C2C - Civics Discussion Thread

[Thunderbrd]

There is one other good argument for leaving some 'scaling' civics like the language civics in the game... the anarchy time to change them forces a player to consider if the benefit is worth the sacrifice and pick his timing carefully.

The question about the language civics though that I have is are we representing a true national policy decision here really? I can see some arguments for both sides.

The US, for example, is kinda behind the curve in comparison to other nations for teaching all to be bi or even tri lingual. But then again, we are somewhat pushing for the eventual globalization of the English language too. It's always been my opinion that until 'we the people, ALL the people of Earth' abandon all but one language its going to be a hindrance to our species as the learning of other languages is a massive investment of time and resources that could/should be spent on learning more important things.

So in a sense, although the US is not very multi-lingual friendly (despite how many people speak only spanish here, which REALLY irritates me! The way I see it we're an English speaking country at least and if you're going to live here you should be required to be fluent in English so we can all communicate freely - the void of this policy upsets our unity and even impedes our economy since now, all too often two marketing channels must be utilized rather than one!) I still believe we benefit a lot from NOT enforcing so much class time be spent on learning additional languages and we can thus focus more on things that are actually of learning value, like science and technology. (The one language that I feel is still truly worthy of knowing for a US citizen is probably Latin since all scientific naming is derived from there.)

So at a point, I can see a Language civic selection going against the grain and impeding diplomacy, commerce (taxation from profits since profits are diminished due to the possibility of having to market in multiple languages) and trade somewhat but enhancing research nevertheless.

There's also a difference between that system and a system that firmly states, as I feel we should, that its official language is a particular type and that all citizens must speak it fluently. Such a system would impact trade and diplomacy, but not commerce. And the research would be a little less than the previous system because making sure all know that language would be a bit more of an investment into language teaching, particularly with immigrant families and in preparation for anyone who is to take part in multi-national negotiations.

So I guess I see the argument to make language choices a civic as being pretty reasonable but to validate it more we need some more consideration of how each selection on that list represents a national policy decision.

 

[Hydromancerx]

As soon as I work out the aforementioned technical issues with relationships and convince Hydro not to freak out about it.

Well if you can still have it effect the civ relations ships then I would be more than happy to have it converted into a tech trigger rather than a civic.

And as I have stated before the only reason its a civic is because civics can effect diplomacy and how other civs think of you.

Remember it stated out as a building. Its only by necessity that it became a civic.

EDIT: As said in the other thread ...

Can someone move Cloning [Military] to Gene Enhancement tech instead of cloning? Since Human Cloning is at Gene Enhancement, while animal cloning is at Cloning tech. And unless we are having armies of cloned sheep, then it should be the other tech.

 

[CIVPlayer8]

There is one other good argument for leaving some 'scaling' civics like the language civics in the game... the anarchy time to change them forces a player to consider if the benefit is worth the sacrifice and pick his timing carefully.

The question about the language civics though that I have is are we representing a true national policy decision here really? I can see some arguments for both sides.

The US, for example, is kinda behind the curve in comparison to other nations for teaching all to be bi or even tri lingual. But then again, we are somewhat pushing for the eventual globalization of the English language too. It's always been my opinion that until 'we the people, ALL the people of Earth' abandon all but one language its going to be a hindrance to our species as the learning of other languages is a massive investment of time and resources that could/should be spent on learning more important things.

So in a sense, although the US is not very multi-lingual friendly (despite how many people speak only spanish here, which REALLY irritates me! The way I see it we're an English speaking country at least and if you're going to live here you should be required to be fluent in English so we can all communicate freely - the void of this policy upsets our unity and even impedes our economy since now, all too often two marketing channels must be utilized rather than one!) I still believe we benefit a lot from NOT enforcing so much class time be spent on learning additional languages and we can thus focus more on things that are actually of learning value, like science and technology. (The one language that I feel is still truly worthy of knowing for a US citizen is probably Latin since all scientific naming is derived from there.)

So at a point, I can see a Language civic selection going against the grain and impeding diplomacy, commerce (taxation from profits since profits are diminished due to the possibility of having to market in multiple languages) and trade somewhat but enhancing research nevertheless.

