

dV

edit/addendum: Re the adventurer question, the 15% score penalty would seem to give the adventurers the edge in competing for the shields. For example, my GOTM 11 10,656 dom (after penalty) in 2023 may be in contention for lowest dom. Bally has a 2030 dom (score not reported). But if Bally is a contender, then I may still come out "ahead" (or should I say behind?).

Also, my low scoring dom is not a reflection of any particular skill (other than surviving), and I was not trying for a minimal score (although I could have starved my pop down to the dom minimum to have an even lower score if that was my goal). So is that behavior a demonstration of skill ...? Or is a low scoring win skill only at the other victory types?

Just some fuel for the debate.

dV

 

[civ_steve]

I did have that thought myself, whether the Adventurer scoring penalty should be applied if the object is to score the lowest. OTOH, if the Shield is awarded to the lowest base score, the penalty might not apply to that, perhaps only to Global Player Points and final score. (I'm just not sure off the top of my head.)

I'm also not sure about the CIV scoring system and whether it works well or poorly as a competition to achieve the lowest winning score.