There's also a difference between that system and a system that firmly states, as I feel we should, that its official language is a particular type and that all citizens must speak it fluently. Such a system would impact trade and diplomacy, but not commerce. And the research would be a little less than the previous system because making sure all know that language would be a bit more of an investment into language teaching, particularly with immigrant families and in preparation for anyone who is to take part in multi-national negotiations.

So I guess I see the argument to make language choices a civic as being pretty reasonable but to validate it more we need some more consideration of how each selection on that list represents a national policy decision.

Hmm, good points here Thunderbrd. I never really considered being bilingual a disadvantage, in terms of science. I think we can model "Language Classes" with a National Wonder though, not needed by civics. And also, I dislike the Anarchy from Language. It really doesn't make much sense.

There's also a difference between that system and a system that firmly states, as I feel we should, that its official language is a particular type and that all citizens must speak it fluently. Such a system would impact trade and diplomacy, but not commerce.

Hmmm. I'm a little on the fence on this. What would the options be? Would we keep options like Interpreters and Trade Language? I guess "Native Language" might increase more, while "Bilingualism" might increase ? It seems to me that it might be just another civic category to give bonuses to your empire.

Well if you can still have it effect the civ relations ships then I would be more than happy to have it converted into a tech trigger rather than a civic.

And as I have stated before the only reason its a civic is because civics can effect diplomacy and how other civs think of you.

Remember it stated out as a building. Its only by necessity that it became a civic.

EDIT: As said in the other thread ...

Can someone move Cloning [Military] to Gene Enhancement tech instead of cloning? Since Human Cloning is at Gene Enhancement, while animal cloning is at Cloning tech. And unless we are having armies of cloned sheep, then it should be the other tech.

It's a valid strategy. I'll fix it.

 

[BlueGenie]

Bilingualism in it's true sense does not impair other education and does not require massive investment of time and training.

Researchers suggest that native-like proficiency in both languages, referred to as “true” bilingualism, is rare (Cutler, Mehler, Norris, & Segui, 1992; Grosjean, 1982). One factor to consider in defining types of bilingualism is when the two languages are acquired in relation to each other. Simultaneous bilingualism is considered to occur when two languages are acquired from birth or prior to one year of age (De Houwer, 2005).

This is how I am raised and I am bilingual in the truest sense, i.e. I was raised hearing and speaking two languages. This is also how I am raising my children, making sure they get to hear and learn both languages from birth.

When doing it this way there is no impediment to learning later on nor is there any extra investment needed from the persons becoming bilingual in this fashion, rather the opposite. Recent studies have shown that those persons that are brought up with two languages also gain other benefits, such as increased puzzle solving, increased vocabulary and grammar control in both languages, and increased long-term memory.

These benefits are visible even when starting to learn a secondary language later in life but less and less pronounced the older one starts. This had led to a conclusion that secondary languages should be taught at an earlier age in school in order to increase long-term memory of children.

Cheers

 

[Thunderbrd]

Bilingualism in it's true sense does not impair other education and does not require massive investment of time and training.



This is how I am raised and I am bilingual in the truest sense, i.e. I was raised hearing and speaking two languages. This is also how I am raising my children, making sure they get to hear and learn both languages from birth.

When doing it this way there is no impediment to learning later on nor is there any extra investment needed from the persons becoming bilingual in this fashion, rather the opposite. Recent studies have shown that those persons that are brought up with two languages also gain other benefits, such as increased puzzle solving, increased vocabulary and grammar control in both languages, and increased long-term memory.

These benefits are visible even when starting to learn a secondary language later in life but less and less pronounced the older one starts. This had led to a conclusion that secondary languages should be taught at an earlier age in school in order to increase long-term memory of children.

Cheers

You were lucky. The problem is, by the time a child is at school its already too late to introduce this type of natural bi-lingualism as it can only take place when even the first language is being learned at the same time as the second.

Once one language has been learned enough to speak it, its too late to introduce the second and expect it to be as easy to set in. I remember this myself from trying to understand the Spanish on Sesame Street... I already knew English so none of it had a fair chance to stick. I suppose had I been suddenly immersed in the other language and nobody around me was entirely English reliant it may have been different and it might've been possible for the mind to do a quick re-tool and adapt.

And I know immersive techniques can even work for adults pretty well. But I can also attest that I wasted a lot of hrs trying to learn French and within a few years had forgotten nearly everything I'd learned from it. You MUST have cause to keep the language and if you don't have any, it's lost quickly if it's not a fundamental part of your early development.

So what your situation amounts to really is a phenomenon that IS truly positive, but tends to only occur when the family unit is also bi-lingual and finds cause to use both during the children's fundamental language learning years. In game terms? Somehow, this could be potentially the benefit of a culturally divided city.

I dislike the Anarchy from Language. It really doesn't make much sense.

On many civic changes, Nationwide Anarchy seems a bit stiff from a realism perspective as it would only be a small segment of society that was so greatly upset by the change. But being a game, the effect is intensified to the point that we have to simply accept that everything pretty much shuts down for a bit to represent that upset. Imagine how powerfully irate many Mexican Americans would be today if the US suddenly stated that anyone who can't speak English and has other National ties then they would be deported if they cannot prove a fluency within a particular period of time? More upsetting than some civic changes would represent for sure! So yes, some of those civic changes in the Language line wouldn't seem to be good cause for anarchy but some Language line changes still could be seen as justified to cause a temporary shutdown of government.

Hmmm. I'm a little on the fence on this. What would the options be? Would we keep options like Interpreters and Trade Language? I guess "Native Language" might increase more, while "Bilingualism" might increase ? It seems to me that it might be just another civic category to give bonuses to your empire.

Yeah, I don't know really. Declared National Language vs Unofficial National Language? How it would fit in with the current scheme I'm not really sure.

I'm honestly just throwing this stuff out there for consideration in the bigger picture of Languages in relation to Civics. I don't have a lot more to offer since it seems to me the best solution would have something to do with tracking the actual languages in use in a given city/nation with a mechanic somewhat similar to National Culture levels. Then have policies that interact with that where the policies don't have absolute effects but the effects vary depending on the blending of languages taking place in the cities and the blending would be influenced by the national policies.

In a lot of ways, I can see how something along these lines could be worked into a project I have in mind regarding Cultures too... So right now I'm just thinking out loud and I hope it gives you some ideas and perspectives you find helpful.

 

[GT Ranma]

I really wish the civics were set up differently in this game.

In a perfect world, I would like to see a more (reverse)tree like structure to the civics. Meaning, that once you select 1 thing, it branches down, allowing you to pick more and more options as they come available, per government style.

But of course, that is prolly impossible.

Graphic representation of which I doeth speakith:
................. Monarch
................./........\.........................|
...........absolute....constitutional ....Comonwealth
.......................... /............\
................. Parlamentary.....Federal

ect, ect.

I think the way it is programed lends it's self to the problems we are having. It tends to be oblique instead of common sense.

Because in some aspects, like Language, being able to 'unlock' options, like taking 'Trade Language', then being able to see and understand what it does would be helpful to a lot of players.

Maybe just start with a verbal description of that the Civic means before all the technical jargon?

Say for example:
Trade Language
Adopting a Trade Language allows your merchants to be able to speak with other merchants on a common ground. This allows for more trading with countries that also speak the trade language, but comes with a higher price for training students.
(Then put in all the +/- crap)
+maint
+trade, blah blah blah. That way people can read what we intend, or mean, with a specific civic, rather then just read a randomly generated label for some equally random +/-s?

 

[Tgls]

I have a slightly different idea on the language civics. Instead of being selected by the player, instead they would all be event driven. When you researched language, an event would change your civic to native language. If you maintained long-term trade with a neighbor, eventually you would change to trade language and onwards. If you eliminated your neighbor and absorbed their culture, it would slowly return to native language. Much later when the universal translator is invented, it would switch you to universal translator and leave you there for the remainder of the game.

The effects of language should be slightly different too. I am okay with the diplomatic bonus, but the science bonus should be changed. Instead of increasing science, tech diffusion should be sped up by the language civics, and they should also increase foreign trade. Maybe culture could be changed to minimize negative effects from high cultural influence from another civilization.

 

[Kreatur]

Thunderbrd you forget one thing. as a german i learned english in shool, so i am able to understand every single word you write (yes i know my spelling and grammar is terrible) but you probably dont speak any single word of german. so you can just use sources of information in english language while i can use the german ones too. to be multilingual enables different views to different toppics. the best example are the news. german news always speak very critical about the unitet states. rebublicans were most times evil while democrats were the good ones. And a working social system which is standard in every other developed country scares the americans to death because of a paranoid fear of communism. if i could just use the german news i would have a really bad opinion about the USA, but because i am bilingual, i can watch cnn ore read articles in english that shows an other view abbout the unitet states. if you watch the news and there is something about germany you have to believe what they say in the news because you cant take any other sources of information in other languages to compare. i hope my english was understandeable. i dont want to offend anybody, i just want to say that to know other languages is very important.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Thunderbrd you forget one thing. as a german i learned english in shool, so i am able to understand every single word you write (yes i know my spelling and grammar is terrible) but you probably dont speak any single word of german. so you can just use sources of information in english language while i can use the german ones too. to be multilingual enables different views to different toppics. the best example are the news. german news always speak very critical about the unitet states. rebublicans were most times evil while democrats were the good ones. And a working social system which is standard in every other developed country scares the americans to death because of a paranoid fear of communism. if i could just use the german news i would have a really bad opinion about the USA, but because i am bilingual, i can watch cnn ore read articles in english that shows an other view abbout the unitet states. if you watch the news and there is something about germany you have to believe what they say in the news because you cant take any other sources of information in other languages to compare. i hope my english was understandeable. i dont want to offend anybody, i just want to say that to know other languages is very important.

Wow... that was some amazingly insightful stuff there Kreatur! Thanks for sharing that angle. You're correct that I had not given that side of language consideration. I HAVE long felt that it was odd we never really hear much of the news elsewhere, particularly due to the fact that there is a general awareness that we are heavily criticized outside our borders. You've just suggested an additional thought to add to that concept though... perhaps in the US we are purposefully lax on multi-lingual training so that for the most part, only English news sources can reach our ears - yet another subtle and hardly noticed form of maintaining some control.

Honestly, Kreatur, I realize some of my own views may have come across as somewhat offensive to some and I apologize for that. I guess what I'm trying to say is that we, globally, should really all be speaking one language. The unity of Earth I think depends on it. If we all spoke the same language, we would be far less likely to fall prey to these kinds of divided propagandas and would be able to see things more easily through the eyes of other nationals and before too long, I believe all of our nations would unite in a harmonious blend and bring an end to all international conflict. But divided as our languages are, we are kept trapped within the frame of only the language(s) we know.

And when one learns too many to try to get around this fact, it can greatly befuddle the mind as it confuses even the thinking process after a while (from what I've observed of those who have learned upwards of 4+ languages.)

So our language alone sets us up to maintain an 'Us vs Them' mentality when in reality we are all human and we are all 'Us'. If most Americans could speak Russian, I doubt the political manipulations that created all that Communism Hostility that has been little more than a political tool to achieve the desired objectives of a few in power, would likely have failed miserably as we could've had a far greater ability to understand what the Communists believed and might've found that many of the untruths in our government's propagandas were coming from our own side (though not to say that the Russian people might not've seen through some of their own government's propaganda just as equally!)

So yes, I agree with your points though I don't feel they completely override the ones I was making either. But they are VERY good points to consider as well in the overall Language Scheme for C2C! There's a lot of unaddressed game mechanic in real world propagandas that have had a lot of impact on the flow of civilizations through time and that whole point you make there is indeed a big one that we've never really sought to address here.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Well since the world is getting smaller and smaller every day. With the internet alone everyone is connected to each other. I personally can only speak English but wish I had learned a 2nd language when I was younger. In school I took Japanese and was horrible at it yet very much enjoyed the cultural side as well as Japan's rich history.

Now with technology one can at least being the steps to understanding other languages for even though who cannot speak it. Such as with translating programs and devices. However there is much that is lost in translation that only a native speaker would know.

In short either though technology or necessity I think more and more people will be learning a second language or have technology to help them translate for them. And who knows what new language that will be invented in the future. Maybe it will become a hybrid a of a bunch of languages or even take on "leetspeak" aspects.

 

[strategyonly]

I agree, Rosetta Stone is probably the best out there currently for learning another language.

 

[ls612]

Well since the world is getting smaller and smaller every day. With the internet alone everyone is connected to each other. I personally can only speak English but wish I had learned a 2nd language when I was younger. In school I took Japanese and was horrible at it yet very much enjoyed the cultural side as well as Japan's rich history.

Now with technology one can at least being the steps to understanding other languages for even though who cannot speak it. Such as with translating programs and devices. However there is much that is lost in translation that only a native speaker would know.

In short either though technology or necessity I think more and more people will be learning a second language or have technology to help them translate for them. And who knows what new language that will be invented in the future. Maybe it will become a hybrid a of a bunch of languages or even take on "leetspeak" aspects.

The internet and information technology are quite quickly spreading English as a standard language around the world. Whether that trend will continue into the future I don't know, but I could imagine that as more people learn English it will create a positive feedback loop as people can reach more people with ideas in English and so more people learn English.

At any rate this is a tad offtopic.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

A recent study on language, as reported in a science news paper, came to the conclusion that it is natural for new languages to form so you can make yourself (your group) distinct from others. However the fastest "progress" in health, social well being and science comes about with fewer languages. Just to be contradictory science gets stuck on concepts when there is no language to describe them. Guild/profession jargon and teenagers are good examples of the need for a new language.

 

[CIVPlayer8]

Excellent discussion over Language everyone! But lets finish the Government discussion, and then we can move onto Language if you guys want.

If you are going to make Despotism the strongest government for Military (Units and building) then you should also have no Civic City Limits on it. If you do then strongest Military should be moved to one that does not have City Limits.

Well, I can't really think of a better Government candidate for "best military" than Despotism. I think I might raise the limits for them all, except the first 2, by a few. Republic and Despotism will still keep the limits, but they'll be raised.

Democracy and Republic should have their strengths switched. Democracy more cultural and Republic more commercial. I also would want to suggest having Republic's strength being rather than as can be used for anything with the sliders making any commercial government strong in any field and not just for commerce.

Good point. As someone mentioned before, Rome's "republic" didn't really include most of its citizens in the voting process. then again, neither did America's, when we first began. But the increased participation in voting in Democracy, as opposed to republic, can be reflected with . Good idea.

Rather than having all governments have a single strong point I would like to see only 4 or 5 of them "specialized" in a single field; Despotism (Military, if no City Limits on it, and ), Republic gold, Democracy culture, Totalitarianism hammers, and Technocracy science.

I'd have to disagree with you on this one, though. I rather like the idea of specialized civics. Note, just because a civic is "specialized" in one category, doesn't mean it won't have any other features about it. Despotism isn't only about military for example.

Monarchy:

Looks good to me except for one thing; if you want it to have the least maintenance then +30% to all aspects is quite a lot. I'd set the number of cities at +10%, remove the distance, and reduce Overseas to -25% instead. That way the monarchy's colonization is covered as Monarchy would be the easiest to have far-flung colonies overseas with (using the classic Governor to rule them) while keeping the larger core cities at a normal maintenance cost. For this end there should also not be any City Limits from this Government as that would be contrary to colonization and expansion.
I would, because of Knights and the idolization of them, also add increased Great General appearance.

Remember that when I list all those "Pros" and "Cons", those are the current pros/cons, not what I have planned. Also, I think adding +Great General appearance wouldn't be a good idea. I want to keep it balanced with the other civics.
Republic:

Theocracy:
I would like to see more benefits from having a State Religion and more penalties from having more religions at all. The ability to do Inquisitions should also be a part of the government I think as should the no spreading of non-State Religions.
I would love to see it slightly stronger than Monarchy in all things except City Maintenances when only having the State Religion in a city, but having that bonus reduced by every other religion present in the whole nation. Starting with +10% across the board and +20%, reduced by 5% for every other religion in the whole nation. Nearly as strong as specialized governments but in everything when having a single religion present.

Unfortunately, much of the stuff you suggested here isn't possible with current code. The only things I can work with, regarding religion in civics, is "+ Unit production", "+ building production", and "+ %". And I disagree with you on the inquisition and no non state religion spread. Theocracy doesn't represent an oppressive church, just one where it is the state. Intolerant and Divine rule are the more "oppressive" religious civics.

All in all when it comes to City Maintenances I would rather see the penalties toned down to the point where the cheapest ones have -% in city maintenances rather than less +% and instead increase Base City Maintenances to make up for the "loss" from reducing Civic City Maintenances. This is for all Civic Categories that you have increased City Maintenances for, not just Government Civics.

Yes, the lowest maintenance civics should have "- maintenance%". On average, a civic with low maintenance will have "-5/10 %", a civic with average will have "+ 5/10 %", and a civic with high maintenance will have "+ 20%".

I think that we should get rid of City Limits on Theocracy. Some of the largest empires in history (Ummayads, Abbasids) were theocracies, and I think that the limit makes it so that everyone avoids it and reduces the viable options in the midgame.

Good point! I thought about making Theocracy have the highest city limit cap, but then I said "Oh what the heck", and just removed them from theocracy.

Is it possible to change the maintenace costs from civics/ cities via game options or BUG options?

These cost-city-limits was there in vanilla, making the city spamming like in civ 3 not a valid strategie which was very good I think. I also like to have lots of cities, but being able to have 30 cities in the ancient age feels just wrong.

I think it'd be awesome if maintenance was influenced by the difficulty of the game you choose. ( I actually have no idea if they currently do , do they?)

I personally am liking where CivPlayer8 is taking things with his new proposal, so let's use that for the release of V28.

Thanks, though it wasn't my idea to post my future plans.

I agree here, his NEW proposals are ALOT better,

I had an epiphany.

Indeed. Originally interpreters was the middle and any thing before that was - that did not work out well at all so I made it so each Civic added something and if someone for whatever reason did not like using the civic category they could just stick with the Civic with no bonus or penalties.

In short please don't mess with the Civics that I made too much because they are more or less balanced due to be tweaking them. The other civics however I have not really touch or are not even made up by me. Note mine include ...

- Agriculture
- Education
- Garbage
- Immigration
- Language

I am always open to suggestions to them though.

I'll let you know when discussion on one of these categories comes up.

I really wish the civics were set up differently in this game.

In a perfect world, I would like to see a more (reverse)tree like structure to the civics. Meaning, that once you select 1 thing, it branches down, allowing you to pick more and more options as they come available, per government style.

But of course, that is prolly impossible.

Graphic representation of which I doeth speakith:
................. Monarch
................./........\.........................|
...........absolute....constitutional ....Comonwealth
.......................... /............\
................. Parlamentary.....Federal

ect, ect.

I think the way it is programed lends it's self to the problems we are having. It tends to be oblique instead of common sense.

Similar to Civilization 5, yes? Well, me personally, I have fallen in love with Civilization 4's Civic design. Your idea is pretty good though, but we have to work with what we're given.

New release for Monarchy, Republic, and Theocracy! Go check it out!

 

[Thunderbrd]

Unfortunately, much of the stuff you suggested here isn't possible with current code.

Do keep a record of all the new tags you might like for civics. I'm pretty comfortable working with civic tags now that they are so very similar in processing to traits and there could still be some very interesting crossovers between the two realms and some further inspirations for buildings as well. So please compile the ideas you've received here that you can't act on and list those off for me at some point k?

 

[lilcsg199]

Well, I can't really think of a better Government candidate for "best military" than Despotism. I think I might raise the limits for them all, except the first 2, by a few. Republic and Despotism will still keep the limits, but they'll be raised.

My opinion would be to leave out any military bonuses on the Government Civic category, or add something that more strictly favors the military more. Like say Khakistocracy.

 

[ls612]

My opinion would be to leave out any military bonuses on the Government Civic category, or add something that more strictly favors the military more. Like say Khakistocracy.

I'd say leave the military bonuses with the Military Civic category.

 

[CIVPlayer8]

Do keep a record of all the new tags you might like for civics. I'm pretty comfortable working with civic tags now that they are so very similar in processing to traits and there could still be some very interesting crossovers between the two realms and some further inspirations for buildings as well. So please compile the ideas you've received here that you can't act on and list those off for me at some point k?

Thank you Thunderbrd! This is really helpful! I'll come out with a list in a day or two.

My opinion would be to leave out any military bonuses on the Government Civic category, or add something that more strictly favors the military more. Like say Khakistocracy.

I'd say leave the military bonuses with the Military Civic category.

You guys don't like the Despotism military bonus? Hmm... What should I change it's bonus to? I want Despotism to be somewhat relevant up until Totalitarianism.

 

[ls612]

You guys don't like the Despotism military bonus? Hmm... What should I change it's bonus to? I want Despotism to be somewhat relevant up until Totalitarianism.

Repression (decreased revolt risk and more ).

 

[CIVPlayer8]

Repression (decreased revolt risk and more ).

Good idea, but how about we switch that with Totalitarianisms bonus. So Despotism gets more , but Totalitarianism gets more and decreased revolt risk, maybe even less crime.